SampleTank 4 on the way

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
User avatar
Dillinger
KVRist
201 posts since 2 Apr, 2016

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:55 pm

dandezebra wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:06 pm
Behave Queen works for me...strange.

Wow, I missed that I have over 1000 posts by the way. Woohoo!
Congrats

I rechecked my c7(which I was having issues with one preset) seems they are now working, must of been the 1.2 sound updater?

OK, I can see I have an issue regarding ST4 holding onto RAM, Thanks @zzz00m for confirming and @ShawnMH (that simple action really should not have borked anything as it is a standard action)
I wonder if m.2 nvme disks are the reason I’m not disk streaming but rather continually accumulating RAM usage.
Things that make you go hmmmm.

User avatar
Dillinger
KVRist
201 posts since 2 Apr, 2016

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:58 pm

mixtur.se wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:53 pm
Have been playing with the standalone version for a while, and it looks like it will unexpectedly shut down when adding effects every now and then. ST4 just closes without an error when adding the effect. Anyone else?

BTW the "Behave queen" and "Cellos Falls Short" patches works over here (USB)
Ok, I noticed someone else had the issue with that preset, so I tried and I got an error. I’ll try reinstalling the zip.

I’ll give the stand alone effects crash a go when I get time.

User avatar
dandezebra
KVRian
1040 posts since 21 Dec, 2013 from USA

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:23 pm

mixtur.se wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:53 pm
Have been playing with the standalone version for a while, and it looks like it will unexpectedly shut down when adding effects every now and then. ST4 just closes without an error when adding the effect. Anyone else?

BTW the "Behave queen" and "Cellos Falls Short" patches works over here (USB)

EDIT: Forget it, it just crashes randomly regardless of what I do. I was just looking at RAM consumption without touching it when it crashed. It also crashes sometimes when changing patches, effects etc.
You have sound with E2 on Cello Falls Short?

zzz00m
KVRAF
1719 posts since 17 Sep, 2016

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:31 pm

Dillinger wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:55 pm

OK, I can see I have an issue regarding ST4 holding onto RAM, Thanks @zzz00m for confirming and @ShawnMH (that simple action really should not have borked anything as it is a standard action)
I wonder if m.2 nvme disks are the reason I’m not disk streaming but rather continually accumulating RAM usage.
Things that make you go hmmmm.
Just to be clear, I have been seeing plenty of RAM being held onto, and occasionally being released after a bit of time. Inconsistent results at best.

That example I just gave is the first time I have seen any sign of streaming in ST4. I loaded the instrument, and then let it idle for 20+ minutes before I tried to play it. It seems to have "unloaded" itself from RAM during the interlude, but was still "there".

But since getting ST4, I usually just bang in one instrument after another in an eager attempt to audition them all. This is where I get fails like freezing, crashes, memory not being released in a timely fashion, etc.

My OS, SampleTank, and all of my VSTs are installed on my SSD, and my samples are on an internal SATA 7200 rpm drive.
Last edited by zzz00m on Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Windows 10; with instruments from Ableton, AIR, Ample Sound, AAS, Cakewalk, IK Multimedia, iZotope, KV331, NI, PreSonus, Seaweed Audio, SONiVOX, TAL, Tracktion, u-he, Way Out Ware, XLN, others...

mixtur.se
KVRist
32 posts since 24 Aug, 2017

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:31 pm

zzz00m wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:53 am

I couldn't duplicate the last part, when I hit empty it emptied the part and the RAM went back to 2.1GB,

But I observed something else very strange next:

1. I exited ST4 and restarted it, in an attempt to run the test again.
2. Loaded "Red Strat Full Keyswitch" (actually started loading it and walked away for about 20 minutes to do something else).
3. When I returned the Red Strat was loaded, but the ST4 RAM usage was showing only 2.1GB.
4. I played the instrument, so it was obviously loaded.
5. I opened up Task Manager to show the disk usage monitor, and I could see it reading from the sample drive as I played. I assume that maybe this is the disk streaming that should be working from the get go? It never made any sense to me why the entire instrument needs to be loaded into memory if we have streaming...
6. If I open up Resource Monitor to show disk activity, I can see the actual SampleTank 4 .pak files that are being read as I play the guitar.

Image
Unloading from memory seems to work as expected, but I couldn´t replicate the part where RAM is reduced after a while. What you described almost sounds like some sort of swapping/flushing mechanism.

I did however verify disk activity when playing and ST4 is indeed streaming something. RAM doesn´t increase though, which I would have expected if it was actually streaming. Perhaps RAM is just pre-allocated based on the patch size, and then filled as you play?

It would anyway have been nicer if ST4 just loaded a smaller part of the sample (the attack) on the initial patch load and then streamed and cached the rest on-demand like Kontakt does. ST4 will likely be practical for large (memory footprint) templates with the current implementation.

