(the product formerly known as) Epoch

[starla*]

I would love to beta this too with my modular and expert sleepers Es-3,Es-5 and Esx-8md.

[koalaboy]

I would say I will test on a Surface Pro 3 running win10 but hopefully I will have sold this and gone back to a desktop soon. Has been the clunkiest system I have ever owned - loved win8.1 but win10 has been pretty terrible although maybe the hardware is failing

I have a Surface Pro 2, and whilst it *is* better than a basic tablet, in that I could run any Windows apps on it, and it *would* even run apps like ZBrush to some extent, pretty much everything ended up needing a keyboard for something and the hard-disk speed was atrocious (even though it's flash memory).

I just use it for surfing the net mainly, and occasional remote recording, but my desktop (now back on Windows 7) will always be the way to get anything done.

It's like people who program on laptops - I just don't see how it can compare to a powerful desktop, mechanical keyboard and large monitor.

[woggle]

I would say I will test on a Surface Pro 3 running win10 but hopefully I will have sold this and gone back to a desktop soon. Has been the clunkiest system I have ever owned - loved win8.1 but win10 has been pretty terrible although maybe the hardware is failing

I have a Surface Pro 2, and whilst it *is* better than a basic tablet, in that I could run any Windows apps on it, and it *would* even run apps like ZBrush to some extent, pretty much everything ended up needing a keyboard for something and the hard-disk speed was atrocious (even though it's flash memory).

I just use it for surfing the net mainly, and occasional remote recording, but my desktop (now back on Windows 7) will always be the way to get anything done.

It's like people who program on laptops - I just don't see how it can compare to a powerful desktop, mechanical keyboard and large monitor.

yep - this was a bit of an experiment in work style and the result is that I now know I much prefer a desktop and most likely win7 although 8.1 was pretty interesting. Win10 is a big step back in design

[colin@loomer]

Not only is the entire interface scaleable, you can separately zoom in the graph UI (the view in which you create and wire up modules, although you can also plonk controls here too if you like to do things in the max/msp style) and the panel UI (which is a secondary view in which you can create a interface for your creations, for those who like to do things Reaktor style.) So you can get away with using a fairly low-resolution screen: I often run it on a clunky old Macbook with a 1280x800 resolution, on which it looks fine and is perfectly useable.

Although I am aware of how tight screen resolution can be, which is why the modules now have a much stripped down look: previously, too much screen space was being taken up by long pin label name and bulky module bodies.

[koalaboy]

Not only is the entire interface scaleable, you can separately zoom in the graph UI (the view in which you create and wire up modules, although you can also plonk controls here too if you like to do things in the max/msp style) and the panel UI (which is a secondary view in which you can create a interface for your creations, for those who like to do things Reaktor style.) So you can get away with using a fairly low-resolution screen: I often run it on a clunky old Macbook with a 1280x800 resolution, on which it looks fine and is perfectly useable.

Although I am aware of how tight screen resolution can be, which is why the modules now have a much stripped down look: previously, too much screen space was being taken up by long pin label name and bulky module bodies.

Bring it on

[deastman]

Colin- since you're the only one who has been able to play around with Epoch all this time, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it as a user for the creation of music. I assume you've made a lot of music with it already, or at least bits of music. Do you find that it steers you into certain styles or patterns of arrangement? Does it take you to places you wouldn't otherwise explore? Do you create whole songs in it, or mostly individual parts? Do your patching creations get pretty complex, or do you mostly use just a small handful of modules to achieve the desired results? I'm just curious how you use the tool, given that you're currently the only user.

[colin@loomer]

It makes me compose in a different way, absolutely. I've made efforts to ensure that everything is lock-free and has a well behaved event model. And because you don't get audio hiccups or stutters, or (unlike say, Reaktor), events generated when connecting modules, it encourages a 'live coding' type approach, which is about as close to improv as an electronic musician gets.

I'd say my approach is probably similar to how physical musicians, such as guitarists, would jam with a loop pedal, building things up layer by layer. Sometimes I'll create in a 'music-first' method: add a few sequencers, create some riffs; other times, I'll create using an 'algorithm-first' method, wondering, for example, what if I had two sequencers playing together, and I extract the average of the notes? What if I routed every other note to a different synth? How can I build a pattern from an L-System grammar?

And sometimes, I'll just try random things and be surprised by the results. Recently I stumbled upon a cool compositional approach with the Grid Sequencer (which is a multi-row X0X style sequencer, the usual choice for drum patterns). Each individual cell can be mapped to and toggled with a controller. So, I'll create a pattern, and then map multiple cells to different keys on my PC keyboard. Pressing a key then turns some cells on, whilst turning others off. So with 8 keys toggling different cells, you can actually have 256 different patterns, and evolve them on the fly.

