XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
JiggSaw
KVRist
130 posts since 28 Jun, 2004

Post Sun May 17, 2020 4:28 am

Captain wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 11:20 pm
New XO user here! Generally happy with everything, but I have one question/issue. I almost never use built-in sequencers in any plugins, and just trigger everything from Logic (especially now since Logic got a decent step sequencer of its own). Seems like the eight sample slots in XO are triggered with notes C1, C#1, ... G1. But for the life of me, I can’t find any way to change those notes! I’d like XO to have more like a general MIDI mapping where closed hihat is F#1 and so on. Of course I can just use a MIDI plugin to do the mapping (or something like that), but are XO’s trigger notes really fixed, or am I just stupid? :D

Other than that, would be cool to be able to layer multiple samples, and the algorithm that sorts the samples sometimes has a slightly different idea of ”similarity” than I do... but all in all, love the way I can find samples without having to care where the files are located.
I feel your pain. I love XO but there's a lot of improvements that can be made (8 slots, limited sequencer patterns, fixed midi mapping, etc.). Like it doesn't even have midi out. I'd love to have XO control Battery for example since we're limited to 8 slots. That way I can have more layers to work with. Drag n drop midi isn't that helpful since I would want to work with XO's sequencer in real time paired with Battery.

yellowmix
KVRAF
1650 posts since 11 Aug, 2012 from omfr morf form romf frmo

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 6:14 am

Personally, I'd rather they take the sequencing concepts in XO and make an independent, fully-fleshed out sequencer plugin with more more patterns and pattern sequencing/triggering. Like you I'd love to use it to drive Battery since Battery excels at processing kits (and can do round robin, velocity layers, etc.). I'm already dragging and dropping kits from XO to it.

From the feature requests we're seeing many different workflows that would take it into multiple, opposing directions and wreck the current auditioning workflow. So probably better to create a new product that can keep it more focused. Would be awesome if the plugins could communicate and XO could transfer the auditioning sequences over to the sequencer plugin. The sequencer could drive XO, too, since XO accepts MIDI.

yellowmix
KVRAF
1650 posts since 11 Aug, 2012 from omfr morf form romf frmo

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 6:21 am

capracan wrote:
Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:06 pm
- drag the sample into daw, is only possible when u save first
This is unavoidable. For drag and drop to work there needs to be a file the DAW can pick up. So XO needs to render it.

I suppose it could be done silently but users should know that a file is being generated and where to find it if the receiving plugin doesn't save the samples so they don't disappear when you reload the project. If you use Battery I suggest saving the dragged-in kit (Patch + Samples) to your project folder as soon as possible.

If dragging into a DAW it depends on whether the DAW links it or copies it. If it links it then make sure the project copies the files to the project folder on save.

JiggSaw
KVRist
130 posts since 28 Jun, 2004

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 7:06 am

yellowmix wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 6:14 am
Personally, I'd rather they take the sequencing concepts in XO and make an independent, fully-fleshed out sequencer plugin with more more patterns and pattern sequencing/triggering. Like you I'd love to use it to drive Battery since Battery excels at processing kits (and can do round robin, velocity layers, etc.). I'm already dragging and dropping kits from XO to it.

From the feature requests we're seeing many different workflows that would take it into multiple, opposing directions and wreck the current auditioning workflow. So probably better to create a new product that can keep it more focused. Would be awesome if the plugins could communicate and XO could transfer the auditioning sequences over to the sequencer plugin. The sequencer could drive XO, too, since XO accepts MIDI.
I see your points but I don't know if I 100% agree. I think the auditioning of samples AND the sequencer are what separates XO from the competition. I don't think something like adding C + D patterns then being able to chain them in any order would dramatically alter the workflow. Doesn't seem that over the top to me. Maybe I'm wrong. I do agree that anything that would wreck the current workflow should be avoided. However, I'd rather not use it as a "kit maker" and have to sequence elsewhere. Kind of defeats the purpose. XO is extremely fast at getting a good drum groove going and that's what I love about it. I do wish we'd at least get more frequent updates, no matter what they are.

yellowmix
KVRAF
1650 posts since 11 Aug, 2012 from omfr morf form romf frmo

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 7:50 am

Look back from the first post in this thread. A lot of the requests are about expanding the sequencer. Like tying notes, reversing, different pattern lengths per lane, euclidean beats, make it equal to Sugar Bytes DrumComputer's sequencing, fill variation, pitch sequencing, etc..

The other direction wants expanding the sample processing, e.g., velocity layers, layering samples, round-robins, choke groups, etc..

If only two patterns are added, people will still request further features. They will not be happy. This is why I suggest a separate product that can address all of those requests.

User avatar
jeffb01
KVRian
955 posts since 18 Apr, 2006

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 7:55 am

One thing I would like is to be able to see a map of just one library. Like if I add a bunch of folders of drum samples, sometimes it's too much and I would like to be able to see the map of just one folder. I don't think there's a way (correct me if I'm wrong) except if the naming allows the searching feature.

JiggSaw
KVRist
130 posts since 28 Jun, 2004

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 8:11 am

yellowmix wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 7:50 am
Look back from the first post in this thread. A lot of the requests are about expanding the sequencer. Like tying notes, reversing, different pattern lengths per lane, euclidean beats, make it equal to Sugar Bytes DrumComputer's sequencing, fill variation, pitch sequencing, etc..