This is on windows BTW.
Last edited by mixtur.se on Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mixtur.se
KVRist
32 posts since 24 Aug, 2017

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:34 pm

dandezebra wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:23 pm
mixtur.se wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:53 pm
Have been playing with the standalone version for a while, and it looks like it will unexpectedly shut down when adding effects every now and then. ST4 just closes without an error when adding the effect. Anyone else?

BTW the "Behave queen" and "Cellos Falls Short" patches works over here (USB)

EDIT: Forget it, it just crashes randomly regardless of what I do. I was just looking at RAM consumption without touching it when it crashed. It also crashes sometimes when changing patches, effects etc.
You have sound with E2 on Cello Falls Short?
Sorry, I misunderstood. E2 doesn´t work. In fact, ST4 sometimes crashes when I try to play it.

ShawnMH
KVRist
76 posts since 3 Jun, 2016

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:07 pm

zzz00m wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:20 pm

I couldn't duplicate the last part, when I hit empty it emptied the part and the RAM went back to 2.1GB,

But I observed something else very strange next:

1. I exited ST4 and restarted it, in an attempt to run the test again.
2. Loaded "Red Strat Full Keyswitch" (actually started loading it and walked away for about 20 minutes to do something else).
3. When I returned the Red Strat was loaded, but the ST4 RAM usage was showing only 2.1GB.
4. I played the instrument, so it was obviously loaded.
5. I opened up Task Manager to show the disk usage monitor, and I could see it reading from the sample drive as I played. I assume that maybe this is the disk streaming that should be working from the get go? It never made any sense to me why the entire instrument needs to be loaded into memory if we have streaming...
6. If I open up Resource Monitor to show disk activity, I can see the actual SampleTank 4 .pak files that are being read as I play the guitar.

Image
This might have been the same thing that happened for me, when I hit "empty", the memory use went back to 2 GB. Why would it all of a sudden start using disk? I have been checking Res Mon regularly.

My Red Strat preset (after reloading it the 2nd time) sounded "borked" because I wasn't running from memory anymore, I needed to change sample rate and buffer to run it off disk without it sounding like sizzling bacon. My "disk" is NVMe Samsung 512GB 950 Pro, but it is running from a Sabrent enclosure on USB-C.

The same preset used to take about 15 seconds to load (always), now it is taking half that time.

Another weird problem I am having, is every single time I go from the main Red Strat KS to either of the main Black LP KS presets (or from Black to Red), I get an instant crash-out. :?

There should be a settings menu for different type drives/memory usage/multi-core and latency/dropout protection mode. This is asking a lot considering the current state of things, I know haha.

Audio settings needs a reset button - to be able to smoothly switch sample rates and buffers too, - it is currently quite a pain for me to do (standalone).
Last edited by ShawnMH on Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Dillinger
KVRist
201 posts since 2 Apr, 2016

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:43 pm

zzz00m wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:31 pm
Dillinger wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:55 pm

OK, I can see I have an issue regarding ST4 holding onto RAM, Thanks @zzz00m for confirming and @ShawnMH (that simple action really should not have borked anything as it is a standard action)
I wonder if m.2 nvme disks are the reason I’m not disk streaming but rather continually accumulating RAM usage.
Things that make you go hmmmm.
Just to be clear, I have been seeing plenty of RAM being held onto, and occasionally being released after a bit of time. Inconsistent results at best.

That example I just gave is the first time I have seen any sign of streaming in ST4. I loaded the instrument, and then let it idle for 20+ minutes before I tried to play it. It seems to have "unloaded" itself from RAM during the interlude, but was still "there".

But since getting ST4, I usually just bang in one instrument after another in an eager attempt to audition them all. This is where I get fails like freezing, crashes, memory not being released in a timely fashion, etc.

My OS, SampleTank, and all of my VSTs are installed on my SSD, and my samples are on an internal SATA 7200 rpm drive.
Thanks for the clarifications. I as well have OS, ST and samples on the same drive.

A bit more investigating revealed that the stand-alone was releasing “most” of the RAM from unloaded presets, if I waited a bit and didn’t go hog wild loading presets one after another.

I blew the dust off my copy of Ableton and tested, ST4 seemed to exhibit the same (releasing RAM in time).

In REAPER the RAM was not being released and was accumulating. (V5.971 x64 Win10 64). I will proceed with tech support as it seems pretty specific.
mixtur.se wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:53 pm
Have been playing with the standalone version for a while, and it looks like it will unexpectedly shut down when adding effects every now and then. ST4 just closes without an error when adding the effect. Anyone else?

