Waveform Problem Plugins

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PierreG wrote:
netsvetaev wrote:
Have an issue with Eventide Equivocate on Waveform 8.2.0 on Windows 7 x64. Plugin crashes DAW when inserted.

Now worked in 8.2.7. Thank you very much!
Kind of works for me in Windows 10 64 bit. When using sidechain to match a track's EQ, it may or may not crash when selecting different sidechain sources.

When it works (not crashing) the EQ will do it's match thing, yet W will lock up and become unresponsive for a good while during it's matching activity (the plug's GUI is still showing it matching while W is unresponsive). If you're lucky it recovers, if not it may crash or continue to go unresponsive.
Seems like a bunch of bugs related to tracks folders.
1. Waveform crashes, if I trying to sidechain two tracks: one in a folder and second without (at top level), and vice versa. Also daw crashes if I choose sidechain from folder-track to other track without folder. From sidechain menu I can't choose folders, only tracks visible.
2. I can't render track within folder, rendering doesn't starts.
3. I can't choose just one track in a folder to solo without soloing that folder. Then I need to mute other tracks in that folder. Maybe it's not a bug, but I can't understand this behavior.

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I don't know what the status of the Waves issue is, but ever since I upgraded Waveform to 8.2.7, the program no longer sees any of my Waves plugins. Even though the Waves shell VST is in my VST folder, every time I scan that folder for new plugins, the program asks me to point to the folder where the Waves 9.3 plugins are located. I point to the folder (on a different drive) where the plugins are located, and this process continues in a loop, with the plugins never getting recognized.

Does anyone have a similar issue? Waveform saw the Waves plugins in 8.2.0.

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I'm using 8.2.7 and have recently bought a few Waves plugins. They are all working fine.

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Thanks - that is good to know. Could you please tell me where your Waves Shell VST dll and the other Waves folder is located? In other words, did you accept the suggested installation locations when installing Waves?

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I'll have to get back to my daw, but no. I have all of my plugins going into C:programs/cakewalk/vsts or something like that. I moved the shell to this folder.

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Thanks again! I got this sorted out, in that Waveform now sees my Waves plugins again. However, as in version 8.2.0 and 8.2.7, Waves IR-L crashes Waveform as soon as I try to load it. Can anyone successfully open IR-L in Waveform?

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FYI
"PSP MicroWarmer, PSP VintageWarmer and PSP VintageWarmer2 were causing crashes while GUI opening in HOSTs based on JUCE SDK - fixed, ..."
updated by now
just found the message

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New Waves Scheps Omni Channel (channel strip plugin, looks good) doesn't work in Waveform :(
The gui doesn't let you click buttons, move knobs, or choose presets from the built in preset list, it just tries to drag the modules around inside the gui itself (which is a feature, but seems to be the only working bit)

https://www.waves.com/plugins/scheps-omni-channel

Shame, because it looks nice. Also a shame, because i bought it before trying the demo. Damn.
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"

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I never go the Waves demo route... but for some reason I did with the new Scheps Omni. I'm experiencing the same behavior as chico.co.uk.

I'll likely still buy it at the intro price hoping it get fixed later: I'm really impressed with the smooth layout and breadth of features. (It works fine in Studio One).
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2017), 4.2 GHz Intel Core i7
Radeon Pro 580 8 GB
Focusrite Scarlett 4i4 3rd Gen
Waveform 11 Pro/Studio One Pro 3.5

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What I found quite interesting, was I posted a negative (but fair) review of the plugin, to the Waves site, pointing out it doesn't work in Waveform, and giving it a low rating.

Review hasn't shown on their site. Which does explain why every single one of their products always has 4 and 5 star reviews. I got an email saying it was being sent to be moderated, and an email asking me to confirm my email address, so I know they got it. They just don't publish the negative reviews.

Figures.

Incidentally, the point wasn't to slate the plugin, it was to point out to other Waveform users, reading the reviews, that it doesn't work in Tracktion Waveform. And maybe encourage them to look at why. But that doesn't seem to be allowed, by the moderators.
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"

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Honestly, chico, it seems to me that you got it backwards. The problem is at the WaveForm side of the equation, not with Waves plugs, which run very well in every other DAW I'm familiar with. Unfair to downrate the plug instead of the DAW. Maybe try the Scheps out in another DAW and base your rating on that, with a addendum in your review about it not running in WaveForm?

