Your thoughts on Geist 2

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
KVRian
617 posts since 8 Oct, 2019

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 am

OK, so ... I don't know. A lot of people here are saying all the time that Geist2, Strobe2 and Cypher are essentially abandonware. But is that actually true? First off, I think there are plenty of products that are perfectly usable that don't get new features and updates all the time or at all. Geist2 is still one of my absolute favourite plugins that gets used every single day. I have not had any issues and don't know of anything comparable either. That's just my experience.

But I'm not even sure why everyone is so convinced that these products are not supported anymore?

About four months ago, FXpansion announced Big Sur compatibility on all ROLI vst (which includes the synths mentioned) and that they are currently still testing their products on the new Apple M1 ARM chip (Source).

A user on recording. de wrote to their support and got this reply:

We're pleased to announce that the following products can be installed and run on macOS 11 Big Sur without any known issues:

Strobe2 (+ Strobe2 Expanders)
Cypher2 (+ Cypher2 Expanders)
Geist2 (+ Geist2 Expanders)

inMusic are currently performing tests on BFD3 and BFD Expansions to determine Big Sur compatibility, and we recommend waiting until a statement is released by inMusic regarding BFD3 compatibility before updating. You can get in touch with inMusic Support here. (1)

We are yet to complete testing of FXpansion products running on machines using the Apple M1 ARM chip. We will release a statement once testing is complete, and until then cannot guarantee compatibility with any FXpansion products running on brand new Mac devices.

If you have any questions or concerns, please reach out to our support team here. (2)

The FXpansion Team
Source.

And just a month ago, FXpansion released a public beta for Strobe 2 and Cyper. (Source)
Last edited by gondii on Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sea
KVRist
106 posts since 16 Feb, 2004 from Florida

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:05 am

I hear ya! I heard when it first came out it was “buggy”. Did the Devs fix GEIST2 where it’s solid now?

KVRian
617 posts since 8 Oct, 2019

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:07 am

I'm not sure, I never had any issues, but others did apparently. Why not just try the free demo?

Sea
KVRist
106 posts since 16 Feb, 2004 from Florida

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:09 am

Effectsworks wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:47 am
vertibration wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:44 am
Its not really dead, it had a recent update I believe.
Sorry, I mean metaphorically dying... Maintenance update I presume? I could be wrong of course but there's no chat about it on the forums or any news from the dev.
I hear ya! I heard when it first came out it was “buggy”. Did the Devs fix GEIST2 where it’s solid now?

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KVRAF
18486 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:15 am

gondii wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:57 am
OK, so ... I don't know. A lot of people here are saying all the time that Geist2, Strobe2 and Cypher are essentially abandonware. But is that actually true? First off, I think there are plenty of products that are perfectly usable that don't get new features and updates all the time or at all. Geist2 is still one of my absolute favourite plugins that gets used every single day. I have not had any issues and don't know of anything comparable either.

But I'm not even sure why everyone is so convinced that these products are not supported anymore?
I think Cypher and Strobe are still fully supported.

Geist I am not sure about. It has languished for a long time. It does get maintenance updates. I don't think it needs new features, but it could use some TLC and refinements to existing features for workflow and there are various little issues that could be addressed. It feels like a very low priority for Roli. I would not be surprised if it was discontinued.

IMO, Geist is hands down the best software drum machine available today.

We will see if Geist gets native Apple Silicon support. If so, I will install it again when I get a new Apple Silicon Mac.

KVRAF
8281 posts since 16 Aug, 2006

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:23 am

If it were to get Apple silicon support as part of a future maintenance update, then nothing else, I'd be happy.

That said, I think there could be a way for Roli to MPE-ify Geist in order to make it work really well with Blocks and the Seaboards. Example: things like tuned percussion based on press, or FX based on release velocity. For those reasons, I hope Geist isn't dead and gets an MPE update to make it work with the Roli brand.

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KVRist
261 posts since 17 Sep, 2020

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:29 am

Sea wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:09 am
I hear ya! I heard when it first came out it was “buggy”. Did the Devs fix GEIST2 where it’s solid now?
Well... It's been pretty solid for me. I'm on a mac and use Nuendo and Studio One.

KVRist
176 posts since 6 Jun, 2003

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:36 am

Sea wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:05 am
I hear ya! I heard when it first came out it was “buggy”. Did the Devs fix GEIST2 where it’s solid now?
If you use it for basic functions and don't scratch the surface too much it's reasonably stable. In my first few days of using it I didn't understand much of the fuss about stability. As soon as I started digging into it more and using it beyond something like I would use Battery for it crashes... a lot.

It's pretty disappointing and frustrating in that regard. You're just getting into something, go to edit and *POOF*... it crashes. I got it very inexpensive on a sale, but I can see see what people were talking about now. The last update was over a year ago, so I don't have much faith in things getting fixed. I tried using it for a few weeks, but haven't gone back to it which sad, because it has so much potential and is very deep (more so than I can bring to potential).

Maybe if Roli folds FXpansion can be brought back to life by going independent again or sold to someone who's interested in realizing what it could be.

