Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

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KVRian
797 posts since 4 Jul, 2019

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:11 pm

Captain wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:50 am
EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:50 am
Actually... isn't it "two filter banks offer xyz", and if it's singular it's the other way around, "the filter bank offers xyz"? I think that's correct.

English is weird.

EDIT: looks like I missed the grammar school posts. But yes, using "offers" is wrong in this context, should be fixed :) The link there referring to "each" does not relate to this situation here.
(Apologies everyone for still continuing with this... :lol:)

I most respectfully disagree. :D My reasoning goes as follows:

Each of the two Filter Banks offers 20 frequency bands.

Who is offering here? What is the subject of the sentence? It’s ”each” (and not ”filter banks”), which refers to a single entity in a group of many, thus being grammatically singular. Changing the sentence a little makes it clearer:

There are two filter banks. Each offers 20 frequency bands.

The link that I copy&pasted is very much about this exact situation. An example from that page:

Each of the golfers wants to win the PGA.

Let’s then morph it into our sentence:

Each of the golfers wants to win the PGA.
Each of the two golfers wants to win the PGA.
Each of the two filter banks wants to win the PGA.
Each of the two filter banks offers 20 frequency bands.

Does it make sense? :)
you are correct - speaking as someone with an honours degree (partially) in Linguistics whose supervisor got his PhD with Chomsky as supervisor

Clause replacement is a handy technique
Each of the two Filter Banks offers 20 frequency bands.
(clarify)
Each, of the two Filter Banks, offers 20 frequency bands
(substitute/remove )
Each offers 20 frequency bands.
Last edited by fairlyclose on Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
19806 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:16 pm

So, Cambridge guys and gals are wrong? Or does it end up going either way in practice?

"When we use each of with a plural noun as subject, it’s normally followed by a singular verb"

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KVRian
797 posts since 4 Jul, 2019

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:24 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:16 pm
So, Cambridge guys and gals are wrong? Or does it end up going either way in practice?
In practice whatever people do is part of the language ie descriptive grammar. But as far as prescriptive grammar goes you have misunderstood the subject as filter banks rather than each - see my example above where I remove that clause and leave a sensible sentence of English.
The confusion comes from reanalysing the sentence as "The two Filter Banks offers 20 frequency bands". which needs "offer" to make sense but you cant get rid of "each" like that and have the sentence make sense in the same way getting rid of "of the two ..." like I show above

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
19806 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:28 pm

Hum, well it still sounds weird to me with the plural verb there. :D I'd literally never use it like that and wasn't taught that way.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


Anyways... this vocoder sounds pretty darn great, I say!

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plexuss
KVRAF
3798 posts since 8 Jul, 2009

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:51 pm

Can you grammar and spelling guys maybe start a new thread?

JerGoertz
KVRAF
2864 posts since 20 Feb, 2004

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:54 pm

Will the Xils 201 correct my grammar in realtime while vocoding?
A well-behaved signature.

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zerocrossing
KVRAF
10217 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:36 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:59 pm
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:10 am
Maybe the non native speakers shouldn't be offering language corrections :p
Maybe, but this non-native speaker has been speaking English since 6 years old (that's almost 30 years of using it in practice), I basically think in English by now.
Especially when they are correct. We all know that Americans are really weak on English, for the most part.
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

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Captain
KVRian
556 posts since 29 Nov, 2002 from Finland

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:17 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:28 pm
Hum, well it still sounds weird to me with the plural verb there. :D I'd literally never use it like that and wasn't taught that way.
I think you are probably having a little confusion here: ”Offers” _is_ a singular verb (”it offers”), and ”offer” is plural (”they offer”).

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KVRian
797 posts since 4 Jul, 2019

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:18 pm

zerocrossing wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:36 pm
EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:59 pm
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:10 am
Maybe the non native speakers shouldn't be offering language corrections :p
Maybe, but this non-native speaker has been speaking English since 6 years old (that's almost 30 years of using it in practice), I basically think in English by now.
Especially when they are correct. We all know that Americans are really weak on English, for the most part.
I'm not from the US and the US has been incredibly creative with English (which is actually a group of languages) ED is still wrong tho from the viewpoint of a normative, prescriptive grammar of English
Last edited by fairlyclose on Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Unqlenol
KVRist
31 posts since 18 Dec, 2014

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:04 pm

Oh, the ironic poetry of arguing about language use for a vocoder. IME, this paticular confusion is extremely common amongst 1st language English speakers.

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
19806 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:57 am

Captain wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:17 pm
EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:28 pm
Hum, well it still sounds weird to me with the plural verb there. :D I'd literally never use it like that and wasn't taught that way.
I think you are probably having a little confusion here: ”Offers” _is_ a singular verb (”it offers”), and ”offer” is plural (”they offer”).
Ha! Well I guess that wraps it up then. Not ashamed to admit I was wrong.

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KVRian
797 posts since 4 Jul, 2019

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:05 am

EvilDragon wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:57 am
Captain wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:17 pm
EvilDragon wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:28 pm
Hum, well it still sounds weird to me with the plural verb there. :D I'd literally never use it like that and wasn't taught that way.
I think you are probably having a little confusion here: ”Offers” _is_ a singular verb (”it offers”), and ”offer” is plural (”they offer”).
Ha! Well I guess that wraps it up then. Not ashamed to admit I was wrong.
sadly/happily this is English - I offer, we offer, my offer, our offer, they offer (singular or plural they) :D

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
19806 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:23 am

Heh, yeah. In Croatian we have proper declension and this is usually not a problem :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65CFesU4KVQ

Lotuzia
KVRAF
10261 posts since 19 Feb, 2004 from Paris

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:58 am

JerGoertz wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:54 pm
Will the Xils 201 correct my grammar in realtime while vocoding?
:) Just what I thought reading last posts. Next gen vocoders will correct English/French/German/Japanese original tracks. 8) Until then .....
http://www.lelotusbleu.fr Synth Presets

77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there

Lotuzia
KVRAF
10261 posts since 19 Feb, 2004 from Paris

Re: Xils 201 (Emulation of Sennheiser VSM 201 Vocoder) (Intro price)

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 2:04 am

kelvyn wrote:
Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:49 am
After a quick workout...
It definitely has a different sound palette than the XILS5000.
Takes more effort to create a discernible articulate understandable vocoder voice than the 5000.
Some more usable vocal presets would be nice, not one of the vocal presets were usable without a tweak, not really liking the FX presets. The 5000 default preset is the bees knees in comparison.
At the moment Logic 10.12 Sierra is doing the little noise bump and then nothing thing. Re-instantiate then it’s fine for a while.
It would be really cool to have an in depth tutorial apart from the manual which is a little ‘Frenglish‘.
I did manage to tweak something nice though...
I’m kinda liking it but I fell ‘head over’ right away with the 5000.
Early days... would be nice to hear if anyone else is getting the Logic problem.
I'll send my 'vocoder/voice' and other patches to Xils. So that people can have different starting points. Then ...
One thing I noticed is that if I sung the same part at different octaves, I have to 'tweak more/less' to get similar clarity, but whatever the settings, the end result will still sound rather different, because of the differences between the takes. So the og signal is very important and will determine the resulting part for a 'quite large' part.
For the Logic thing I'll fw your income to Xils.
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77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there

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