Not trying to start anything flamey, but WaveForm's difficulties with a lot of totally mainstream plugs are why I've deleted it from my hard drive until they fix it. YMMV, of course.

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It's a symbiotic relationship. The host and plugin need to work together. The fault can be on either side. Unfortunately, as previously discussed in this thread, Waves developers do not officially support Tracktion as a host, and currently none of their instrument plugins work in Tracktion, but the error that's reported comes from the plugin itself. But they won't fix it.

So while I see your point, in that it *could* be the host's fault, if one set of devs won't work on it, and the other side is willing to work on it, I'll complain to the devs who work at the company I've paid for their software, who refuse to work with the other devs, to make it work.

Bear in mind I've given Waves money for this software. I should have tried the demo, didn't, so that's my fault, but I'm still a paying customer. They won't give me the money back. So i'd quite like them to take that on board, that paying customers can't use their software, in the DAW they want to use.

You're free to do whatever you like, of course, but as a paying customer, i'll keep going down that route.
Last edited by chico.co.uk on Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"

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I'd add that I don't think it's entirely accurate to say "Waves plugs ... run very well in every other DAW". Some do, some don't. There's issue with various plugs, in various DAWs, which I'd say is entirely to be expected, given the complexity of the problem.

To give another example, Razyoon's Jamstix 4, which I love, the most recent version, didn't work in the most recent version of Waveform, on one of my laptops. I contacted Ralph, at Rayzoon about it, and he suggested I turn on APS mode, in the troubleshooting options, in the plugin. Sure enough, it then works in Waveform.

However, it worked fine in Reaper, on the same laptop, without doing that. So who's at fault there? The host or the plugin?
Reality is, it's a bit of both, they're both trying to implement a fairly ill-defined plugin format, in software. Given you need both, to use the plugins, it makes sense for both sets of devs to work together, if you need them to work.
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"

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I don't think that we violently disagree, chico. I do think that, if Waves doesn't state that WaveForm is one of their supported DAWS, it's less-than-fair to downrate them. WaveForm is pretty niche (and quirky), whereas Waves is not. And WaveForm has lots more problems that incline me personally to assign them the responsibility for the fix, or an open statement that certain things don't work properly. There's a reason that this thread is fourteen pages long.

In any case, not worth fighting over. I'm at the point where I mostly just hope that Tracktion gets WF9 up and running properly. If they do, they get my money. I really like the concept and GUI of WaveForm. But the devs don't seem to really have a path forward for the brokenness that so many of us experience. Not downing them, this stuff is HARD. But I wish they'd own it a little better, maybe host a thread here of acknowledged widespread known issues. But this is mostly really a tempest in a teapot in our small corner of the world, so I think I'm out of the Tracktion forum until about a half a year after WF9 debuts, and hopefully works great.

Incidentally, I'm still waiting for a GUI size fix for JamStix 4, myself. I trust Ralph to take care of it when the initial rush is over.

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I've swapped emails with Waves support about their instrument plugs before now, and their replies say they support 20 daws, listed on a given page, but they review those based on demand. So if you don't tell them you want to use plugs in their daw, they don't know the demand is there. Leaving aside whether that's actually a fair business model, or not. We make plugins, but we won't support them in some hosts, because we don't want to.

The other point is the instrument plugins (by which i mean the clavinet, piano etc, not things like compressors, eqs etc) don't work in the mini Juce host either. Which means they likely don't work in other hosts, built using Juce. So it's not just a Tracktion issue, there's a larger problem they're not fixing. This is across all their instrument plugins.

I don't really care whether they think it's fair to downgrade them because their plugins don't work in some hosts, I do think that's fair. What I find less than transparent, is a published "review" section, on their website, with glowing, rave reviews of their products, which is quite obviously filtered, to remove reviews which don't say their stuff is amazing. I've seen published reviews for the Omni plugin, giving it five stars, where the reviewer says "not had a chance to try this yet, but sure it'll be great". That's just bollocks. Fairness isn't really high on the criteria for which reviews to publish, it seems.

I've also pointed out that one of the 20 hosts they support is Sonar, which is now end of life. So if they're looking to replace it with a different host, hint hint ...

But no, I don't think we disagree too much on this, and I'm not really arguing, just explaining my take on it. I can see where you're coming from
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"

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