Buy Omnisphere 2

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
noiseboyuk
KVRAF
2554 posts since 25 Jan, 2007

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:48 am

Same old same old same old.

The price is invariably compared a la apples and oranges. Is it like the entire V collection? No, because it also has a 60gb sample library for one thing, it covers a far greater range of synths but without attempting to be a recreation of any. Is it like Kontakt? No, because Kontakt is not a synth, and doesn't cover anything like the same ground as the factory library either. You need bread and butter samples and a great host for other libraries? Buy Kontakt. You need a rich variety of synthesis and hybrid organic sounds? That's Omni.

It has always been true that if all you are interested in is analog synthesis and nothing else, Omni isn't a great buy. Ditto an EDM synth. Ditto a workstation. Ye olde burning piano canard always misses the point - nobody, ever, has ever said "what I really need in my new track is a burning piano". The more esoteric soundsources are primarily interesting textured fuel for different kinds of sounds. For example, as I type "Burning Piano" into Omni, the first search result returned is for Ashes, a lovely - and highly useable - evolving dreamlike pad.

As has been said a gazillion times, the people who get the most out of Omni are those who use it for a broad range of things, but not in the sense of a workstation.
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neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:19 am

fmr wrote:
neverenoughfunk wrote: every thread when someone is debating if they want to purchase Omnisphere or not... and when the answer is NO... the burning piano always comes up... which is 1/12,000 of the sounds in Omnisphere...

that is my point...

you take care now too...
I think the main problem is the 500 USD price tag, not the burning piano :wink: 500 USD is what really "burns" there... so much so as to cave a hole in buyers pockets. :scared:

Dollar for dollar, you get much more with Kontakt (or HALion or Falcon). IMO, of course :tu:
whether hobby or professional... it cost to make music... the avg music maker who have been making music for a while has 1000s of dollars worth of software on their machine... and there is also 1000s of dollars worth of software on that same machine they do not use... i.e. i have Omnisphere, Stylus RMX, Trillian, Keyscape, Komplete Ultimate, Sample 3, Halion Sonic 2, SWAM alto, soprano, tenor, baritone, etc... do i use all that software NO!!! but individuals that have been at this for a while owns a ton of sh!t...

therefore, if the price tag is a bit much why use the burning piano as an excuse... i.e. i "aint" spending $500 on a synth...

plus, Omnisphere is not a "must have" but a "nice to have"... if price is a concern... why not look at things one can afford... right?

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:54 am

neverenoughfunk wrote:
fmr wrote:
neverenoughfunk wrote: every thread when someone is debating if they want to purchase Omnisphere or not... and when the answer is NO... the burning piano always comes up... which is 1/12,000 of the sounds in Omnisphere...

that is my point...

you take care now too...
I think the main problem is the 500 USD price tag, not the burning piano :wink: 500 USD is what really "burns" there... so much so as to cave a hole in buyers pockets. :scared:

Dollar for dollar, you get much more with Kontakt (or HALion or Falcon). IMO, of course :tu:
whether hobby or professional... it cost to make music... the avg music maker who have been making music for a while has 1000s of dollars worth of software on there machine... and there is also 1000s of dollars worth of software on that same machine they do not use... i.e. i have Omnisphere, Stylus RMX, Trillian, Keyscape, Komplete Ultimate, Sample 3, Halion Sonic 2, SWAM alto, soprano, tenor, baritone, etc... do i use all that software NO!!! but individuals that have been at this for a while owns a ton of sh!t...

therefore, if the price tag is a bit much why use the burning piano as an excuse... i.e. i "aint" spending $500 on a synth...

plus, Omnisphere is not a "must have" but a "nice to have"... if price is a concern... why not look at things one can afford... right?
I didn't put the phrase in terms "things one can afford", I put it in terms of "bang for the buck". You said it yourself - you have "Omnisphere, Stylus RMX, Trillian, Keyscape". Either than that, you have HALion Sonic (not even HALion), and little else. You are clearly biased towards Spectrasonics :shrug:

Kontakt is a synth too. Not as complete as Omnisphere, but it works as a synth, in some manners.