BTW the "Behave queen" and "Cellos Falls Short" patches works over here (USB)

EDIT: Forget it, it just crashes randomly regardless of what I do. I was just looking at RAM consumption without touching it when it crashed. It also crashes sometimes when changing patches, effects etc.
Did everything I could to crash it by the method you described in standalone but I could not. It accepted everything I threw at it in the effects section including rearranging, adding, engage/disengage and removing

bigcat1969
KVRian
1354 posts since 30 Jul, 2013

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:20 am

Thanks for the Youtube links. You certainly get a lot of instruments with ST4. Hopefully all the tech issues are resolved quickly and people can get down to enjoying and grumbling about all 8,000 instruments. Almost made me wish I was still enthused and playing through all those sounds and a lot less broke, almost...

All the best Peter, there isn't enough money in the world to make me take your job, lol nor all the money in the world to make IKM hire me for the job that matter. I looked back inadvertently at some of my past comments and I was a jerk at times, sorry about.

This fellow seemed to be having a great time and sounding good...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLEevKF0h6g
Image

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anxiousmofo
KVRist
417 posts since 1 Apr, 2012 from bamboo tube

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:37 am

Anyone have any success resolving the locked sounds issue? I've reinstalled, redirected, rescanned, restarted and so on in both standalone and VST, to no avail. So far, no signs of life on my support ticket.
Tangled roots perplex her ways.

User avatar
Peter - IK Multimedia
KVRAF
6244 posts since 20 Oct, 2009

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:39 am

bigcat1969 wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:20 am
...All the best Peter, there isn't enough money in the world to make me take your job, lol nor all the money in the world to make IKM hire me for the job that matter. I looked back inadvertently at some of my past comments and I was a jerk at times, sorry about...
Thanks for the wishes about the issues being worked on (I have definitely relayed information about the resource usage to be sure it is on the radar) and also for the direct kind words above.

No need to apologize, and I too apologize for any times I've "let the cracks show" to you or anybody else. More important to keep getting anything important resolved, and I'll keep doing my best to ensure that happens. Having a previous personal attachment to this forum as a "regular user" is more relevant and healthy than taking anything personally whilst I should be focusing on making sure everything is getting taken care of for the people I do have both a personal and professional interest in assisting and ensuring their issues are resolved, questions answers, comments/suggestions heard.
UNO Synth tutorial videos
Follow IK on Facebook for flash giveaways, exclusives, and more.
SampleTank 4 announced and available for pre-order.

User avatar
Peter - IK Multimedia
KVRAF
6244 posts since 20 Oct, 2009

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:41 am

anxiousmofo wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:37 am
Anyone have any success resolving the locked sounds issue? I've reinstalled, redirected, rescanned, restarted and so on in both standalone and VST, to no avail. So far, no signs of life on my support ticket.
Please do let me know your support ticket number, and note that for some who already had a previous bundle (Total Studio, etc) installed may have to re-authorize to see those sounds unlocked. If the ST4 sounds are the ones that are locked, re-authorizing that may help but I'm not aware of that one being solved with a re-auth (worth a try though). I'll see what's going on with your ticket in the mean time since I'm almost positive my suggestions have already been tried or may not be the fix. Thank you.
UNO Synth tutorial videos
Follow IK on Facebook for flash giveaways, exclusives, and more.
SampleTank 4 announced and available for pre-order.

User avatar
anxiousmofo
KVRist
417 posts since 1 Apr, 2012 from bamboo tube

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:42 am

You do great work at a terribly difficult job, Peter.
Tangled roots perplex her ways.

User avatar
anxiousmofo
KVRist
417 posts since 1 Apr, 2012 from bamboo tube

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:43 am

Peter - IK Multimedia wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:41 am
anxiousmofo wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:37 am
Anyone have any success resolving the locked sounds issue? I've reinstalled, redirected, rescanned, restarted and so on in both standalone and VST, to no avail. So far, no signs of life on my support ticket.
Please do let me know your support ticket number, and note that for some who already had a previous bundle (Total Studio, etc) installed may have to re-authorize to see those sounds unlocked. If the ST4 sounds are the ones that are locked, re-authorizing that may help but I'm not aware of that one being solved with a re-auth (worth a try though). I'll see what's going on with your ticket in the mean time since I'm almost positive my suggestions have already been tried or may not be the fix. Thank you.
Ha, you responded before I got my last message out. I'll PM you the info. I do have Sampletank 3 full installed from before, but no bundle.
Tangled roots perplex her ways.

zzz00m
KVRAF
1719 posts since 17 Sep, 2016

Re: SampleTank 4 on the way

Post Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:48 am

For what it's worth, I only experienced the locked libraries with v4.0.0. The first update corrected that for me somehow.
Windows 10; with instruments from Ableton, AIR, Ample Sound, AAS, Cakewalk, IK Multimedia, iZotope, KV331, NI, PreSonus, Seaweed Audio, SONiVOX, TAL, Tracktion, u-he, Way Out Ware, XLN, others...

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