dellboy wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:19 amI do blame Tracktion for not making my paid for plugin work in a DAW that I paid for.jabe wrote: ↑Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:01 pm(and one can hardly blame Tracktion for correctly following the VST protocols), I have no idea, but if it were the case, the Juce modules would need changing to allow the shoddy plug-ins to work. I can't really see Juce slackening its standards, so there may be something of an impasse.
I have zero interest in excuses about Tracktion being a superior DAW and blocking a "shoddy" plugin that runs ok in every other DAW you care to name.
As for Tracktion being written in Juce,my memory is that Julian only started to develop that after he sold Tracktion to Mackie. So the original Tracktion was not written in Juce because it did not exist back then.
I have an old CD with Tracktion 1.6 on it and it installed on Windows 10 with no problems. I scanned my old 32bit directory with Air Strike 32 bit in it and it works fine in Tracktion 1.6. Theres progress for you.
jules wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:38 amSigh... the frustrating thing for us is that it IS almost always the fault of a plugin. But we end up getting blamed!
This has always been a massive annoyance, so we added code to detect where a crash happens, so that we can at least tell the users when it's not our fault, and tell them which plugin crashed...
..but nobody believes it! They still blame us, as you've just demonstrated!
The misunderstanding is this: If you load a plugin in Ableton, Logic or Cubase, you can bet that the plugin company tested it heavily in those DAWs, and fixed all the bugs they found, so you'll probably not see many problems in those hosts.
However, that plugin could be riddled with undetected bugs which only get triggered by tiny differences in the way other DAWs use them, but which never got spotted because plugin makers simply don't have the time or patience to test them in every single DAW and host that's out there. I bet most plugins are released without EVER been loaded in Waveform at all.
So then, maddeningly, when a user sees a plugin that crashes in Waveform but not in Ableton, Logic, etc, they (understandably from their point of view!) blame Waveform, and moan to us rather than the plugin company, so the people who could fix the bug never even get told about it!
Dave has done huge amounts of work over the last couple of years to try to get us out of this situation - he's created tools for plugin manufacturers to use to test their plugins better, he's done loads of work on making Waveform recover more robustly when things do go wrong, and made many other stability fixes internally, as well as adding analytics to help us quickly find and fix problems, and we're aiming to have sandboxing at some point before too long, so I really feel I need to step in here and put the record straight!
And please believe us: if Waveform tells you that a plugin has crashed, it's not making that up!
I've seen the insides of many codebases in my long career, and I can assure you that there is ZERO correlation between how "professional" a plugin appears to be, and how well-written the code actually is. Some of the most highly respected plugins out there are full of horrifyingly poor-quality code!
"The misunderstanding is this: If you load a plugin in Ableton, Logic "or Cubase, you can bet that the plugin company tested it heavily in those DAWs, and fixed all the bugs they found, so you'll probably not see many problems in those hosts."