Falcon and HALion are way superior to Omnisphere in in terms of synthesis IMO, broadly speaking, yet both are cheaper. Again... bang for the buck

Is Omnisphere "nice to have"? It certainly is. But life is made of options, and price/performance ratio of Omnisynth is poor, when compared to the above mentioned ones. No matter how many GB it comes with - most of them will be just wasted space in the hard-drive. If those GB are so valuable, why doesn't Spectrasonics sell a version without the library (just the synth), or with just a small library (just to show the synth engine, in the way of Falcon) for a "normal" instrument price?
Last edited by fmr on Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:06 am

noiseboyuk wrote: The price is invariably compared a la apples and oranges. Is it like the entire V collection? No, because it also has a 60gb sample library for one thing, it covers a far greater range of synths but without attempting to be a recreation of any.
Far greater range of synths than V Collection? :lol: You're a joker.
noiseboyuk wrote: Is it like Kontakt? No, because Kontakt is not a synth, and doesn't cover anything like the same ground as the factory library either. You need bread and butter samples and a great host for other libraries? Buy Kontakt. You need a rich variety of synthesis and hybrid organic sounds? That's Omni.
Kontakt "can be" regarded as a synth, within some limits, too. And strictly as a synth, Omni is not that great either. Certainly not comparable to Falcon and/or HALion.

Tell me - of the 12.000 presets someone quoted here, how many are pure synthesis (EG - do NOT use samples at all)?
Fernando (FMR)

neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:16 am

fmr wrote: You said it yourself - you have "Omnisphere, Stylus RMX, Trillian, Keyscape". Either than that, you have HALion Sonic (not even HALion). You are clearly biased towards Spectrasonics :shrug:
please take my whole text in context... i owned Reaktor when it came with a dongle...distributed by Steinberg... along with Model_E (i forgot the other first vst Steinberg came out with... own that too) i also own East West Composer Bundle, lounge lizard, Diminsion Pro, Reason w/rack extensions... Ableton Live and their sh!t... like i said... for those who have been making music for a while OWNS at ton of sh!t...

i started out with Steinberg... i.e. cubase 3.5 (with the red dongle) and brought all of their sh!t... then there was Native Instruments and brought all their sh!t... then i learned about EAST WEST brought Composer Bundle... the list goes on and on...

so when you talk of being biased... i think you are WRONG...

i am talking from experience...

p.s. Specstrasonic do make quality products... i know because i could do a side by side comparison with a ton sh!t...

neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:23 am

fmr wrote: Tell me - of the 12.000 presets someone quoted here, how many are pure synthesis (EG - do NOT use samples at all)?
to answer your question... those 12,000 preset are different colors...

you never know where inspiration comes from... maybe just maybe one of those 12,000 preset/different colors will be the inspiration...

it is like the lotto... you have to play it to win it...

right?

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quantum7
KVRian
904 posts since 31 Dec, 2006 from the hills above beautiful Boise, Idaho

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:33 am

There are 3 software instruments that I couldn’t fathom being without, and Omnisphere 2 is definitely one of them. :tu:

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fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:51 am

neverenoughfunk wrote: p.s. Specstrasonic do make quality products... i know because i could do a side by side comparison with a ton sh!t...
Again, I never said the opposite. I said that the price/performance ratio is poor :roll:
Fernando (FMR)

noiseboyuk
KVRAF
2554 posts since 25 Jan, 2007

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:51 am

fmr wrote:
noiseboyuk wrote: The price is invariably compared a la apples and oranges. Is it like the entire V collection? No, because it also has a 60gb sample library for one thing, it covers a far greater range of synths but without attempting to be a recreation of any.
Far greater range of synths than V Collection? :lol: You're a joker.
noiseboyuk wrote: Is it like Kontakt? No, because Kontakt is not a synth, and doesn't cover anything like the same ground as the factory library either. You need bread and butter samples and a great host for other libraries? Buy Kontakt. You need a rich variety of synthesis and hybrid organic sounds? That's Omni.
Kontakt "can be" regarded as a synth, within some limits, too. And strictly as a synth, Omni is not that great either. Certainly not comparable to Falcon and/or HALion.

