KNIFONIUM synth released

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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KVRAF
2930 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:02 am

BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
But not better than my laptop's 6 core desktop i7 and RTX 2060 combo, which was less than half the price of the cheapest 16" MB Pro you can buy (and it has a 17"display).
Have to point this out, you're not the only one, everyone is doing this, and it's annoying.
The M1's are essentially 6 core machines, 4 Performance an 4 "efficiency" cores. They replace the bottom of the line i5 and i7 four core machines in the line up. With that in mind they perform really well, as good as the 6 core i7 15" Apple put out. Comparing the price of the i9 8 core to the i7 six core is just bad logic. Comparable i9 8 core laptops with great specs like the Zenbook Duo come in at the same price.

Come back at this when the next generation comes out, likely 8 performance cores and 4 efficiency. No one of any logic has claimed in any way that the M1's are bad chips or that they're the best that can be done, it's flatly obvious it's going to be the slowest least powerful chip in a Mac. With that in mind they're dammed impressive. Fanboys have made them seem like they could take on a 32 core AMD, but everyone else is being logical about it.

But for fun put your computer through Cinebench and compare, your 17" desktop CPU is probably at the same level as the M1, but slower in single core tests.
Imagine how much more you could have saved if you'd spent less than 1000 Euros on a gaming PC laptop like mine! I've seen several bands who needed two MB Pros to do what we've always done with one PC laptop. KMFDM and VNV Nation being two that come to mind.
Yeah, you don't understand why people do that, that's all. I saw Kraftwerk with 4 PC's so obviously Macs are better... :dog:

Mike Mcnight uses two Mac minis for Rodger Waters, one is playing exactly the same things in sync. Hundreds of tracks, submixes, they control the lighting etc.


We need the beating a dead horse emoji on this forum like nothing else.
Image

KVRAF
3365 posts since 17 Dec, 2009

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:21 am

BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
Right, and your testing would be far more scientific than anyone else's. I've seen the benchmarks, the M1 is really good at single thread benchmarks but not so good when it comes to multi-threading scores.
uh, can you read benchmarks? R23, GeekBench, TomsHardware all confirm what i said.
BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
Wait on, you just said it was on par with an older i7.
i7 DESKTOP 6-core 65W via rosetta, and better than i9 MOBILE 8-core 45W native
i7 doesn't mean anything without TDP and core count, its a marketing moniker not a performance indicator.

BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
What 16"? According to Apple's website, the 16" MB Pros are still shipping with Intel and AMD guts. You can only get the M1 in a 13" chassis. So at this stage I have to call BS on your whole post.
16" intel. Look at any macbook benchmarks. it's better than 5300M in the 16" and better than i9 9880H in the 16".
It's NOT better than top end 5500m and top-end i9.
BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
But not better than my laptop's 6 core desktop i7 and RTX 2060 combo, which was less than half the price of the cheapest 16" MB Pro you can buy (and it has a 17"display).
I'm not discussing Mac vs PC, i was discussing mac intel vs PC intel. I'm not going down that rabbit hole.
BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
Imagine how much more you could have saved if you'd spent less than 1000 Euros on a gaming PC laptop like mine! I've seen several bands who needed two MB Pros to do what we've always done with one PC laptop. KMFDM and VNV Nation being two that come to mind
I'm not discussing Mac vs PC, i was discussing mac intel vs PC intel. I'm not going down that rabbit hole.
BONES wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 4:21 pm
Do you honestly not see the utter stupidity of that? Basically you are allowing your operating system to decide what musical tools you will use. Don't you think it makes a lot more sense to choose the tools first, then find the OS that best supports them? What you're doing is akin to buying a Lamborghini to drive around the streets of Mumbai.
Yes, i choose tools by the criteria of having good support and are well-maintained.
Your analogy is irrelevant. Instead of buying bargain bin "buy and toss" tools, i buy tools that can be repaired.
My OS preference takes priority over some stupid-ass plugin.
You choose tools however you want to.

