One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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Ranoka
KVRist
349 posts since 4 Jun, 2018 from The UK

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 1:51 am

I have a question about the .uhm scripts in Hive2 - would it be against the wavetable crackdown to use algorithmic wavetables that I write/create?
Also, in Zebra2 is it ok to use all 8 frames of the wavetable OSC to draw our own shapes? Or should we only use 1 (or 2?) of the frames?

I believe the 'spirit' of OSC is not to do re-synthesis of samples to create wavetables. I'm not actually clear of what "Only use single shot waveforms" of the rule on the first page means - does that mean only using a single frame? (so no wavetables at all - just single cycles?).

A big part of the allure of Hive for me is the .uhm scripts...

RichardSemper
KVRian
502 posts since 30 Oct, 2013 from Stoke On Trent

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:47 am

Ranoka wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 1:51 am
I have a question about the .uhm scripts in Hive2 - would it be against the wavetable crackdown to use algorithmic wavetables that I write/create?
Also, in Zebra2 is it ok to use all 8 frames of the wavetable OSC to draw our own shapes? Or should we only use 1 (or 2?) of the frames?

I believe the 'spirit' of OSC is not to do re-synthesis of samples to create wavetables. I'm not actually clear of what "Only use single shot waveforms" of the rule on the first page means - does that mean only using a single frame? (so no wavetables at all - just single cycles?).

A big part of the allure of Hive for me is the .uhm scripts...
Agreed that the 'spirit' of OSC is not to do re-synthesis of samples. Wavetable synths can easily blur the lines between sampling and synthesis. This is the reason we introduced the idea of maximum two imported 'single cycle' waveform limit previously. Even then, there are those who would try to push the limits of this to achieve resampling, but this is not what the challenge is about.

I would say that in the 'spirit' of OSC - any algorithmic wavetables you create, or draw in would be absolutely fine. Also use of any number of factory waveforms supplied with the synth should be fine. You can use as many frames in a wavetable as are available in the synth, and morphing between different single cycles is fine.

The purpose of any rules or limitations placed in this respect is to avoid the use of sampling rather than synthesis in OSC.

I hope this makes things clearer.

User avatar
Ranoka
KVRist
349 posts since 4 Jun, 2018 from The UK

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:04 am

RichardSemper wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:47 am
The purpose of any rules or limitations placed in this respect is to avoid the use of sampling rather than synthesis in OSC.

I hope this makes things clearer.
Thanks! I feel like I can comfortably experiment with the .uhm scripts without worrying about disqualification. I think it's important for Hive because it's where a lot of the sounds like Sync, Bend/Warp and FM come from the .uhm scripts and 3D wavetable feature by design. Urs chose this route to reduce the amount of single-use-case controls on the synth (paraphrasing of course based on what he's said in the u-he forum).

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] Peter:H [
KVRian
825 posts since 22 Sep, 2016

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:56 am

RichardSemper wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:47 am
Ranoka wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 1:51 am
I have a question about the .uhm scripts in Hive2 - would it be against the wavetable crackdown to use algorithmic wavetables that I write/create?
Also, in Zebra2 is it ok to use all 8 frames of the wavetable OSC to draw our own shapes? Or should we only use 1 (or 2?) of the frames?

I believe the 'spirit' of OSC is not to do re-synthesis of samples to create wavetables. I'm not actually clear of what "Only use single shot waveforms" of the rule on the first page means - does that mean only using a single frame? (so no wavetables at all - just single cycles?).

A big part of the allure of Hive for me is the .uhm scripts...
Agreed that the 'spirit' of OSC is not to do re-synthesis of samples. Wavetable synths can easily blur the lines between sampling and synthesis. This is the reason we introduced the idea of maximum two imported 'single cycle' waveform limit previously. Even then, there are those who would try to push the limits of this to achieve resampling, but this is not what the challenge is about.

I would say that in the 'spirit' of OSC - any algorithmic wavetables you create, or draw in would be absolutely fine. Also use of any number of factory waveforms supplied with the synth should be fine. You can use as many frames in a wavetable as are available in the synth, and morphing between different single cycles is fine.

The purpose of any rules or limitations placed in this respect is to avoid the use of sampling rather than synthesis in OSC.

I hope this makes things clearer.
Sorry to say - it's kind of a weird obsession to say resampling is not in the spirit of OSC. As well I could claim that all the advanced features of DAWs like kind-of-amok-automation-capabilities, plugin-layering in combination with DAW ADSRs and EQ based Bands, multi-banding, mid-side and EQ Filter-Sweeps, JS Scripting Capabilities is all beyond OSC because the sounds produced are not possible with "the synth itself". I really disappreciate that all the work put into the Zebralett resampling I did is just cast off as bs whereas modulation-automation-massacres are not... After all it's called the "One Synth Challenge", i.e. put emphasize on "SYNTH" in this and with synths like thorn or zebralette creating a word is not easy, it requires skill, technical understanding of the inner workings and the ability to create it.
And on the other hand setups are created where Hive 2 has to compete agains Zebralette or Tyrell No6. Sorry for the rant... but there's kind of a bias towards certain properties here and others are just put aside.

