SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Modular Synth design and releases (Reaktor, SynthEdit, Tassman, etc.)
User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Post Wed Oct 22, 2014 8:37 am

Hi,

I'm new to SynthEdit, and I started to learn a bit of it watching some tutorials. Incredible tool, I like is faster way on making things. Brilliant.

Now, I'm faced on a problem that I can't resolve.
I'm trying to create a generator instrument which take MIDI, do some works, than output those MIDI.

For the moment, the "do some works" are break/stop the current midi/voices when I click on a button.
A user suggest me to use this module: http://www.dehaupt.com/SynthEdit/DH_MIDIReset.htm

On attachment you can see my try:
MIDI Breaker.zip
but loading it in my DAW (FL Studio, with Patcher) the MIDI In are not passed to MIDI Out, so before doing any task, I've already got a problem. It does not pass midi from IN to Out.

Can you help me? Where am I wrong?

Here the image of the project:
Immagine.png
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User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:39 am

Ok, I'm able to connect MIDI In to MIDI Out now, and link a MIDI Monitor. It seems that I'm able to catch the incoming MIDI in notes. But it can't output the MIDI to the output?

If in the DAW I link an instrument after my plugin, I only get the MIDI till the MIDI monitor inside the plug; after it they vanish:
Immagine.png
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User avatar
RunBeerRun
KVRAF
7898 posts since 2 Aug, 2005 from Guitar Land, USA

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:51 am

Any outgoing midi needs to be connected to the IO mod, that makes it actually output "of the plugin itself"

it looks to be connected to a module called midi out instead. You'd I guess what the dh midi reset also connected to the io mod. You may want to insert a sound in module outside the main container and connect audio thru(connect in of the io mod back to the io mod for outs), some hosts don't allow midi fx without audio ins and outs.
The only site for experimental amp sim freeware & MIDI FX: http://runbeerrun.blogspot.com
https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCprNcvVH6aPTehLv8J5xokA -Youtube jams

User avatar
antto
KVRAF
2508 posts since 4 Sep, 2006 from 127.0.0.1

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:11 pm

the "MIDI OUT" module is like the "Sound Out" module - it represents your MIDI-out / sound-out device, while you run this thing inside SE
both of these modules (as well as the "MIDI IN", and "Sound In" modules) disappear when you export to VST

if you're exporting to VST - your main Container should have an input pin of type "MIDI" and an output one
then, the exported VST will claim to have a midi input and output

this might be useful:

Image

the MIDI IN/OUT and Sound In/Out modules will be gone once you export, so you don't even have to put them there, i put them because this way you can test within SE
the direct link between the MIDI IN and OUT would make it relay the data, just like it would relay the audio (if you don't drop the gain down, of course)
It doesn't matter how it sounds..
..as long as it has BASS and it's LOUD!

irc.freenode.net >>> #kvr

User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:03 am

Oh I see! So MIDI IN/Out, Keyboard controls, Sound In/Out are just SE plugins, not for VST. For play live into SE.
Yes it works as well now! Thank you very very much!!!

Now, I link that DH Midi reset to the IO Mod, and using a toggle button I send note off to the output (breaking down the current notes playing). It works inside SE (I hear the sound fall down after pressing it, entering the release stage of the internal SE synth), but not on the VST version:
Immagine.png
Where am I wrong now? :(
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User avatar
RunBeerRun
KVRAF
7898 posts since 2 Aug, 2005 from Guitar Land, USA

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 4:09 am

I think that should work, not really a fan of Synthedit 1.1's inconsistencies, I use 1.0....

the only thing I can think of is to try a subcontainer inside the main container, try stuff like midi just going thru that subcontainer, and the dh midireset's output attached to the subcontainer and also main io mod output.
The only site for experimental amp sim freeware & MIDI FX: http://runbeerrun.blogspot.com
https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCprNcvVH6aPTehLv8J5xokA -Youtube jams

User avatar
antto
KVRAF
2508 posts since 4 Sep, 2006 from 127.0.0.1

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 4:39 am

Nowhk wrote:Oh I see! So MIDI IN/Out, Keyboard controls, Sound In/Out are just SE plugins, not for VST. For play live into SE.
yes, except the Keyboard module
that one is valid, you can have it on the VST so that you can play notes via the GUI
iirc, any modules you put outside of the main container are discarded when you export to VST
but the MIDI IN/OUT, and Sound In/Out modules (which represend actual devices in SE) get discarded even if they are in the main container, since they don't make sense.. a VST plugin shouldn't be directly opening the MIDI interface nor the Sound device ;]
Now, I link that DH Midi reset to the IO Mod, and using a toggle button I send note off to the output (breaking down the current notes playing). It works inside SE (I hear the sound fall down after pressing it, entering the release stage of the internal SE synth), but not on the VST version:
Where am I wrong now? :(
first, i would use an external MIDI Monitor plugin (like the one from rs-met.com) to inspect the output of the VST in the DAW
be aware that the DAW itself may process the output midi data from your plugin, and modify it (change/remove some stuff) if it wants
if you don't see your data in the DAW in that setup - do another test: load your exported VST into SE, and attach a MIDI Monitor on its end
SE (at least the 1.0x versions) doesn't seem to change the midi data as far as i can tell
It doesn't matter how it sounds..
..as long as it has BASS and it's LOUD!