The other direction wants expanding the sample processing, e.g., velocity layers, layering samples, round-robins, choke groups, etc..

If only two patterns are added, people will still request further features. They will not be happy. This is why I suggest a separate product that can address all of those requests.
Yeah.. even with a completely separate product people will never be satisfied. That's just the way it is. So I agree with that point. I was simply saying features that won't necessarily break the current workflow or change what XO is at it's core should be considered. Simple things instead of complete reworkings. Like having midi out is a no brainer imo. However, I'm not a dev and I'm fully aware that things that seem simple might not be simple at all.

JiggSaw
KVRist
130 posts since 28 Jun, 2004

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 8:12 am

jeffb01 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 7:55 am
One thing I would like is to be able to see a map of just one library. Like if I add a bunch of folders of drum samples, sometimes it's too much and I would like to be able to see the map of just one folder. I don't think there's a way (correct me if I'm wrong) except if the naming allows the searching feature.
You can drag and drop that one folder into XO. XO will use that as a filter and only show the samples of that folder.

Also in the sample search/filter section, go to the bottom and select "None". Then only choose the folder(s) you want.

pheeleep
KVRAF
2828 posts since 11 Jun, 2003

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 8:39 am

Switching presets at the moment loads sequences and their associates samples. There’s a way to lock samples in the XO interface but when I switch presets the samples change to the ones included in the preset. Wish there was an option to only load sequences from a preset. Or only load the samples from a preset.
Play it by ear

User avatar
Captain
KVRian
556 posts since 29 Nov, 2002 from Finland

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am

pheeleep wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 8:39 am
Switching presets at the moment loads sequences and their associates samples. There’s a way to lock samples in the XO interface but when I switch presets the samples change to the ones included in the preset. Wish there was an option to only load sequences from a preset. Or only load the samples from a preset.
Ah yes, I spent a lot of time trying to figure out if this is possible, but apparently not. When you have the sequencer running and browse through the presets, it often happens that for a moment, XO plays the new sequence using the samples from the previous preset... and occasionally it sounds super cool! And just when you go like ”whooo hey wait a sec this sounds amaz...”, the new samples finish loading and the magic is lost and there’s no way to go back to what you just heard. Pretty irritating. :lol:

All in all, it feels like on the other hand XO is super polished and well thought out, and on the other hand there are a lot of ”obvious” missing features. Hopefully they’ll keep updating it.

User avatar
Captain
KVRian
556 posts since 29 Nov, 2002 from Finland

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 10:52 am

yellowmix wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 2:16 am
Captain wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 11:20 pm
are XO’s trigger notes really fixed, or am I just stupid? :D
They are fixed as far as I can tell, since there is no real manual (but it's intuitive so does not really need one IMO).

XLN's Addictive Drums has a very good MIDI mapping ability, with pre-made maps for General and Admiral MIDIs as well as some other 3rd party products. Please email XLN and request that they implement similar functionality.
Thanks! Yeah, that’s what I thought too. I used Addictive Drums 1 a lot back in the day, and really liked the way it worked. It always gave you the feeling that there are people behind it who actually know what they are doing. I can see the same level of polish continues with XO, but it could really use some new features (like this). Thx for the suggestion, I’ll email them!

yellowmix
KVRAF
1650 posts since 11 Aug, 2012 from omfr morf form romf frmo

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 8:40 pm

Captain wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am
pheeleep wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 8:39 am
Wish there was an option to only load sequences from a preset. Or only load the samples from a preset.
Ah yes, I spent a lot of time trying to figure out if this is possible, but apparently not.
It is possible, but not directly from the preset load.

Load the preset you want to take the samples or sequence from. On the Kit Visualizer on the bottom left, right-click and "Copy All Settings". Load the target preset, right-click again and paste whatever you want—the samples/kit, the sequence, or the accentuator.

There's also the ability to export the sequence as MIDI and you can simply drive XO with it.

User avatar
Captain
KVRian
556 posts since 29 Nov, 2002 from Finland

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 10:14 pm

yellowmix wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 8:40 pm
It is possible, but not directly from the preset load.

Load the preset you want to take the samples or sequence from. On the Kit Visualizer on the bottom left, right-click and "Copy All Settings". Load the target preset, right-click again and paste whatever you want—the samples/kit, the sequence, or the accentuator.

There's also the ability to export the sequence as MIDI and you can simply drive XO with it.
True, stupid me. Thanks!

yellowmix
KVRAF
1650 posts since 11 Aug, 2012 from omfr morf form romf frmo

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Sun May 17, 2020 11:48 pm

Not stupid, there's a lack of explicit documentation. I personally didn't notice it until a few days of exploring. There's a quick getting started "manual" with the bare basics and if you hover over something there's built-in help and it definitely was fun to explore and a delight to discover but for busy people a manual that says "here are all the UI elements and this is what they do" would be nice too. But then again many people don't read manuals either. So I kinda get where they're coming from.

User avatar
LoveEnigma18
KVRAF
2370 posts since 12 Jan, 2018

Re: XLN Audio - XO - Improvement, Pros, Cons

Post Mon May 18, 2020 3:34 am

A couple of cons I can recall:

- Not possible to "replace" folder paths. You have to delete and then add again if the path has changed.
- Drag and drop wav files from XO to DAW uses extra space on your precious C drive (please help me if I am missing anything here)
Never imagined we would get to play with toys in adulthood. :)

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