I also tend to put both a Write To MIDI module on the output (which can have as many MIDI input pins as you want, each one corresponding to a track in the generate MIDI file) and permanently enable 'record to audio pool' on the output, just in case I stumble upon something wonderful.

[woggle]

It makes me compose in a different way, absolutely. I've made efforts to ensure that everything is lock-free and has a well behaved event model. And because you don't get audio hiccups or stutters, or (unlike say, Reaktor), events generated when connecting modules, it encourages a 'live coding' type approach, which is about as close to improv as an electronic musician gets.

I'd say my approach is probably similar to how physical musicians, such as guitarists, would jam with a loop pedal, building things up layer by layer. Sometimes I'll create in a 'music-first' method: add a few sequencers, create some riffs; other times, I'll create using an 'algorithm-first' method, wondering, for example, what if I had two sequencers playing together, and I extract the average of the notes? What if I routed every other note to a different synth? How can I build a pattern from an L-System grammar?

And sometimes, I'll just try random things and be surprised by the results. Recently I stumbled upon a cool compositional approach with the Grid Sequencer (which is a multi-row X0X style sequencer, the usual choice for drum patterns). Each individual cell can be mapped to and toggled with a controller. So, I'll create a pattern, and then map multiple cells to different keys on my PC keyboard. Pressing a key then turns some cells on, whilst turning others off. So with 8 keys toggling different cells, you can actually have 256 different patterns, and evolve them on the fly.

I also tend to put both a Write To MIDI module on the output (which can have as many MIDI input pins as you want, each one corresponding to a track in the generate MIDI file) and permanently enable 'record to audio pool' on the output, just in case I stumble upon something wonderful.

this is why we have all kept the faith - incredibly exciting

[Daags]

sounding great Colin : )

[starla*]

screenshot of the drum and note sequencer would be nice if it cant be released this weekend.

[koalaboy]

screenshot of the drum and note sequencer would be nice if it cant be released this weekend.

Time for hype is over.

Release or go home

[deastman]

It makes me compose in a different way, absolutely. I've made efforts to ensure that everything is lock-free and has a well behaved event model. And because you don't get audio hiccups or stutters, or (unlike say, Reaktor), events generated when connecting modules, it encourages a 'live coding' type approach, which is about as close to improv as an electronic musician gets.

I'd say my approach is probably similar to how physical musicians, such as guitarists, would jam with a loop pedal, building things up layer by layer. Sometimes I'll create in a 'music-first' method: add a few sequencers, create some riffs; other times, I'll create using an 'algorithm-first' method, wondering, for example, what if I had two sequencers playing together, and I extract the average of the notes? What if I routed every other note to a different synth? How can I build a pattern from an L-System grammar?

And sometimes, I'll just try random things and be surprised by the results. Recently I stumbled upon a cool compositional approach with the Grid Sequencer (which is a multi-row X0X style sequencer, the usual choice for drum patterns). Each individual cell can be mapped to and toggled with a controller. So, I'll create a pattern, and then map multiple cells to different keys on my PC keyboard. Pressing a key then turns some cells on, whilst turning others off. So with 8 keys toggling different cells, you can actually have 256 different patterns, and evolve them on the fly.

I also tend to put both a Write To MIDI module on the output (which can have as many MIDI input pins as you want, each one corresponding to a track in the generate MIDI file) and permanently enable 'record to audio pool' on the output, just in case I stumble upon something wonderful.

Thank you for this. It sounds like this is going to be so much fun! What you're describing sounds a lot like my approach to my eurorack modular, and I can't wait to apply the same type of experimentation to the MIDI world.

[prupert]

It makes me compose in a different way, absolutely. I've made efforts to ensure that everything is lock-free and has a well behaved event ....) and permanently enable 'record to audio pool' on the output, just in case I stumble upon something wonderful.

Been lurking on this thread since the beginning, watching with interest (and occasional sadness) how the internets treats a developer struggling to balance updates with dev time. The above explanation shows just how awesome Epoch has evolved to be.

Kudos to Colin for dealing with the barage of questions / demands/ rudeness and here is hoping Epoch is the success its ambition indicates it deserves to be. I'm certainly putting a lot of potential purchases on the backburner in anticipation of Epoch's release.

[koalaboy]

Just another bump for the 'how close are we ?'.

There are a fair few bits of software I'm contemplating, and I don't want to use all my slush fund and then see !Epoch be released just after - a lot of the things I'm looking at may become somewhat more redundant once the modular capabilities of !Epoch arrive (it's also interesting to see how many other companies are quietly heading in this direction).

Maybe Santa's sleigh is slightly delayed due to the leaves on the rails, or the wrong (or complete lack of) snow... maybe...

[colin@loomer]

So close, you can taste it. I must admit, I didn't hit the coding as much as would have liked over the Christmas break, but I'm back on it full-time now, very refreshed, and ready to fix those last issues!

Thanks again for the continual support. I trust everyone had a good Christmas too?