Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
User avatar
fisherKing
KVRAF
1750 posts since 6 Aug, 2009

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:10 pm

wagtunes wrote: Some of us either don't have the money to hire singers, don't want to work with people in the first place, can't sing themselves and have no friends willing to live with them to do all their songs. Some of us, like myself, would do anything short of killing or stealing to get a vocal synth that can sound like a Bruce Springsteen with all the grit and dirt that's in his voice or a Celine Dione with those powerful vocal chords and lungs.
you 'don't want to work with people'? because you can go online, find singers everywhere (forums, sites for music networking, craigslist, soundcloud, etc etc). otherwise, what's the point of making vocal music, if not to feature a vocalist?

am not attacking you, am just trying to understand what the end goal is. otherwise, why not just make instrumental music?
always one plugin short of perfection...

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14899 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:48 pm

fisherKing wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Some of us either don't have the money to hire singers, don't want to work with people in the first place, can't sing themselves and have no friends willing to live with them to do all their songs. Some of us, like myself, would do anything short of killing or stealing to get a vocal synth that can sound like a Bruce Springsteen with all the grit and dirt that's in his voice or a Celine Dione with those powerful vocal chords and lungs.
you 'don't want to work with people'? because you can go online, find singers everywhere (forums, sites for music networking, craigslist, soundcloud, etc etc). otherwise, what's the point of making vocal music, if not to feature a vocalist?

am not attacking you, am just trying to understand what the end goal is. otherwise, why not just make instrumental music?
The end goal is to make vocal music that sounds like real people without having to actually work with real people. I just want to work on my own. That's the end goal.

Scotty
KVRAF
1725 posts since 23 Dec, 2002

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:02 pm

You could say the same thing about any instrument that is represented in software... why not hire a real drummer...why use a drum machine, why not use a real violin? Why did you use a shaker loop... hire a percussionist. You want to make instrumental music but you don't want to work with instrumentalists?

Many modern musicians like to use state of the art tools... they like to bend and twist them. The best of us will somehow make art and create fantastic expression. Most of us will try and fail. T'was ever thus. But we don't need to justify why or how we'll use the software tools at our disposal.


wagtunes wrote:
fisherKing wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Some of us either don't have the money to hire singers, don't want to work with people in the first place, can't sing themselves and have no friends willing to live with them to do all their songs. Some of us, like myself, would do anything short of killing or stealing to get a vocal synth that can sound like a Bruce Springsteen with all the grit and dirt that's in his voice or a Celine Dione with those powerful vocal chords and lungs.
you 'don't want to work with people'? because you can go online, find singers everywhere (forums, sites for music networking, craigslist, soundcloud, etc etc). otherwise, what's the point of making vocal music, if not to feature a vocalist?

am not attacking you, am just trying to understand what the end goal is. otherwise, why not just make instrumental music?
The end goal is to make vocal music that sounds like real people without having to actually work with real people. I just want to work on my own. That's the end goal.
Asusp9712Core,RayDats,OASYSPCI,Cubase9,KorgLeg,Avalon737s+2022,UA4710D,6176,DCS,LA610MK2s,Neve, ARC2, Soundtoys,UADOCTO,AdamA7X, SphereMics, BCF+R2000s, DrmBrut,MiniLog,Volcas,MoogSubPhat,EnsqDP4,VirusC,Scope,MinBrut,Plugiator,NIS61 Ultimate,ComposrsCld.

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14899 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:19 pm

Scotty wrote:You could say the same thing about any instrument that is represented in software... why not hire a real drummer...why use a drum machine, why not use a real violin? Why did you use a shaker loop... hire a percussionist. You want to make instrumental music but you don't want to work with instrumentalists?

Many modern musicians like to use state of the art tools... they like to bend and twist them. The best of us will somehow make art and create fantastic expression. Most of us will try and fail. T'was ever thus. But we don't need to justify why or how we'll use the software tools at our disposal.


wagtunes wrote:
fisherKing wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Some of us either don't have the money to hire singers, don't want to work with people in the first place, can't sing themselves and have no friends willing to live with them to do all their songs. Some of us, like myself, would do anything short of killing or stealing to get a vocal synth that can sound like a Bruce Springsteen with all the grit and dirt that's in his voice or a Celine Dione with those powerful vocal chords and lungs.
you 'don't want to work with people'? because you can go online, find singers everywhere (forums, sites for music networking, craigslist, soundcloud, etc etc). otherwise, what's the point of making vocal music, if not to feature a vocalist?

am not attacking you, am just trying to understand what the end goal is. otherwise, why not just make instrumental music?
The end goal is to make vocal music that sounds like real people without having to actually work with real people. I just want to work on my own. That's the end goal.
Thanks. Somebody gets it.