Tell me - of the 12.000 presets someone quoted here, how many are pure synthesis (EG - do NOT use samples at all)?
Hardware used for soundsources -

Access Virus Indigo, Logan Strings, Roland D-50, Access Virus A, Mattel Optigan, Roland JP-8000, Access Virus B, Mellotron, Roland JV-90, Access Virus C, Hans Zimmer Custom Moog Modular, Roland JV-1080, Akai AX-80, Moog 55 Modular, Roland JV-2080, Akai-S-612 sampler, Moog Minimoog (Studio Electronics), Roland JP-8080, Akai S-900 sampler, Korg Prophecy, Roland JX-10, Kurzweil K-2000, Roland JD-800, Kurwzeil K-2500, Roland JD-990, Nord Lead, Roland JP-8000, Akai S-1000 sampler, Oberheim 4-voice SEM, Roland Paraphonic 505, Akai S-6000 sampler, Oberheim OBXA, Roland RS-09, ARP String Ensemble, Oberheim OB8, Roland SH-2000, Casio VL-Tone, Oberheim S.E.Ms, Roland VP-330 Vocoder, Chamberlin Tape sampler, Oberheim Xpander, Roland XV-5080, Commodore 64, Polyfusion Modular Synth, Sequential Circuits Prophet 5, Doepfer modular, PPG Wave 2.2, Sequential Circuits Prophet VS, EDP Wasp Deluxe, Roland Jupiter 8, Sequential Circuits Pro One, Elka String Machine, Roland Jupiter 4, Studio Electronics Omega 8, Emu Modular (Custom), Roland Juno 60, Suzuki Omnichord, Ensoniq Mirage, Roland MKS-80 Super Jupiter, Vako Orchestron, Fairlight CMI, Roland MKS-70 Super JX, Vox Continental, Farfisa Organ, Roland MKS-50 Alpha Juno, Waldorf Q, Fender Rhodes, Roland Modular System 700, Waldorf Wave, Hammond B-3/C-3 Organs, Roland Modular System 100m, Waldorf Microwave, Kawai K-5000 additive synth, Custom Modular Synths, Waldorf Microwave XT, Korg EX-8000, Roland TB-303, Yamaha CS-01, Korg M1-REX, Roland S-760 samplers, Yamaha CS-80, Korg Monopoly, Roland S-770 sampler, Yamaha DX-7, Korg Z1 EVL, Roland JX-3P, Yamaha TX-816

Software instruments used for soundsources

Metasynth, Cycling '74 Shape Synth, REFX QuadraSID, Rhizomatic Absynth, Kantos, REFX PlastiCZ, Logic Sculpture, Kyma, Rumpelrausch Taips ZR1, Logic EXS24, Native Instruments Absynth, Steinberg Model E, Logic ES-2, Native Instruments B-4, Waldorf Attack, Propellerheads Maelstrom, Native Instruments Pro-52, Waldorf PPG 2.V, Audioease thOnk, Native Instruments Reaktor, Bitheadz Unity DS-1, Audionerdz Delay Lama, reFX JunoX2, Cycling '74 PGS-1, REFX Vanguard

Wavetables

ARP 2600, Novation Bass station II, Roland JP-8, Roland JP-8000, Roland Juno 60, Roland Juno 106, Roland JX-3P, Roland TB 3030, Roland System 8, Little Phatty, MiniMoog, Korg Mono/Poly, Moog Modular, Korg MS20, Oberheim OB6, Oberheim OB8, Oberheim SEM, Oberheim OBX, ARP Odyssey, Sequential Circuits Prophet 5, Sequential Circuits Prophet 6, Sequential Circuits Rev2, Roland SH-101, Roland SE-02, Moog Sub Phatty, Dave Smith Tetra, Access Virus, Arturia Minibrute, Moog Voyager, EDP Wasp, OSC OSCar (and many other sources)

So, um yeah. A "far greater range of synths" than the V collection seems a fair comment, even though - as I said - it doesn't attempt to recreate them. Oh, and don't forget we have 20 (more now I believe) different analogue synths hardware profiled.

(now having settled that, we can have the equally fun debate about how often Arturia faithfully recreates their hardware anyway).

I've had to look up this question about how many patches are pure synthesis, but hey I'm bored so... currently I count 1,100 patches in Omni, but there's another 1,000 due in the 2.5 update alone that will all be pure synthesis. If I include Trilian, the Moog expansion and 3rd party libs, currently I have about 3,300 pure synthesis patches (and then this additional 1,000). Note that doesn't include any patches that use samples of synths.

Hope all that helps.