Sea
KVRist
106 posts since 16 Feb, 2004 from Florida

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:57 am

sl1200mk2 wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:36 am
Sea wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:05 am
I hear ya! I heard when it first came out it was “buggy”. Did the Devs fix GEIST2 where it’s solid now?
If you use it for basic functions and don't scratch the surface too much it's reasonably stable. In my first few days of using it I didn't understand much of the fuss about stability. As soon as I started digging into it more and using it beyond something like I would use Battery for it crashes... a lot.

It's pretty disappointing and frustrating in that regard. You're just getting into something, go to edit and *POOF*... it crashes. I got it very inexpensive on a sale, but I can see see what people were talking about now. The last update was over a year ago, so I don't have much faith in things getting fixed. I tried using it for a few weeks, but haven't gone back to it which sad, because it has so much potential and is very deep (more so than I can bring to potential).

Maybe if Roli folds FXpansion can be brought back to life by going independent again or sold to someone who's interested in realizing what it could be.
So it’s still buggy... even with the latest updates?

I would use if for creating patterns and then placing them in song mode in Reaper. I also would like to sample grooves into the pads like “Intro, verse, fill 1, chorus, bridge, fill 2. Fill 3, ending,” stuff like that, and have them assigned to pads that I can trigger when and wherever I want in Reaper to create a song with my midi keyboard.

KVRAF
8281 posts since 16 Aug, 2006

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:56 am

Just give it a good demo and see for yourself. I don't find it buggy but my system, workflow, and needs will be different than yours.

KVRist
176 posts since 6 Jun, 2003

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 9:35 am

Sea wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:57 am
So it’s still buggy... even with the latest updates?
In my experience, yes. I specifically bought it for the sampling/recording functionality and get crashes with that when editing among other things. Try the demo and see if it works well for you... people have different experiences based on workflow. Others have expressed that it works well enough for them, but for me it hasn't at least in how I was trying to use it.

KVRist
418 posts since 11 Nov, 2010 from ny

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:25 pm

Effectsworks wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:47 am
vertibration wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:44 am
Its not really dead, it had a recent update I believe.
Sorry, I mean metaphorically dying... Maintenance update I presume? I could be wrong of course but there's no chat about it on the forums or any news from the dev.
What do you want them to do with it? As long as they are maintaining it, that's all that matters.

KVRAF
4314 posts since 21 Sep, 2005

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:27 pm

Maybe soon, people are going to start joining the dots with this company.

They go all the way back to native stuff included with Steinberg Cubase. They broke several 'barriers'. They provided several 'firsts'.

They happened to have probably two of the most talented DSP programmers in the business, one of whom, who went off on his own journey and formed Cytomic.

They always led on the bleeding edge of design. They still do. I don't like it any more than you. But lots of others do who use the tech they design, still leading the field.

Are they pricks for charging 50 bucks for a transfer? f**k yeah! But at least they are honest pricks. They don't pretend to be your friend. They don't engage in dishonest marketing - this is all my personal opinion so take it with a grain of salt - you know where you stand with them.

It sucks big hairy balls to be left with software by them that you can't really sell because of extortionate transfer fees.

FXpansion are off on the next thing. They don't really care about you, in case that hasn't been blatantly obvious the last ten f**king years!

What a dream it would be to have Geist, Tremor, BFD et al all brought up to date in one super duper fantastic shell. But wait! What's that sound? It's called 'reality'! The reason those things haven't really been brought right up to date is because they were always on the cutting edge to start with. There's no where to go for them. It's seriously economically unviable for them to even attempt that. In short, they bled out to the edge so much, there really was no edge left. And that is where you and them parted company. Me too. And it is sad. I would have loved to have seen them take it all to greater hights.

I'm probably talking shit here. I'm no oracle. I don't claim to be any authority. But all the bad feelings seem to stem from the fact they don't allow license transfers at a reasonable rate. That and the fact they didn't update Tremor/Geist with the latest feature most commonly requested. Both of which they are undeniably guilty of.

The whole thing is in a state of upheaval and major change. It was ever thus. It's just more focal now, and a whole lot more people who bought in to this product are super-pissed-off.

I guess at some point you need to cut off from the negativity, even if that negativity is well-earned.

FXpansion are at the very forefront of this game. They were leading it all those years ago, and their position has not changed.

People talk about 'technical debt'. And they have a certain understanding of the meaning. But really, this is another form of 'technical debt' that we all owe to the leaders in the field who take us all to higher levels with their experience and research in the field.

But yeah, soon those FXpansion boys and girls are going to have to provide. They are under massive pressure. Such is life on the bleeding edge. They will become heroes or villains.

User avatar
KVRist
261 posts since 17 Sep, 2020

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:26 pm

vertibration wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:25 pm
What do you want them to do with it? As long as they are maintaining it, that's all that matters.
What I want? Is some new information about the Geist product line. Are they going to drop it, like Tremor, Maul and Bloom?

It's not rocket science baby. :lol:

Sea
KVRist
106 posts since 16 Feb, 2004 from Florida

Post Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:30 pm

Effectsworks wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 3:26 pm
vertibration wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 1:25 pm
What do you want them to do with it? As long as they are maintaining it, that's all that matters.
What I want? Is some new information about the Geist product line. Are they going to drop it, like Tremor, Maul and Bloom?

It's not rocket science baby. :lol:
You’d think ROLI wouldn’t drop it but hopefully improve it. I don’t know why FXpansion sold out. Perhaps their sales were down.

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