User avatar
fisherKing
KVRAF
1750 posts since 6 Aug, 2009

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:23 pm

Scotty wrote:You could say the same thing about any instrument that is represented in software... why not hire a real drummer...why use a drum machine, why not use a real violin? Why did you use a shaker loop... hire a percussionist. You want to make instrumental music but you don't want to work with instrumentalists?

Many modern musicians like to use state of the art tools... they like to bend and twist them. The best of us will somehow make art and create fantastic expression. Most of us will try and fail. T'was ever thus. But we don't need to justify why or how we'll use the software tools at our disposal.
i like making beats, basslines. keyboard parts... flute lines. whatever. but some things (violin solos, lead vocals... a sax solo), are just really difficult to emulate; they depend on subtle nuances to make their point.

but honestly, i don't care how someone gets to the end result; a song moves me, or doesn't. if the big picture doesn't work, who cares if a guitar part, or any part, is 'real' or not? not me... :D
always one plugin short of perfection...

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14899 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:27 pm

fisherKing wrote:
Scotty wrote:You could say the same thing about any instrument that is represented in software... why not hire a real drummer...why use a drum machine, why not use a real violin? Why did you use a shaker loop... hire a percussionist. You want to make instrumental music but you don't want to work with instrumentalists?

Many modern musicians like to use state of the art tools... they like to bend and twist them. The best of us will somehow make art and create fantastic expression. Most of us will try and fail. T'was ever thus. But we don't need to justify why or how we'll use the software tools at our disposal.
i like making beats, basslines. keyboard parts... flute lines. whatever. but some things (violin solos, lead vocals... a sax solo), are just really difficult to emulate; they depend on subtle nuances to make their point.

but honestly, i don't care how someone gets to the end result; a song moves me, or doesn't. if the big picture doesn't work, who cares if a guitar part, or any part, is 'real' or not? not me... :D
Of course some things are harder to emulate than others. You're stating the obvious. So what's your point?

I want a vocal synth that is indistinguishable from a real human being but you seem to have a problem with that, otherwise why ask me the question you asked me?

So yes, you DO seem to care how a person gets to where they get, at least when it comes to emulating the human voice.

Scotty
KVRAF
1725 posts since 23 Dec, 2002

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:32 pm

Fair enough. I think we are on the same page. I had a moment of great humility a few years ago. I was genuinely getting sick of hearing those hard tuning effects made with autotune and similar plugins and really was lamenting the lack of humanity in the vocals which sounded like they were unnaturally on rails.

Then I heard a Bon Iver album that used those effects and many others processors which sounded cliche in the hands of other artists. Somehow his tracks were incredibly moving to my ears. It was a great blend of layering, emotive vocals and synthesized effects to create atmosphere. I guess this is why Bon Iver wins Grammys. Frank Ocean and others also make great use of vocoders and other autotune like effects and tell amazing stories.

All is good and no doubt someone will do something amazing with EmVoice and push it in ways it wasn't intended. Have a great night and thanks for engaging here. - Scotty
Asusp9712Core,RayDats,OASYSPCI,Cubase9,KorgLeg,Avalon737s+2022,UA4710D,6176,DCS,LA610MK2s,Neve, ARC2, Soundtoys,UADOCTO,AdamA7X, SphereMics, BCF+R2000s, DrmBrut,MiniLog,Volcas,MoogSubPhat,EnsqDP4,VirusC,Scope,MinBrut,Plugiator,NIS61 Ultimate,ComposrsCld.

User avatar
fisherKing
KVRAF
1750 posts since 6 Aug, 2009

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 5:05 pm

wagtunes wrote: Of course some things are harder to emulate than others. You're stating the obvious. So what's your point?

I want a vocal synth that is indistinguishable from a real human being but you seem to have a problem with that, otherwise why ask me the question you asked me?