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Suspended
11125 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:43 pm

machinesworking wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:02 am
Comparable i9 8 core laptops with great specs like the Zenbook Duo come in at the same price.
No, they are much cheaper, simply because only an idiot pays full price for a PC. My laptop, for example, had a retail price of Au$2799 but I only paid Au$1850 for it because Dell was having a sale. So I got a 9th Gen CPU when everyone else was clearing out their 8th Gen models, for an 8th Gen clearance price. Better still, I only had to pay for the base spec and was able to add a second SSD and quadruple the RAM for just a few hundred bucks without voiding my next day, on-site warranty. When Apple has a sale, you'd be lucky to get more than a couple of hundred off because they know they don't have to do any better to keep the morons coming back for more.
But for fun put your computer through Cinebench and compare, your 17" desktop CPU is probably at the same level as the M1, but slower in single core tests.
It definitely would be but it would also be faster on the multi-core tests from the benchmarks I've seen. But for me it's not about performance, it's about value. I rarely see my CPU above 30% playing audio, compared to it regularly maxxing out rendering 3D scenes or big VFX comps, so I don't see the point in having the latest and greatest for audio work. I'm actually hoping my 2013 Surface Pro 2, with it's Core i5, will be able to handle our live shows.
Yeah, you don't understand why people do that, that's all. I saw Kraftwerk with 4 PC's so obviously Macs are better...
Thing is, they don't trust their Macs enough to have just one, they feel they always need a back-up. To be fair, those guys gig a helluva lot more than we do but we've never had even the tiniest problem with any of our PCs on stage and we rely on them far more, and push them much harder than either of those bands - they only play pre-rendered stems, we do everything "live".

Anyway, this is all very OT and I'm not even going to read Ploki's reply (sorry, mate) or we'll be going on for pages and pages. Suffice to say that Knifonium is awesome!
NOVAkILL : Dell G7 Core i7, 32GB RAM, Win10, Zoom U24 | Studio One | Thorn, bx_oberhausen, ARP Odyssey, JP6K, Hexeract, Vacuum Pro, TRK-01, Knifonium, Equator, VG Carbon, VG Iron | Uno, Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket.

User avatar
KVRAF
2930 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:59 pm

BONES wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:43 pm
machinesworking wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:02 am
Comparable i9 8 core laptops with great specs like the Zenbook Duo come in at the same price.
No, they are much cheaper, simply because only an idiot pays full price for a PC. My laptop, for example, had a retail price of Au$2799 but I only paid Au$1850 for it because Dell was having a sale. So I got a 9th Gen CPU when everyone else was clearing out their 8th Gen models, for an 8th Gen clearance price. Better still, I only had to pay for the base spec and was able to add a second SSD and quadruple the RAM for just a few hundred bucks without voiding my next day, on-site warranty. When Apple has a sale, you'd be lucky to get more than a couple of hundred off because they know they don't have to do any better to keep the morons coming back for more.

You're doing it again, you're comparing a 6 core to an 8 core, and being surprised the cheaper intel chip comes in cheaper.

For fun, the M1 Macbook Air is the same AUD price as your desktop CPU on sale, and it's faster single core wise, probably faster multi core wise.





Thing is, they don't trust their Macs enough to have just one, they feel they always need a back-up. To be fair, those guys gig a helluva lot more than we do but we've never had even the tiniest problem with any of our PCs on stage and we rely on them far more, and push them much harder than either of those bands - they only play pre-rendered stems, we do everything "live".
Again, you don't get it, it's not that it's macs, it's redundancy, any "pro" touring act has backups, hundreds of shows a year equals the possibility of issues that aren't OS related. Hardware fails, fuses blow on amps, power surges can kill anything, solid state drives die, etc. etc.

Your ridiculous hatred of Apple makes you come to silly conclusions like somehow it's that MacBooks are less stable. You've managed to not have issues with your setup, that's great, but it's not indicative of your PC laptops, it's just pure luck, that's all. I've seen acts using both PC and Mac have issues, it has nothing to do with the OS.

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KVRer
22 posts since 24 Jan, 2021

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:49 pm

Never mind PC and Mac. The more important rivalry is transistors vs. tubes. Tubes are superior because they’re more analogue. Hence the better sound.

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KVRAF
5274 posts since 6 Jan, 2017 from Outer Space

Post Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:36 pm

Super Piano Hater 64 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:49 pm
Tubes are superior because they’re more analogue.
The Mars is superior than the Earth because its more planet...
Or a Ford is superior than a Mercedes because its more car...
A Gibson is superior than a Fender because Gibson is bankrupt...

