Unfiltered Audio Lion

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
KVRian
1343 posts since 6 Jul, 2004

Post Fri May 14, 2021 7:28 am

Thanks for the fast testing! I was using Reaper 6.28 as well, with Desktop Scaling at 125% to test with multiple interface zoom levels.

What is your Desktop Scaling set to? When you say it "breaks the ports", do you mean the mouse interaction with them or a visual bug?

KVRist
181 posts since 4 Feb, 2015

Post Fri May 14, 2021 8:52 am

thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 7:28 am
Thanks for the fast testing! I was using Reaper 6.28 as well, with Desktop Scaling at 125% to test with multiple interface zoom levels.

What is your Desktop Scaling set to? When you say it "breaks the ports", do you mean the mouse interaction with them or a visual bug?
I'm running at 3840 x 2160 at 175% scaling (It happens on all other scales, but 175% is my default). The cable doesn't get detected when I mouse over the port with a cable and the white ring indicator doesn't switch on. If I raise the mouse just over the port it then gets detected, it's off by a few pixels above the port. If I zoom the gui then the old 1.30 behaviour comes back.

KVRian
1343 posts since 6 Jul, 2004

Post Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am

Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.

KVRist
181 posts since 4 Feb, 2015

Post Fri May 14, 2021 3:50 pm

thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am
Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.
Thank you for looking into a solution for this.

KVRian
1343 posts since 6 Jul, 2004

Post Wed May 19, 2021 10:35 am

DrFolder wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 8:52 am
thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 7:28 am
Thanks for the fast testing! I was using Reaper 6.28 as well, with Desktop Scaling at 125% to test with multiple interface zoom levels.

What is your Desktop Scaling set to? When you say it "breaks the ports", do you mean the mouse interaction with them or a visual bug?
I'm running at 3840 x 2160 at 175% scaling (It happens on all other scales, but 175% is my default). The cable doesn't get detected when I mouse over the port with a cable and the white ring indicator doesn't switch on. If I raise the mouse just over the port it then gets detected, it's off by a few pixels above the port. If I zoom the gui then the old 1.30 behaviour comes back.
I'm having trouble reproducing this at 175% scaling.

In REAPER's option menu, under General, can you click Advanced UI/System Tweaks and let me know what it says under HiDPI mode?

Additionally, are you using a computer with more than one monitor? If so, are there different desktop scales between the monitors or anything unusual like that?

KVRist
181 posts since 4 Feb, 2015

Post Wed May 19, 2021 2:50 pm

thelizard wrote:
Wed May 19, 2021 10:35 am
DrFolder wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 8:52 am
thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 7:28 am
Thanks for the fast testing! I was using Reaper 6.28 as well, with Desktop Scaling at 125% to test with multiple interface zoom levels.

What is your Desktop Scaling set to? When you say it "breaks the ports", do you mean the mouse interaction with them or a visual bug?
I'm running at 3840 x 2160 at 175% scaling (It happens on all other scales, but 175% is my default). The cable doesn't get detected when I mouse over the port with a cable and the white ring indicator doesn't switch on. If I raise the mouse just over the port it then gets detected, it's off by a few pixels above the port. If I zoom the gui then the old 1.30 behaviour comes back.
I'm having trouble reproducing this at 175% scaling.

In REAPER's option menu, under General, can you click Advanced UI/System Tweaks and let me know what it says under HiDPI mode?

Additionally, are you using a computer with more than one monitor? If so, are there different desktop scales between the monitors or anything unusual like that?
I have HiDPI mode (Windows 7+) set to "Multimonitor aware (recommended)" or unchanged from installation. I don't use multiple monitors as the extended width of having 2 monitors effects my placement of my speaker monitors.

KVRian
931 posts since 13 Dec, 2016

Post Tue May 25, 2021 5:55 am

@thelizard:

any chance to add a sample oscillator in a future Lion update?

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KVRian
533 posts since 9 Oct, 2006

Post Wed May 26, 2021 2:14 am

Lion with MTS-ESP support is now more than ever insanely good :love:
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KVRAF
2092 posts since 12 Nov, 2014

Post Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:13 am

thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am
Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.
Hey bro, is there anyway you can make the sequencer any bigger without resorting to upscaling the entire UI to something megalithic?!?

I'm having huge problems making small adjustments to the steps, knowing what note I've selected, or even just resetting the step. It just seems really tedious to work with for note sequencing.

Perhaps you can have a "hover over" note display, scale snap and holding in a modifier to make small adjustments. Of course, most of this should also work when not using it to sequence notes as well.

Just a thought.

Thanks for your huge efforts in developing it though. Loving the new Silo too.

KVRAF
2092 posts since 12 Nov, 2014

Post Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:14 am

enCiphered wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 5:55 am
@thelizard:

any chance to add a sample oscillator in a future Lion update?
NICE IDEA!!

With a granular/spectral/freeze mode option too, in the way that only Unfiltered Audio can do.

KVRian
1343 posts since 6 Jul, 2004

Post Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:11 am

DrFolder wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 3:50 pm
thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am
Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.
Thank you for looking into a solution for this.
As an update, I've spent every workday focused on this, as it's holding back patches for BYOME and Triad as well.