So yes, you DO seem to care how a person gets to where they get, at least when it comes to emulating the human voice.
are you talking to me or scotty? am just pointing out that a flute solo, or a picked guitar, for example, are easy to emulate. a good lead vocal, a sax solo... much harder. that IS my point.

i have no problem with your wanting a 'perfect' vocal simulation, am just pointing out that we're not there yet.

so, again, whatever you (or anyone) choses to do to make their music... more power to them. just make something great, and the sum will equal more than the parts. have a good night!
always one plugin short of perfection...

User avatar
NoirSuede
KVRist
47 posts since 20 Jul, 2016 from Tangerang, Indonesia

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:09 pm

fisherKing wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Some of us either don't have the money to hire singers, don't want to work with people in the first place, can't sing themselves and have no friends willing to live with them to do all their songs. Some of us, like myself, would do anything short of killing or stealing to get a vocal synth that can sound like a Bruce Springsteen with all the grit and dirt that's in his voice or a Celine Dione with those powerful vocal chords and lungs.
you 'don't want to work with people'? because you can go online, find singers everywhere (forums, sites for music networking, craigslist, soundcloud, etc etc). otherwise, what's the point of making vocal music, if not to feature a vocalist?

am not attacking you, am just trying to understand what the end goal is. otherwise, why not just make instrumental music?
Well what if the voice they want is of a singer who can't speak English? And some people are just too shy to talk to other vocalists it's why most of the Vocaloid userbase are socially awkward teenagers.

User avatar
rodyy
KVRist
40 posts since 9 Mar, 2015 from Bangkok

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:43 am

Scotty wrote:Then I heard a Bon Iver album that used those effects and many others processors which sounded cliche in the hands of other artists. Somehow his tracks were incredibly moving to my ears. It was a great blend of layering, emotive vocals and synthesized effects to create atmosphere. I guess this is why Bon Iver wins Grammys. Frank Ocean and others also make great use of vocoders and other autotune like effects and tell amazing stories.

All is good and no doubt someone will do something amazing with EmVoice and push it in ways it wasn't intended. Have a great night and thanks for engaging here. - Scotty
Agreed, we're just putting a new tool in the hands of producers and it's impossible to predict what they will do with it. Talking about processed vocals, you can actually get interesting results by tweaking the parameters of our engine (not available yet in the plugin, but it's planned). One of the cool things is that you can alter the formants radically with none of the artifacts that usually come from formant shifters:
https://clyp.it/fw4hweth
https://clyp.it/xx1nki00
The range is shifted by the same amount as the formants, so "Big Lucy" goes quite low (much lower than this actually, depending on the settings)
https://clyp.it/y5pimqre
https://clyp.it/2ovycqs1

You can also create things that are hard to qualify like this :)
LucyBorg?
https://clyp.it/bhkbt3qe
https://clyp.it/crnghzch

And we're preparing a snap-to-pitch mode (similar to autotune), and a "native vocoder" that you can use just as easily as Lucy, in solo or to double her. So, while the focus will remain on producing natural-sounding voices, there will be endless possibilities of layering from the start, without any additional processing required.
Express Yourself.

bitman
KVRist
147 posts since 18 Aug, 2008

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:44 am

Big Lucy! - Alright, a guy!

It's about time. We have Alexa, Cortana?, Siri , Lucy and a host of vocalloid bots but no Steves.

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14899 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:54 am

bitman wrote:Big Lucy! - Alright, a guy!

It's about time. We have Alexa, Cortana?, Siri , Lucy and a host of vocalloid bots but no Steves.
Vocaloid has quite a few male vocalists

Dex
Cyber Songman
YOHIO

bitman
KVRist
147 posts since 18 Aug, 2008

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:57 am

I didn't know that.

User avatar
NoirSuede
KVRist
47 posts since 20 Jul, 2016 from Tangerang, Indonesia

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:41 am

wagtunes wrote:
bitman wrote:Big Lucy! - Alright, a guy!

It's about time. We have Alexa, Cortana?, Siri , Lucy and a host of vocalloid bots but no Steves.
Vocaloid has quite a few male vocalists

Dex
Cyber Songman
YOHIO
Don't forget KAITO!

unfortunately those are the only 4 voices still useable in V5, the Vocaloid userbase has this odd prejudice against males and old people for some reason.

bitman
KVRist
147 posts since 18 Aug, 2008

Re: Emvoice One Beta - new vocal synth

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:45 am

All of society does.
Whatygonna do.

Return to “Instruments”