(incidentally, the quoted figure of 12,000 patches isn't actually accurate, it's over 12,000 sounds, which is a bit naughty as it includes Soundsources and mulits, and I don't think Spectrasonics should describe it as such as it looks misleading. In 2.4, its currently a mere 7,500 patches, 8,500 in 2.5.)
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User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:56 am

neverenoughfunk wrote: i owned Reaktor when it came with a dongle...distributed by Steinberg...
Reaktor never came with a dongle, nor was it ever distributed by Steinberg. You are confusing it with something else. I know, I have it since day 1 (I started still with Generator). I became a fan of Native Instruments since then, and I remain.

If I remember well, Reaktor protection was CD based back then, coupled with serial number.
Last edited by fmr on Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:01 am

noiseboyuk wrote:
fmr wrote:
noiseboyuk wrote: The price is invariably compared a la apples and oranges. Is it like the entire V collection? No, because it also has a 60gb sample library for one thing, it covers a far greater range of synths but without attempting to be a recreation of any.
Far greater range of synths than V Collection? :lol: You're a joker.
Hardware used for soundsources -

Access Virus Indigo, Logan Strings, Roland D-50, Access Virus A, Mattel Optigan, Roland JP-8000, Access Virus B, Mellotron, Roland JV-90, Access Virus C, Hans Zimmer Custom Moog Modular, Roland JV-1080, Akai AX-80, Moog 55 Modular, Roland JV-2080, Akai-S-612 sampler, Moog Minimoog (Studio Electronics), Roland JP-8080, Akai S-900 sampler, Korg Prophecy, Roland JX-10, Kurzweil K-2000, Roland JD-800, Kurwzeil K-2500, Roland JD-990, Nord Lead, Roland JP-8000, Akai S-1000 sampler, Oberheim 4-voice SEM, Roland Paraphonic 505, Akai S-6000 sampler, Oberheim OBXA, Roland RS-09, ARP String Ensemble, Oberheim OB8, Roland SH-2000, Casio VL-Tone, Oberheim S.E.Ms, Roland VP-330 Vocoder, Chamberlin Tape sampler, Oberheim Xpander, Roland XV-5080, Commodore 64, Polyfusion Modular Synth, Sequential Circuits Prophet 5, Doepfer modular, PPG Wave 2.2, Sequential Circuits Prophet VS, EDP Wasp Deluxe, Roland Jupiter 8, Sequential Circuits Pro One, Elka String Machine, Roland Jupiter 4, Studio Electronics Omega 8, Emu Modular (Custom), Roland Juno 60, Suzuki Omnichord, Ensoniq Mirage, Roland MKS-80 Super Jupiter, Vako Orchestron, Fairlight CMI, Roland MKS-70 Super JX, Vox Continental, Farfisa Organ, Roland MKS-50 Alpha Juno, Waldorf Q, Fender Rhodes, Roland Modular System 700, Waldorf Wave, Hammond B-3/C-3 Organs, Roland Modular System 100m, Waldorf Microwave, Kawai K-5000 additive synth, Custom Modular Synths, Waldorf Microwave XT, Korg EX-8000, Roland TB-303, Yamaha CS-01, Korg M1-REX, Roland S-760 samplers, Yamaha CS-80, Korg Monopoly, Roland S-770 sampler, Yamaha DX-7, Korg Z1 EVL, Roland JX-3P, Yamaha TX-816

Software instruments used for soundsources

Metasynth, Cycling '74 Shape Synth, REFX QuadraSID, Rhizomatic Absynth, Kantos, REFX PlastiCZ, Logic Sculpture, Kyma, Rumpelrausch Taips ZR1, Logic EXS24, Native Instruments Absynth, Steinberg Model E, Logic ES-2, Native Instruments B-4, Waldorf Attack, Propellerheads Maelstrom, Native Instruments Pro-52, Waldorf PPG 2.V, Audioease thOnk, Native Instruments Reaktor, Bitheadz Unity DS-1, Audionerdz Delay Lama, reFX JunoX2, Cycling '74 PGS-1, REFX Vanguard

Wavetables

ARP 2600, Novation Bass station II, Roland JP-8, Roland JP-8000, Roland Juno 60, Roland Juno 106, Roland JX-3P, Roland TB 3030, Roland System 8, Little Phatty, MiniMoog, Korg Mono/Poly, Moog Modular, Korg MS20, Oberheim OB6, Oberheim OB8, Oberheim SEM, Oberheim OBX, ARP Odyssey, Sequential Circuits Prophet 5, Sequential Circuits Prophet 6, Sequential Circuits Rev2, Roland SH-101, Roland SE-02, Moog Sub Phatty, Dave Smith Tetra, Access Virus, Arturia Minibrute, Moog Voyager, EDP Wasp, OSC OSCar (and many other sources)

So, um yeah. A "far greater range of synths" than the V collection seems a fair comment, even though - as I said - it doesn't attempt to recreate them. Oh, and don't forget we have 20 (more now I believe) different analogue synths hardware profiled.

