How to Make Wavetables?

Official support for: vaz-synths.com
rectus_dominus
KVRian
735 posts since 16 Sep, 2008

Post Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:36 pm

Galbanum wavetable packs would surely reach those Vaz folks!

I'd like these huge waveform packs but at numbers of this handling them causes some mess doesn't it? Like, building wavetables even from the Demo pack is surely a pain in the ass.
And Galbanum, did you think about gathering Analog Synth waveforms like fr4nc3sco did?

As for compiling them myself with an audio tool: I'll try it with Audacity!

EDIT: Still no luck doing that. I seriously can't understand the whole process in theory. Guess, here comes that English is only my second language.
I don't really understand why do I mix the whole set into 1 mono track then 'divide' ? :D Please seriously someone explain this :D
Just let its Sound do the talking: http://www.synthmaster.com/

Shabdahbriah
KVRAF
4813 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:50 am

rectus_dominus wrote:
EDIT: Still no luck doing that. I seriously can't understand the whole process in theory. Guess, here comes that English is only my second language.
I don't really understand why do I mix the whole set into 1 mono track then 'divide' ? :D Please seriously someone explain this :D
You mean this part:
kingtubby wrote:... then opened it in the edit area and divided it up using the 'sampler loops' option in the 'file info' pop-up.
~S~

rectus_dominus
KVRian
735 posts since 16 Sep, 2008

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 12:48 pm

No, the whole idea!
I don't understand why should I mix the stuff into 1 track before dividing it again. I can get Audition and do what you told me, and I'm sure that'll work. But I won't get it.
I don't understand the process itself. I'm not stupid, just nobody told me how do these work. How are these waves stored, handled inside the wavetable files and things like that...

As I don't have Audition, it's essential for me to understand what needs to be done, then I can reproduce it with Audacity if it can do things like that. (Using the same method, or a workaround)

Cheers, David!
Just let its Sound do the talking: http://www.synthmaster.com/

Winstontaneous
KVRian
1386 posts since 15 Feb, 2006 from Berkeley, CA

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:05 pm

rectus_dominus wrote:No, the whole idea!

I don't understand the process itself. I'm not stupid, just nobody told me how do these work. How are these waves stored, handled inside the wavetable files and things like that...

As I don't have Audition, it's essential for me to understand what needs to be done, then I can reproduce it with Audacity if it can do things like that. (Using the same method, or a workaround)

Cheers, David!
I'm with you. That's is why I started this thread!

Obviously scannable wavetables work in VAZ Modular, but there's no native documentation on how to make a wavetable that's recognized as such by the Wavetable Oscillator.

I'm guessing the process is probably more straightforward in the fancy audio editors, but I haven't sussed it out yet in Audacity or Wavosaur.

User avatar
VSTJuNkiE
KVRAF
2487 posts since 18 Jun, 2008 from "nunya"....

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:11 pm

I asked some1 via PM recently about making wavetables with wavosaur as I didn't think/know it was possible, but heres what he said:
VSTJuNkiEs PM wrote: well, in wavosaur (i just tried), you can open multiple files, create a new file, copy the content of one file at a time into the clipboard and paste it at the end of the new file which will become the wavetable. i know it's tedious, but it works.
where has all teh freeware gone ':-o'

Hamfast
KVRer
6 posts since 11 Aug, 2010

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:45 pm

Winstontaneous wrote:Obviously scannable wavetables work in VAZ Modular, but there's no native documentation on how to make a wavetable that's recognized as such by the Wavetable Oscillator.
It is in the manual. RTFM.

I'm not at home otherwise I'd copy/paste exactly what the manual says, but basically it needs to be a .wav file with loop metadata at the beginning of the .wav file.

So if you have a wav file with 64 cycles that are each 256 samples long, you'd set up a loop for the first 256 samples, and Vaz would do the rest.

Seriously. It is in the manual.

Shabdahbriah
KVRAF
4813 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle

Post Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:59 pm

rectus_dominus wrote:No, the whole idea!
I don't understand why should I mix the stuff into 1 track before dividing it again. I can get Audition and do what you told me, and I'm sure that'll work. But I won't get it.
I don't understand the process itself. I'm not stupid, just nobody told me how do these work. How are these waves stored, handled inside the wavetable files and things like that...