Essentially, there was one rounding error (so far) in JUCE's mouse position callback that was caught and fixed a while back, but it somehow never made it into a JUCE release. That's now been patched into JUCE.

After that, I discovered another potential JUCE bug that I *think* is another rounding error somewhere. To help them reproduce this, I wrote a basic tester plugin that demonstrates the example. I sent it over to them yesterday, so at this point I'm waiting to see if it's a JUCE issue or something weird with how we scale.

Anyway, this isn't intended to knock on JUCE at all. This whole thing (plugin scaling in multiple formats, on multiple operating systems, in multiple DAWs, with multiple pixel densities, and with multiple rendering engines) is insanely complicated, so fixing the behavior on one bug might break something subtly elsewhere. I'm just trying to give an explanation as to what happens behind the scenes with something like this when it seems like a simple bug but totally isn't. I'll send over a new build once everything seems to be working properly on my three test computers.

KVRAF
1911 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:14 am

thelizard wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:11 am
DrFolder wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 3:50 pm
thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am
Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.
Thank you for looking into a solution for this.
As an update, I've spent every workday focused on this, as it's holding back patches for BYOME and Triad as well.

Essentially, there was one rounding error (so far) in JUCE's mouse position callback that was caught and fixed a while back, but it somehow never made it into a JUCE release. That's now been patched into JUCE.

After that, I discovered another potential JUCE bug that I *think* is another rounding error somewhere. To help them reproduce this, I wrote a basic tester plugin that demonstrates the example. I sent it over to them yesterday, so at this point I'm waiting to see if it's a JUCE issue or something weird with how we scale.

Anyway, this isn't intended to knock on JUCE at all. This whole thing (plugin scaling in multiple formats, on multiple operating systems, in multiple DAWs, with multiple pixel densities, and with multiple rendering engines) is insanely complicated, so fixing the behavior on one bug might break something subtly elsewhere. I'm just trying to give an explanation as to what happens behind the scenes with something like this when it seems like a simple bug but totally isn't. I'll send over a new build once everything seems to be working properly on my three test computers.
thanks for this explanation, scaling is one of the things that is strangely quite difficult, you enumerate why.

maybe, my question, is too much; JUCE is also known, i thought, for touchscreen capabilities, or 'easy' (seems nothing can be easy) implementation.

UA plugins do work with touchscreen (i am on windows, on of 3 monitors is a touchscreen, for tactile control, yes it feels like that!), but tooltips stay hanging, ánd i can push the LION audio engine to a full stop, preset change (and saving the preset i am working on), is a workaround.
it does not, how do say it, or better: it keeps the focus, and the last 'position'.

escpecially UA plugins work great with touchscreens, like LION, with each patch a different row of effects, etc.
also patching works...

i know touchscreen is a niche... and this scaling issue will give you already a headache...

but why not ask? a devoted UA user..
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shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

KVRian
1343 posts since 6 Jul, 2004

Post Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:28 am

I unfortunately do not have a non-iOS touchscreen device, so it's not officially tested or supported yet. Is the audio engine hang touchscreen related, or are you able to hang it with a mouse pointer?

KVRAF
1911 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:38 am

thelizard wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:28 am
I unfortunately do not have a non-iOS touchscreen device, so it's not officially tested or supported yet. Is the audio engine hang touchscreen related, or are you able to hang it with a mouse pointer?
i make patches in batches... i never noticed in one session a crash while making a load of presets, only when i tried the first time LION with my touchsreen, don't own it that long, the audio engine hanged. while making patches from scratches in batches....

(it is more flow thing, and make also patches, or redesign them when i really use them i a track, i start with sounds, tracks come out of the sounds, or something like that. not necessary! this info! it's me! sorry...)

so i never have experienced it, only with the touchscreen, could be a glitch, last time i made patches for LION, is a while ago, mainly because i use those patches now.. but it didn't seem like a glitch...
will try to reproduce it, or will certainly use LION, with a touchscreen, i still do, but as i said..

thanks for your response. (and indeed difficult to test, without a no-ios touchscreen)
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

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KVRist
202 posts since 10 Jun, 2004 from Portland, OR

Post Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:09 pm

simon.a.billington wrote:
Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:13 am
thelizard wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 9:45 am
Thanks, I'll keep hacking at this and will post a new build soon. It's funny how scaling the interface consistently is so much harder than writing DSP.
Hey bro, is there anyway you can make the sequencer any bigger without resorting to upscaling the entire UI to something megalithic?!?

I'm having huge problems making small adjustments to the steps, knowing what note I've selected, or even just resetting the step. It just seems really tedious to work with for note sequencing.

Perhaps you can have a "hover over" note display, scale snap and holding in a modifier to make small adjustments. Of course, most of this should also work when not using it to sequence notes as well.

Just a thought.

Thanks for your huge efforts in developing it though. Loving the new Silo too.
I had similar issues and thoughts on this as well. I love having the sequencer onboard, but it is so small it is difficult to be precise.
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