(now having settled that, we can have the equally fun debate about how often Arturia faithfully recreates their hardware anyway).

I've had to look up this question about how many patches are pure synthesis, but hey I'm bored so... currently I count 1,100 patches in Omni, but there's another 1,000 due in the 2.5 update alone that will all be pure synthesis. If I include Trilian, the Moog expansion and 3rd party libs, currently I have about 3,300 pure synthesis patches (and then this additional 1,000). Note that doesn't include any patches that use samples of synths.

Hope all that helps.

(incidentally, the quoted figure of 12,000 patches isn't actually accurate, it's over 12,000 sounds, which is a bit naughty as it includes Soundsources and mulits, and I don't think Spectrasonics should describe it as such as it looks misleading. In 2.4, its currently a mere 7,500 patches, 8,500 in 2.5.)
Those are simply lists of sample sources (and many of them are from sample based synths). Means nothing. Are you pretending that a sample is the same as having the real thing? It explains why you praise Omnisphere so much. If its samples you want, Kontakt clearly beats it (as someone said, Omnisphere doesn't even use multisamples, AFAIK). Kontakt does a better job and is cheaper. :roll:

And by all means, lets discuss how faithfull is the Arturia Hammond, or the Arturia Minimoog, or the Arturia SEM, or the Arturia Jupiter-8, the Arturia Rhodes, the Arturia Fairlight CMI, the Arturia DX7, and all the other Arturias, especially when compared with Omnisphere... :lol: And while we're at it, we can compare CPU taxation on both too (being the Arturias real synths, and the other a sample based) :roll:

The list even quotes samplers as sound sources (as well as ROMplers, as I said) :? :hihi: And software instruments... :lol:

I certainly prefer to have the real things.

Please take the discussion to a serious level.
Last edited by fmr on Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)

neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:21 am

fmr wrote:
neverenoughfunk wrote: i owned Reaktor when it came with a dongle...distributed by Steinberg...
Reaktor never came with a dongle, nor was it ever distributed by Steinberg. You are confusing it with something else. I know, I have it since day 1 (I started still with Generator). I became a fan of Native Instruments since then, and I remain.

If I remember well, Reaktor protection was CD based back then, coupled with serial number.
PLEASE!!!!

do some research... Reaktor was distributed by Steinberg and YES!!! did come with a dongle... it was blue... when B4 and Pro 53 came out they started with the CDs... i had those too... PLEASE do some research...

and YES!!! i do except your apology...

neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:23 am


neverenoughfunk
KVRian
788 posts since 6 Feb, 2004

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:29 am

fmr wrote:
neverenoughfunk wrote: p.s. Specstrasonic do make quality products... i know because i could do a side by side comparison with a ton sh!t...
Again, I never said the opposite. I said that the price/performance ratio is poor :roll:
is this fact based or opinion based?

if fact based... could you point me to the data that supports that claim...

thanks in advance!!!

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
8425 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Re: Buy Omnisphere 2

Post Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:37 am

neverenoughfunk wrote:here is a clue...


https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... ngle.3741/
Hmmm... seems like you are right, and I am wrong, so I'll have to apologize :oops:

EDIT: I checked my packs, and there was a key once, effectively - it was a WIBU key (not the same that was used by Steinberg) and the software wasn't distributed by Steinberg. I know - I worked at the portuguese distributor back then, managing the software department.

I think the only software that was distributed by Steinberg was the Pro-Five (the first version ever done by NI). It was later followed by the Pro-52, and the Pro-53. Maybe (don't remember anymore) the B4 organ as well, but I think that one was already launched under NI own distribution (later updated as the B4-II).
Last edited by fmr on Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:30 am, edited 3 times in total.
Fernando (FMR)

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