User avatar
KVRAF
2930 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:27 am

Super Piano Hater 64 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:49 pm
Never mind PC and Mac. The more important rivalry is transistors vs. tubes. Tubes are superior because they’re more analogue. Hence the better sound.
No argument, at least not for guitar, tubes are better.

That said I've used Amplitube for years now. A specific sound is cool, but it get overridden by sheer variety.

KVRist
247 posts since 9 Apr, 2005 from Japan

Post Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:03 am

Tj Shredder wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:36 pm
Super Piano Hater 64 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 8:49 pm
Tubes are superior because they’re more analogue.
The Mars is superior than the Earth because its more planet...
Or a Ford is superior than a Mercedes because its more car...
A Gibson is superior than a Fender because Gibson is bankrupt...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlMwc1c0HRQ
Stormchild

KVRAF
4087 posts since 22 Nov, 2012

Post Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:12 am

what the actual f**k do you care what you use unless you are new to the game? use what you think sounds good or follow others.

KVRist
144 posts since 22 Apr, 2019

Post Sat Feb 27, 2021 1:47 pm

Nice synth at the deal price!

KVRist
47 posts since 9 Oct, 2020

Post Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:33 pm

A few questions for people who feel like they could answer:

How well does Knifonium do smooth 80s pad sounds compared to other analogue emulations?

What differences stick out to you between Vacuum Pro and Knifonium?

There’s a remix competition which I’m entering featuring a very 80’s tubey synth bass patch as the backbone of the song, and I thought “time to finally try Vacuum Pro” and immediately got the email from PA about the sale... and Knifonium has seemed interesting, I just wish I knew more about how to draw out the sounds from each (I love sound design, and smooth, and gritty sounds), and to make matters worse I also love the sound of Diva and don’t know how any of these differ. Input is welcome. I’ll probably get Diva within the next few months, so if I’m spending $30 that I could be saving if the Knif is redundant enough between Diva and VPro, maybe I should save.
Last edited by E_Anderson on Sun Feb 28, 2021 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KVRAF
4087 posts since 22 Nov, 2012

Post Sun Feb 28, 2021 3:05 pm

what so many of you seem to be missing, is the velocity comes from the controller/DAW. the velocity switch is a representation of the RANGE of of velocity. OFF is full velocity.

KVRer
11 posts since 14 Oct, 2020

Post Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:14 pm

E_Anderson wrote:
Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:33 pm
A few questions for people who feel like they could answer:

How well does Knifonium do smooth 80s pad sounds compared to other analogue emulations?

What differences stick out to you between Vacuum Pro and Knifonium?

There’s a remix competition which I’m entering featuring a very 80’s tubey synth bass patch as the backbone of the song, and I thought “time to finally try Vacuum Pro” and immediately got the email from PA about the sale... and Knifonium has seemed interesting, I just wish I knew more about how to draw out the sounds from each (I love sound design, and smooth, and gritty sounds), and to make matters worse I also love the sound of Diva and don’t know how any of these differ. Input is welcome. I’ll probably get Diva within the next few months, so if I’m spending $30 that I could be saving if the Knif is redundant enough between Diva and VPro, maybe I should save.

It’s more gritty than smooth I’d say, it can be smoothed out but for me it excels at being a bit mucky :)

KVRAF
4087 posts since 22 Nov, 2012

Post Sun Feb 28, 2021 11:43 pm

it reminds me a whole lot of my old M3X with polyphony. and i'm getting some nice smoothness out of it. you just have to tame the beast.

KVRist
47 posts since 9 Oct, 2020

Post Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:29 pm

After demoing for 5 hours last night between Knif/Vacuum Pro and pulling up some other VA demos (Pigments, u-he), I think I can comfortably pass on the Knifonium. It seems just a little too bent towards aggression for me; the M83 synth pads have been an approximation of the sound I'm going for and even they are somewhat more on the aggressive end (which wasn't immediately obvious because of being layered with strings/other smoothnesses), but the places I was going with the Knif last night didn't leave me thinking it was something I needed over Vacuum Pro, Padshop and Harmor which I think will cover a (very) suitable amount of ground while I save money.

Big thank you to Plugin Alliance for doing that AMPEG giveaway, by the way... What an insane amp emu. I had virtually nothing I was really happy with for distortion, and along comes this distortion unit from Heaven!? AMPEG is actually what initially sold me on Knifonium - but AMPEG was really the star. What a generous gift and community service, thank you Dirk.

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