Icarus or Hive?

[LoveEnigma18]

Yes, that's why I mentioned Iris 2 is not as advanced, but it's still a great synth for it can do. I understand OP and many others are interested in more in-depth capabilities and I was not really comparing it with the other synths mentioned in the topic.

[dune_rave]

Icarus or Hive? - if you can afford , both

[Robmobius]

Icarus or Hive? - if you can afford , both

This is it! Because they are both tonally different. So, you can cover more ground with both.

[cytospur]

By the way you can use Dune 3 to create Wavetables for Hive 2.

And vice versa, of course, if you can get your head around UHM scripting, which is just pure awesome!

[Teksonik]

By the way you can use Dune 3 to create Wavetables for Hive 2.

And vice versa, of course, if you can get your head around UHM scripting, which is just pure awesome!

If by awesome you mean needlessly complicated then yes..........

[AnX]

only Mark and Urs know how to make them....

[david.beholder]

I feel like Hive has
1. best sound among of wavetable bunch -- very powerful filters and nice WTs
2. great preset banks
3. hit and miss workflow -- mod system is great but not easy detune options, easy mseg, no variable envelope cruves, no visual WT edit
4. UI flows -- effects UI is too small

Never heard demo of Icarus to say WOW.
Could someone recommend me one?

[focusrite]

I feel like Hive has
1. best sound among of wavetable bunch -- very powerful filters and nice WTs
2. great preset banks
3. hit and miss workflow -- mod system is great but not easy detune options, easy mseg, no variable envelope cruves, no visual WT edit
4. UI flows -- effects UI is too small

Never heard demo of Icarus to say WOW.
Could someone recommend me one?

As good as any

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXNa70ea_iQ&t=3s

[recursive one]

Maybe there is some video explaining this side of Hive2?

We'll do some more... but really, it's more, like, when there's a situation when you'd commonly say "I wished I could just..." and there's indeed a simple way to do it. We recently put Hive to a test for a film scoring project, and everyone was quite surprised how easily we could do "Zebra things" with it.

Thing is, I'm coming from other wavetable/VA synths, like Serum, Virus TI, Dune3, Rapid... most of them have LFOs/envelopes/Msegs/steppers in this or that form and for my purposes this used to be enough. I need to figure out first where I would need more than that and what exactly this would be.

FM is a strong option for a future update, but we haven't made the final decision on it yet.

Would be very cool. Many softsynths do cross-osc FM or PM but it often doesn't sound quite right... either too tame, or too noisy and harsh.

Maybe not even a real cross-osc FMc, rather FM from a ghost oscillator having a special shape adapted to work well as an FM modulator. The pitch of that ghost FM source could be defined by the sub pitch for example (in order not to propagate the knobs)

We did other improvements for aforementioned project, mostly in the filter department. This needs a bit of polishing, so it will come to Hive 2.1 or so after we're done with the transition to Catalina (Hive 2.0.1, next month) and after the big Uhbik update (~January).

Sounds very cool, looking forward

[tasty tatsyn]

this may feel like self promotion..... and it could possibly also have a chance to be....

anyhow, back on topic; it might be helpfull..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9i6EkxSFKQ

[tasty tatsyn]

... Having said that..... you can also look on youtube for

ex: Aiyn Zahev sounds for hive 2..
(because i think it falls more into your sound preferences)

[Urs]

I need to figure out first where I would need more than that and what exactly this would be.

I meant this the other way round - often the tools available seem infinitely strong, but you still end up with a lot of quite similar things, i.e. they promote certain characteristics (always smooth curves, always jaggy envelopes, always repetitive stuff). It might be difficult to get something else - which is where the combination of simple things may come in handy.

Examples are modulations which are radically different for each voice, or which happen only on the first note in a legato phrase, or which you can trigger with a controller, or which contain random elements or a random order of things; modulations of pitch which hit overtones or stay within certain scales; rhythmic modulations which shift against each other (e.g. 5 beats vs. 7 beats); rhythmic modulations with user controlled but musical timing (e.g. twice as fast when you hit the key hard); modulations which are modulated from other modulations or modulated by themselves (feedback). In other words: Things that put fun back in preset design rather than doing what's been done over and over. These things are all a piece of cake in Hive, but hardly possible elsewhere.

[Hanz Meyzer]

Ok

I think in the end workflow and flexibility are the factors which count the most. If the workflow is smooth and the modulation is very flexible and not limited, you can use this one synth for a lot of requirements, instead using 50 different ones. So I would prefer a more complicated, but more flexible synth over a super simplified structure.

I think both synths are similar in workflow, streamlined. Hive has the usual U-He quality, but also Icarus has extremely versatile oscillators and filters. Icarus also has a lot more filter- and also saturation types and WT-effects. Icarus impresses with feature numbers, Hive with very detailed analogue style design. Hive provides algorithmically setup WTs, and comes with a better sounding fx section.

Actually it is difficult to compare them. From sound demo, I would say, Hive easily can sound like an analog synth, too, while Icarus more sounds like nicely digital, Serum style. For sure the factory presets of Icarus go into EDM/Dance/Trap*.* direction, while the Hive provides presets for a lot of tastes. This might be related to the team sizes.

That's why I am eagerly waiting for Zebra 3 and in the meanwhile am using Zebra 2..

You might also check out Synthmaster One, which is pretty low in price currently (36$). It has a lot of flexibility.

[JunSev]

Ok

I think in the end workflow and flexibility are the factors which count the most. If the workflow is smooth and the modulation is very flexible and not limited, you can use this one synth for a lot of requirements, instead using 50 different ones. So I would prefer a more complicated, but more flexible synth over a super simplified structure.

I think both synths are similar in workflow, streamlined. Hive has the usual U-He quality, but also Icarus has extremely versatile oscillators and filters. Icarus also has a lot more filter- and also saturation types and WT-effects. Icarus impresses with feature numbers, Hive with very detailed analogue style design. Hive provides algorithmically setup WTs, and comes with a better sounding fx section.

Actually it is difficult to compare them. From sound demo, I would say, Hive easily can sound like an analog synth, too, while Icarus more sounds like nicely digital, Serum style. For sure the factory presets of Icarus go into EDM/Dance/Trap*.* direction, while the Hive provides presets for a lot of tastes. This might be related to the team sizes.

That's why I am eagerly waiting for Zebra 3 and in the meanwhile am using Zebra 2..

You might also check out Synthmaster One, which is pretty low in price currently (36$). It has a lot of flexibility.

(about Hive) and comes with a better sounding fx section.

No, better is subjective, Icarus effects sounds pretty good too. I like the effects in Icarus and the "duck" makes the effects sits very well in the mix.

while Icarus more sounds like nicely digital, Serum style

Yes Icarus sounds digital, even artificial and spacial if you want it, but compare it with serum?... I can't explain what's really happening inside both synths, but you can really feel a big difference with the sound, I'm not saying one is better than the other, is just that there is something... if you like sound design I recommend you to try both (from scratch if possible).

[Hanz Meyzer]

(about Hive) and comes with a better sounding fx section.
No, better is subjective, Icarus effects sounds pretty good too. I like the effects in Icarus and the "duck" makes the effects sits very well in the mix.

Sure, my whole post was very subjective and my personal opinion only