Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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Delta Sign
KVRian
590 posts since 22 Jun, 2018

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:02 am

I'm real smart like. I read books real good.

ramseysounds
KVRist
183 posts since 9 Jul, 2014 from UK

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:07 am

whyterabbyt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:59 am
ramseysounds wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:56 am
chk071 wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:25 am
That's why i love those multi quotes.

You didn't really say much, except that you disagree with about every single point he made, did you?
And he's wrong on every response of 'nope'. :D
so you're arguing that combfilters and allpass filters are EQs, and that highpass and bandpass filters do only pass the low frequencies are you?

wags, im gonna need that hammer.
They both affect the frequency spectrum at a determined set point. So essentially, filters and EQ do the same thing, in different ways. Dress it up as you want, but the fundamental is the same for both.
I wonder what happens if I press this button...

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whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
26453 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:16 am

ramseysounds wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:07 am
They both affect the frequency spectrum at a determined set point.
Allpass filters dont, they affect the frquency spectrum at all points.
Combfilters dont, they affect the frequency spectrum at multiple points.

And are you forgetting that the second of your claims very specifically was that all filters remove frequencies below a certain point, or are you merely trying to pretend it never happened.
So essentially, filters and EQ do the same thing, in different ways.
Except where, they dont, of course.
Dress it up as you want, but the fundamental is the same for both.
Except where it isnt, of course.
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

ramseysounds
KVRist
183 posts since 9 Jul, 2014 from UK

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:22 am

Argue pedants all you want. I really can't be arsed. Out.
I wonder what happens if I press this button...

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whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
26453 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:24 am

ramseysounds wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:22 am
Argue pedants all you want. I really can't be arsed. Out.
Of course you cant. That would require having some facts, and a spine.
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

AnX
KVRAF
3632 posts since 17 Nov, 2015

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:29 am

ramseysounds wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:22 am
Argue pedants all you want. I really can't be arsed. Out.



ive been arsed out, it wasnt as bad as i thought it would be...

Cinebient
KVRAF
3890 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am

I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)

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wagtunes
KVRAF
14354 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:41 am

"Major Tom to Ground Control. There is no intelligent life down here."

"Ground Control to Major Tom. Well there's not much down here either."

"Major Tom to Ground Control. I'm stepping out for a knish."

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bmanic
KVRAF
8198 posts since 3 Feb, 2003 from Finland, Espoo

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:18 am

.jon wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:24 pm
Filters are really important on KVR, but the practical situations where the difference between an average filter and a more advanced one has any meaning in a musical sense are pretty rare.

I think they've become so overemphasized is because it's so easy to fiddle with cutoff and filter and procrastinate on the wonderful sweeps and whistles instead of using a synth. One is hearing the sound of the filter in isolation, but I don't think the differences between filters are very obvious in finished pieces of music. A filter is just one component of one sound source.
I disagree. Why? Because filter topologies themselves are more than just the cutoff and the resonance, more than the "filtering". I think of filters more like waveshapers/tone boxes.

So by your logic guitar tone means pretty much nothing.. doesn't matter if you use a tube screamer or a R.A.T.. it's all just distortion anyhow.

The filters in a subtractive synth are very much at the core of the "tonality" or "box tone" of the synthesizer. It's a sort of sonic fingerprint and is directly correlated with how it's driven. Mind you, it's not just abusing the filters that is interesting.. under powering the input of a filter can yield some pretty interesting results as well. U-He's ACE/Bazille and Diva are all great examples of this where the filter quite drastically changes in it's sonic finger print depending on how hard you drive it. This gets further complex when you modulate the filter at audio rates, or any of the incoming audio volume at audio rates.

Filters are definitely not the end-all be-all of a synthesizers overall "box tone" but it is a large part of it, so yeah, you are correct that it's one part of the synthesizer but I think you underestimate the significance.

Another part people constantly seem to underestimate is the shape of the envelopes.. those drastically affect the overall feel of a synthesizer.

TL;DR You are wrong. Period. :P

Cheers!
bM
Last edited by bmanic on Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot

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vurt
addled muppet weed
39417 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:20 am

Cinebient wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am
I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)
wowowowow

User avatar
whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
26453 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:23 am

vurt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:20 am
Cinebient wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am
I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)
wowowowow
unbelievable.
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
39417 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:24 am

:lol:

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mellotronaut
KVRAF
9834 posts since 2 Jan, 2005 from somewhere in the woods

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:32 am

whyterabbyt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:23 am
vurt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:20 am
Cinebient wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am
I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)
wowowowow
unbelievable.
would you rather apply a comb to this filter or rather grow a beard?

Image
"It dreamed itself along"

Mushy Mushy
KVRAF
10365 posts since 7 Sep, 2008

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:40 am

vurt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:20 am
Cinebient wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am
I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)
wowowowow
@3:07
https://youtu.be/TLZNqsdiIRU?t=187
Last edited by Mushy Mushy on Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
"I was wondering if you'd like to try Magic Mushrooms"
"Oooh I dont know. Sounds a bit scary"
"It's not scary. You just lose a sense of who you are and all that sh!t"

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whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
26453 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Are filters what make the sound of a synth stand out from the crowd?

Post Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:40 am

mellotronaut wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:32 am
whyterabbyt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:23 am
vurt wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:20 am
Cinebient wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am
I wonder why people do not talk in „music“.
Just post an outstanding filter sound....no bla bla.
:)
wowowowow
unbelievable.
would you rather apply a comb to this filter or rather grow a beard?

Image
now hold on a second, I might have a beard but im not a f**king hipster.
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

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