As I don't have Audition, it's essential for me to understand what needs to be done, then I can reproduce it with Audacity if it can do things like that. (Using the same method, or a workaround)

Cheers, David!
The following sort-of explains it... I'll embellish it a bit, in orange, and really confuse you. :hihi:

Or, just skip to the end of this post for a simple illustration that should be do-able in "Audacity".
VSTJuNkiE wrote:I asked some1 via PM recently about making wavetables with wavosaur as I didn't think/know it was possible, but heres what he said:
VSTJuNkiEs PM wrote: well, in wavosaur (i just tried), you can open multiple files [a bunch of different "wav" files], create a new file [new as in "blank"], copy[/paste] the content of one file at a time [...] ["into"] [...] the new ["blank"] file [adding each one to the far right edge e.g. "end" of the last one you pasted in, sequentially] [...] [this] will become [be "read" as] the [a] wavetable. i know it's tedious, but it works.
That is essentially it.

From the manual of Vaz 2010:

[On the interface "mode section" select "wavetable"]
Vaz Sample Loader Dialog wrote:Wavetable enables the use of the wavetable position controls in the Wavetable module when a wavetable sample is loaded. Loops points can be set using a sample editing program as with tuning information.

Making Wavetable Samples
A normal wave file will be identified as a wavetable if it fulfills these conditions:
1: the left loop point at the very beginning of the sample.
2: there is more sample data after the end of the looped section.
[e.g.] In other words:

1. The "loop" starts at the beginning of the whole sample.

2. The "loop" ends before more "cycles" are added.

Here is how Vaz READS IT:
The looped section becomes the first wavetable entry and the additional data is split into further entries of exactly the same size.
To reiterate: Vaz "reads" the file left to right, so the key (see below) is in having the "loop" start and end points only in the FIRST cycle of the file, then adding any subsequent files (cycles/samples) after that (to the right-of), and then saving it as ONE (new, 'single') FILE.

I didn't see any reference to "256 samples" (samples per cycle) as mentioned elsewhere, nor a specific number (min/max) of files ("cycles/wavs") that will or won't work, though each "cycle" should have the same number of samples in it. (e.g.) be the same length.

I assume that Audacity/wavosaur (et al) have settings for how a file is "viewed" (soundforge calls it "status"), e.g. "samples", "time", "seconds", "SMPTE" etc.. This can alternately be found by clicking a samples "properties".

For example, the "cycles" below are all "900 samples" (each) and 00:00:00.020 in length (each).

I through together a quicky "wavetable" in SoundForge. I placed numbered "markers" for simplicity, to show each (different) "single-cycle" as it was added, though there would normally be considerably more.

Image

Hope this helps.

~S~

MadGav
KVRian
511 posts since 9 Nov, 2000

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:09 am

Yes, the only conditions are that the loop starts at zero and the file is at least twice as long as the loop, but practically the file should be a series of chunks the length of the loop and the first sample value of each chunk should be the same I.e. 0 to avoid glitching when scanning the wavetable.

Martin

rectus_dominus
KVRian
735 posts since 16 Sep, 2008

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:03 am

Thanks for the replies!
As far as I've tried, Audacity does not seem to support loop points, will try an another soft soon!
Just let its Sound do the talking: http://www.synthmaster.com/

Shabdahbriah
KVRAF
4813 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 3:33 am

rectus_dominus wrote:Thanks for the replies!
As far as I've tried, Audacity does not seem to support loop points, will try an another soft soon!
Click > Wavosaur does "loop-points"

User avatar
VSTJuNkiE
KVRAF
2487 posts since 18 Jun, 2008 from "nunya"....

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 5:58 am

@ Shabdahbriah

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation on how to properly make a wavetable file. This will help a lot and IMO should be made a sticky for those of us(i.e.me!) that are new to this stuff. Thanks again!!
where has all teh freeware gone ':-o'

User avatar
VSTJuNkiE
KVRAF
2487 posts since 18 Jun, 2008 from "nunya"....

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 6:38 am

Quick question. Is putting the loop points at the beginning JUST FOR VAZ or is it for ALL wavetables synths? Thanks.....
where has all teh freeware gone ':-o'

MadGav
KVRian
511 posts since 9 Nov, 2000

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:07 pm

VSTJuNkiE wrote:Quick question. Is putting the loop points at the beginning JUST FOR VAZ or is it for ALL wavetables synths? Thanks.....
In this discussion it's a VAZ thing.

Martin

User avatar
VSTJuNkiE
KVRAF
2487 posts since 18 Jun, 2008 from "nunya"....

Post Wed Aug 11, 2010 7:39 pm

MadGav wrote:
VSTJuNkiE wrote:Quick question. Is putting the loop points at the beginning JUST FOR VAZ or is it for ALL wavetables synths? Thanks.....
In this discussion it's a VAZ thing.

Martin
Okay. Thanx :)
where has all teh freeware gone ':-o'

Winstontaneous
KVRian
1386 posts since 15 Feb, 2006 from Berkeley, CA

Post Thu Aug 12, 2010 9:05 am

Thanks to all for their help.

Couldn't get loops points to save with files in Audacity but Wavosaur does it just fine.

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