advise recording synths with 2404vlz4 to usb

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Hello, getting my 2404vlz online, but running into level issues when recording to audacity via usb. Although my test Blofeld sequence is peeking about 0db on the mixer, the same levels are peeking about -32db in audacity.
Checked all the obvious things like recording levels in audacity and in the sounds setting for record on the PC.
Does anyone have any suggestions to what this might be?
Thanks
Mark
Last edited by zaphod betamax on Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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a) I would look at if same audio drivers are used
I don't remember if Audacity had own settings or use windows audio settings.
b) check what soundcard sensitivity are on inputs -10 dbV or +4 dBu.
Mackie is +4 dBu on my 402VLZ4 at least.
c) check if meter is peak or rms

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I wonder if this is what it is all about?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfSxnlfxRGo
Crazy that 0db on my mixer would not be 0db into the computer.
But I have only been running the 2404VLZ for two days.
I am actually having to use the Monitor Out of the 2404VLZ and fader
to record my Youtube vids as -32db peak is way too low.

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Your Mackie mixer is +4 dBu which is not 0 dBFS(full scale digital). And again, check if peak meters in Audacity or rms. Minus 32 dBFS seems much to low for anything I have encountered. I remember about -18 dB on external meters to keep below 0 dBFS in computer.

So don't compare meters on Mackie to what is in computer and expect the same.

Have a read:
https://web.archive.org/web/20160102151 ... igital.htm

Usb microphones is a way to paint yourself into a corner. A lot of things become awkward doing that - you get one audio device for each mike etc. And every device need syncing not to create pops and crackles and ASIO only allow one device as well. And a mike is only input - and you must have output on another device to hear what you do.

Use one ASIO device soundcard from a vendor that allow flexibility in adding stuff. So something that create some basic channels you need and also have ADAT interfaces for expansion - then you have something that you can grow in.

So RME, Focusrite, Roland, Steinberg or Avid/M-Audio(if still there) - and use regular preamps like in Mackie and mikes into that.

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Never mind, if it will not work out of the box, I will do it old school. Attenuated monitor out into the fz1000 camera. If I bought a mac, would I need any extra input hardware?

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So, riddle me this. The USB is a digital signal that is derived out of the Subs1-4 on the Mackie 2404VLZ.
When it comes back into my deficient Windows PC, what is compelling the signal to DA to a very low
peak of -32db of Audacity units. You also have to understand that regardless if the converted analogue
signal goes to Waveasaur, or even to the Sound controls on Windows, the level is low.

I can live without USB, as I am a live off the floor type of guy, and it was an extra to experiment with.
Also, when I google this I do not find much on people who are recording from a 2404VLZ to a computer.

I wish there was!

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In my Audacity and an RME card with MME/ASIO driver capability - I only see MME in Audacity.
MME is not what you use for music recording, not being low latency drivers.

2404 is supposed to take stereo input from computer and 4 outputs(2 stereo then) to computer.

So what drivers are available - Preferences Devices - in Audacity?
And which inputs - it could be what you hear is just leakage from built in soundcard?

Did you install any drivers for Mackie - or rely on it being class compliant working without?
If class compliant you will see in Windows Sound settings various options and could just as well be that Windows is turning level down. Everything is run through Windows settings.

It could be simple things as a volume in mixer in Windows somewhere.

Did you run a media player to see if things are configured to find output to Mackie?

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Mentioned in op that all windows levels checked. Installed Mackie drivers, makes no difference, level is low. It is now a non_issue, as I have abandoned recording into computer with this computer. Equalizer APO is not a solution either. Will try with another PC next year.

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And you are sure your windows settings refer to Mackie and not the built in soundcard????
I get the feeling you just hear leakage from Mackie over to normal soundcard or similar.

Are you monitoring on Mackie too, or internal soundcard?
If the roundtrip gets normal levels on Mackie out - then there is something where you pick audio in Audacity?

