Let's talk... MIDI keyboards

[tapper mike]

I'm done with keyboards.

While I can play somewhat I never was satisfied with my technique / feel for the instrument. Took lessons knew all my scales, chords, inversions and extensions. Worked out many a song. It never took for me. Spent decades trying.

I'm also done with most alternative midi controllers save the Artiphon instrument one. I know I say this about every gadget that crosses my path. MPE, familiar layout easy to play on a desktop or lap or like a viola or an upright bass or a uke. Still waiting for the strap to play it like a guitar. No it's not as customizable as a linnstrument or a ztar. I'm thinking of getting a second one to extend the range.

[chk071]

Let's talk:

They are all plastic POS that cost way way way more than they should.

Well well. I wonder how you can play such a sophisticated piano piece on such a "POS" then:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JVNYHSBKCI

I would say the prices rather pretty much reflect what you can do for such a price.

[Mister Natural]

started with the standard M-Audio 25key POS - went to a Korg k61p until the USB died (still have it for stage/piano sounds) - then a Novation SL25 first gen which I loved until I decided that I needed more than two octaves. ControlCentre above turned my on to how terrific these models feel and the intuitive LIVE integration. Now using happily the SL61 Mk1. The aftertouch is there but I really don't focus much on it's place in my tunes; it's enough for me to be just barely hanging on to the melody and harmonies here . . .

[acYm]

I'm still on my first keyboard, a trusty x-station49. feels great but always was insanely noisy. I always wondered what I could possibly replace it with. it wouldn't have a control surface (which all suck other than kore2) cause that's a waste of material, only good keys and a quality set of wheels (the x-station joystick is atrocious).

[soundklinik]

Actually I am looking for one...

I had several of them: Novation X station 25, then Remote SLMKII and Roland/Edirol PCR300, which was my favourite, because of easy editing, features and a great simple control panel where everything is instantly available.

But for some reason they (PCR300) got discontinued, no drivers for windows 10 and one day 1/2 of keys were dead Owned it for 10 years!

The closest I found so far is the Roland A300-PRO...less buttons
Is there something similar on the market?

[llze]

I think the A-300 is the direct follower of the Pcr. At least the keys feel very similar.

[wickfut]

Let's talk:

They are all plastic POS that cost way way way more than they should.

Well well. I wonder how you can play such a sophisticated piano piece on such a "POS" then:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JVNYHSBKCI

I would say the prices rather pretty much reflect what you can do for such a price.

Those Novation keyboards are horrible. I had one that lasted a day before returning it for a refund. Sounded like I was playing on a typewriter. Velocity per key was hit and miss, Midi CC sliders were terrible etc.

IMO best controllers outside of full piano action or £1500+ synth keyboards are the Nektar Panorama.

[edit] on closer inspection that's a Novation Impulse. The one I briefly owned was a Launchkey. May be a different keybed?

[jdoo]

Long ago, I had an M-Audio Keystation for soft synth play. It lacked aftertouch, but it was good enough to get back into music, cheaply.
A few years ago, Arturia had a sale on their “The Laboratory” 61 universal keyboard along with V Collection. Loved the aftertouch / feel. Still have it - and use it. Problem I have with it now, is it has something loose / wrong . . and will start shooting out errant MIDI CC messages which flood my setup. I filter them. It is heavy, and has mechanical innards that make it scream for a proper case - if taken out of the studio. I’ve never taken it out of my home studio. It has great feel..
A few years ago, I picked up a 2nd generation AxiomPro 61. It is a fine controller, for what I use it for. I’ve used it with everything from various soft synths, to (more recently) using it to control my OB-6 desktop. It has predictable aftertouch, and enough controllers / buttons to work as a great 'playing' controller. I don’t edit sounds directly with it though.. For that -- the OB-6 desktop has dedicated knobs and buttons Importantly though - I am able to map real-time control messages for live play.
I also have a Korg NanoKey2 that I pack along on trips, for when inspiration strikes. Highly recommend these. More than once, I have been able to tap out songs, while on vacation, traveling, etc.

[SJ_Digriz]

Well well. I wonder how you can play such a sophisticated piano piece on such a "POS" then:

I would say the prices rather pretty much reflect what you can do for such a price.

??? Sophisticated??? It's a non-dynamic regurgitation of every 4 chord pop piano piece of the last 40 years. Other than that, I tend to agree that the controllers are affordable within a certain demographic. And provide a lot of capability for the $$$. Really good controllers are 4x to 5x as much as these type though.

[chk071]

Well, maybe sophisticated was the wrong term. Let's just say, I'm surprised that you can actually play on the piece of shit.

[SJ_Digriz]

Well, maybe sophisticated was the wrong term. Let's just say, I'm surprised that you can actually play on the piece of shit.

This is one of those discussions that get out of hand. There are guys that can play little micro keyboards like crazy. There are guys that can take the worst instruments in the history of man and make them sound great.

I tell this story often, but it explains the point. I went to a Paul Gilbert guitar seminar at guitar center in LA many, many, many, many years ago. He walked in, pulled a schecter off the wall behind him, jacked in and proceeded to shred the shit out of it during the entire seminar. When he was done, he turned around and hung it back up. Of course, we all went over to try it out when he set it back on the wall. It was the worst $250 guitar you can imagine. It was unplayable. Completely out of intonation. Terrible action. The relief was all jacked up etc...

[chk071]

Indeed, no discussion. I don't feel like the Impulse has the worst key action though, considering it's rather entry level, regarding the price. I'm sure there's much better though. It's certainly good enough for me, but, I'm not much of a player.

[SJ_Digriz]

To extend that to the points being made about surgeons with hammers. A really good surgeon might have a shot to do brain surgery even using a hammer... he/she will figure it out. A really crappy surgeon will have an excellent chance to f**k it up with the best equipment available.

[SJ_Digriz]

Indeed, no discussion. I don't feel like the Impulse has the worst key action though, considering it's rather entry level, regarding the price. I'm sure there's much better though. It's certainly good enough for me, but, I'm not much of a player.

I know the action on my Arturia keylab 61 is awful. I use it as my main controller because it fits on my desk, has mapable controls and gets the job done. One of these days I'll get a proper bracket to get my preferred 81 key hammer action controller back under my desk. But, there is nothing stopping anyone from doing excellent things with budget gear (myself excluded, cuz I'm pretty much the crappy surgeon).

[incubus]

Those Novation keyboards are horrible. I had one that lasted a day before returning it for a refund. Sounded like I was playing on a typewriter. Velocity per key was hit and miss, Midi CC sliders were terrible etc.

IMO best controllers outside of full piano action or £1500+ synth keyboards are the Nektar Panorama.

[edit] on closer inspection that's a Novation Impulse. The one I briefly owned was a Launchkey. May be a different keybed?

Not all novations are horrible, but automap is awful.

I have an impulse and it's ok. It's really inconsistent though (the black keys and white keys are VERY different for after touch. But it's still a plastic POS. (and an expensive one at that)

These things should be built better. Akai, feels solid but too stiff. Nektar impulse, ok, but kinda loose and noisy.

Actually, I just had a thought. The NI ones do feel really nice in the store. And they are the only ones that aren't missing a bunch of keys and parts But they are too expensive for what little control you get. And I have no clue about the drivers/compatibility.

Again (completely ignored by one stalker), they are way crappier overall than they need to be but still a necessary evil