RichardSemper
KVRian
502 posts since 30 Oct, 2013 from Stoke On Trent

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 7:16 am

] Peter:H [ wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:56 am
Sorry to say - it's kind of a weird obsession to say resampling is not in the spirit of OSC.
As far as I am aware sampling has never been allowed in the OSC.
Its simply not what this challenge is about.
If we can use synth functionality to play back samples why bother with the synth at all? Just use samples whenever there's a sound you want which the synth itself cannot produce.

Wavetables do blur the lines in that they are generally based on samples - albeit single cycles. But even without using the import of samples there is huge functionality and scope with a WT synth which we should be able to exploit, without it becoming mere sample playback.
As sampling in all forms is specifically excluded in the rules it has been necessary to include exceptions which allow the use of wavetable functionality during specific competitions.

I do understand and appreciate the difficulties and technical challenges of synthesising say, specific words and phrases: Check this out from about 2mins 20 sec - It was made with the tunefish synth, without use of samples in any form:
https://soundcloud.com/richard-semper/r ... se-of-pain
I used the formant filter built into the synth, applied to noise oscillator, with automation of parameters.

Carl_saved
KVRist
155 posts since 17 May, 2013

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:55 am

Anyone going for zebralette and struggling with drums? I find these presets Daru made incredibly useful (how to make noise with zebralette).
viewtopic.php?p=6886909#p6886909

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TrojakEW
KVRist
314 posts since 21 Mar, 2012 from Slovakia

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:55 am

Here is my submission. I decide to make it more challenging and interesting for me so I limit myself to just one instance of plugin so I can focus more on composition. So one instance with one automation track and just one pattern. This is actually the first time that my track do not contain reused patterns, so every part in this track is unique even the main theme sound similar the pattern is quite different. Nothing fancy but it was fun. Did anybody ever try to strum using midi piano keyboard? I almost rip skin on my fingers playing this. :lol:

https://soundcloud.com/trojakew/the-chosen-one
FL Studio 20.0.5
1 instances of Triple Cheese by u-he

DAW FX's:
1x Fruity parametric EQ 2
1x Maximus

Statistics:
Max momentary loudness -8,4 LUFS
Max short term loudness -10,8 LUFS
Integrated loudness -14,0 LUFS
Loudness range 9,7 LU
True peak L -1,22db
True peak R -1,25db
DC offset L +0%
DC offset R +0%

Now back to listening and voting for previous round.
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mmGhost
KVRist
220 posts since 24 Aug, 2009 from CO, USA

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:36 am

Carl_saved wrote:
Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:55 am
Anyone going for zebralette and struggling with drums? I find these presets Daru made incredibly useful (how to make noise with zebralette).
viewtopic.php?p=6886909#p6886909
if you want my drums from zebralette send me a PM (anyone). i probably need to save them to the native format, but that should be easy. they were used in the track below
https://soundcloud.com/mmghost/those-good-times
Soundcloud | Spotify | YouTube Tutorials
"Just sidechain everything to everything"

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exponent1
KVRist
205 posts since 10 Nov, 2018

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:15 am

To Zebralette users,

I did check Daru's post, but it's not yielding satisfactory results for white noise. Any tips and tricks for synthesizing white noise?

Thanks!

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baalisoda
KVRist
202 posts since 7 Apr, 2017 from Chennai, Tamilnadu, India

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:32 am

Here is my submission for this month's OSC. I have made this track using u-he's Tyrell N6.

https://soundcloud.com/baalisoda/to-the-void

I have used 6 instances of Tyrell N6 to create this track in FL Studio as DAW.

FX used (all are freeware VSTs) are Dragon Reverb x1, NastyDLA x3, Engineer's Filter x1, Reviber x1, FerricTDS x1, TDR Nova x1, LoudMax x1.

User avatar
TrojakEW
KVRist
314 posts since 21 Mar, 2012 from Slovakia

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:57 am

exponent1 wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:15 am
To Zebralette users,
Any tips and tricks for synthesizing white noise?
Not pure white noise but you can tweak it more. Play with filter on FX2 or you can even try different effects on it. Hope it helps.
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EnGee
KVRAF
5491 posts since 7 Oct, 2005 from NZ

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:44 am

What is the final date to submit? Is it the 15th?
Let's donate to help the kids and save our planet.

GeneralQ
KVRer
2 posts since 10 Sep, 2019

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:14 pm

I am struggling to get a decent kick out of tyrell n6.
The Decay shape/slope is to slow. Any tips how to make up for that ?

User avatar
EnGee
KVRAF
5491 posts since 7 Oct, 2005 from NZ

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:28 pm

EnGee wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:44 am
What is the final date to submit? Is it the 15th?
Oh ok! it is till the end of the month :) Very tempting :hyper:
Let's donate to help the kids and save our planet.

tomx2188
KVRer
17 posts since 13 Mar, 2019 from Austria

Re: One Synth Challenge #127: Any One u-he Synth (u-he prize added to the pool!)

Post Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:32 pm

GeneralQ wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:14 pm
I am struggling to get a decent kick out of tyrell n6.
The Decay shape/slope is to slow. Any tips how to make up for that ?
I think you could change the decay slope using the mod matrix. Use one of the envelopes as source and make it modulate its own decay setting :)

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