Multiple audio devices is not what Windows is designed for. I've got more permanent solution with internal music soundcard - so I disable built in card on MB in BIOS to avoid any awkwardness.

But really old stuff in Mackie for USB 1.1(according to specs) so don't expect too much. You have to monitor your own playing through mixer and not through Audacity. I wonder if you come down to below 256 samples with this old stuff. 10 years ago RME started to stretch boundaries on how low latency you could get over USB.

You current setup have two routes to take, as I see it:

#1. Install ASIO4ALL and use your internal soundcard and use some software that support ASIO(my Audacity did not show ASIO drivers on XP at least).
Then connect Mackie audio out to that cards input.
There are often ability to set that input to line level - but might be a lost case having +4 dBu from Mackie and line level often mean -10 dBV on consumer products like built in soundcards.

or

#2. Disable internal soundcard in BIOS setup at boot time and have Mackie as only available soundcard as computer is booting.

Then make all settings for sound in windows and try again with some recording software.

Also use ASIO4ALL drivers to get low latency enough for recording if Mackie drivers make to long roundtrip delay for monitoring through computer - or monitor your own playing in mixer. See if WDM is available in Audacity and use that - it should work well.

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Only need to go one way from Mackie to computer, so when I play my rig for a Youtube video I could record the audio directly to Audacity via USB...or so I thought.

Monitoring only on the soundcard, as above, only want to go from Mackie USB to Audacity on Windows PC. All I want is normal levels to record on Audacity, and I understand to turn off PC sounds, as it would be delayed from live.

Will try the ASIO4ALL when I get home from work. and WDM

And yes, I understand that Windows is probably a bit fiddly, but once I figure it out I can buy a much better PC (32G Ram) 7thgen i7, but for now I will try to
solve on my more crappier PC.

Thanks
lfm wrote:And you are sure your windows settings refer to Mackie and not the built in soundcard????
I get the feeling you just hear leakage from Mackie over to normal soundcard or similar.

Are you monitoring on Mackie too, or internal soundcard?
If the roundtrip gets normal levels on Mackie out - then there is something where you pick audio in Audacity?

Multiple audio devices is not what Windows is designed for. I've got more permanent solution with internal music soundcard - so I disable built in card on MB in BIOS to avoid any awkwardness.

But really old stuff in Mackie for USB 1.1(according to specs) so don't expect too much. You have to monitor your own playing through mixer and not through Audacity. I wonder if you come down to below 256 samples with this old stuff. 10 years ago RME started to stretch boundaries on how low latency you could get over USB.

You current setup have two routes to take, as I see it:

#1. Install ASIO4ALL and use your internal soundcard and use some software that support ASIO(my Audacity did not show ASIO drivers on XP at least).
Then connect Mackie audio out to that cards input.
There are often ability to set that input to line level - but might be a lost case having +4 dBu from Mackie and line level often mean -10 dBV on consumer products like built in soundcards.

or

#2. Disable internal soundcard in BIOS setup at boot time and have Mackie as only available soundcard as computer is booting.

Then make all settings for sound in windows and try again with some recording software.

Also use ASIO4ALL drivers to get low latency enough for recording if Mackie drivers make to long roundtrip delay for monitoring through computer - or monitor your own playing in mixer. See if WDM is available in Audacity and use that - it should work well.

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After trying the ASIO4All and whatnot, I gave up and will revisit some other time.
I WAS going to buy a new $2.5k computer, so I could dabble with ITB concerns,
such as simply recording from my 2404VLZ4 to Audacity, but these -32peaks, compared to either the -18 digital level or the +4 analogue level are simply too low.

And if you google, "record from my Mackie mixer to USB" you really do not get many hits, so my research has hit a brick wall. Suggestions to buy a USB souncard are redundant as not only does this ignore that the 2404VLZ has alleged USB outputs,
but also would duplicate the same circuitry contained on the Mackie.

So for now I will record my Youtube audio the old-fashioned way, attentuated monitor out of the Mackie to the FZ-1000.....

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