irc.freenode.net >>> #kvr

User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 4:55 am

@RunBeerRun: tried your strategy of subcontainer, but it's the same :(

@antto: If I put midiController plug (from the ThePiz) after my VST (so in parallel with the synth I want to play/stop) I can clearly see that "All note off for each channels" are sent (twice, since I've put the module once in the subcontainer, one in the main container, as RunBeerRun suggested):

B0 7B 00 Ch.1 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B0 7B 00 Ch.1 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B0 79 00 Ch.1 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B0 79 00 Ch.1 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B1 7B 00 Ch.2 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B1 7B 00 Ch.2 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B1 79 00 Ch.2 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B1 79 00 Ch.2 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B2 7B 00 Ch.3 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B2 7B 00 Ch.3 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B2 79 00 Ch.3 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B2 79 00 Ch.3 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B3 7B 00 Ch.4 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B3 7B 00 Ch.4 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B3 79 00 Ch.4 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B3 79 00 Ch.4 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B4 7B 00 Ch.5 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B4 7B 00 Ch.5 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B4 79 00 Ch.5 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B4 79 00 Ch.5 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B5 7B 00 Ch.6 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B5 7B 00 Ch.6 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B5 79 00 Ch.6 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B5 79 00 Ch.6 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B6 7B 00 Ch.7 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B6 7B 00 Ch.7 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B6 79 00 Ch.7 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B6 79 00 Ch.7 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B7 7B 00 Ch.8 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B7 7B 00 Ch.8 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B7 79 00 Ch.8 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B7 79 00 Ch.8 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B8 7B 00 Ch.9 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B8 7B 00 Ch.9 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B8 79 00 Ch.9 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B8 79 00 Ch.9 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B9 7B 00 Ch.10 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B9 7B 00 Ch.10 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
B9 79 00 Ch.10 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
B9 79 00 Ch.10 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BA 7B 00 Ch.11 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BA 7B 00 Ch.11 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BA 79 00 Ch.11 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BA 79 00 Ch.11 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BB 7B 00 Ch.12 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BB 7B 00 Ch.12 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BB 79 00 Ch.12 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BB 79 00 Ch.12 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BC 7B 00 Ch.13 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BC 7B 00 Ch.13 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BC 79 00 Ch.13 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BC 79 00 Ch.13 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BD 7B 00 Ch.14 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BD 7B 00 Ch.14 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BD 79 00 Ch.14 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BD 79 00 Ch.14 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BE 7B 00 Ch.15 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BE 7B 00 Ch.15 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BE 79 00 Ch.15 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BE 79 00 Ch.15 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BF 7B 00 Ch.16 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BF 7B 00 Ch.16 CC #123 (All Notes Off), Value: 0
BF 79 00 Ch.16 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0
BF 79 00 Ch.16 CC #121 (All Controllers Off), Value: 0

But synth won't stop to play. It's the same result that I have using RobotArms http://runbeerrun.blogspot.it/2014/09/o ... dated.html , but there it really stop instrument to play.

So, where can be the trouble?

User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 5:18 am

A developer of the DAW I use (FL Studio) says to me right now "Native FL plugins don't respond to midi messages, in general.".
So, how do you deal with it RunBeerRun? I think that plugin can't be useful. MIDI Filter module? Can't see any Gate there...

User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Oct 23, 2014 6:32 am

I think I've got it...

IO Mod and DH_MIDI Reset linked to MIDI To CV, which is linked (gate, pitch, velocity) to Trigger to MIDI. When I send to MIDI To CV All notes off, it "stops" the current playing ones.

Is it the right way?

mztk
Banned
2667 posts since 13 Jun, 2004

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:09 am

there is also DH Midi out, where you can specify your MIDI bus

User avatar
Nowhk
KVRian
873 posts since 2 Oct, 2013

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:53 am

It changes the PORT dynamically, yes, but does not "block" audio streaming, because in fact switch to another output immediatly (with a "frozen system" effect).

What can do the job is to "STOP" output MIDI outside the VST when I send a All Midi Off inside SE (with that DH MIDI Reset). Or convert the current Note On to Note Off, but I think I cannot do this.

i.e. what could work is a sort of on/off at rules in http://www.dehaupt.com/SynthEdit/DH_MIDIMunger.htm

Mineralhillsworkshop
KVRer
23 posts since 13 Jul, 2018

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:34 pm

Last edited by Mineralhillsworkshop on Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mineralhillsworkshop
KVRer
23 posts since 13 Jul, 2018

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:49 pm

Wow. RIP Synthedit Gathering. Seems like this site had everything. https://web.archive.org/web/20111124203 ... /index.php

User avatar
nix808
KVRAF
3802 posts since 22 Jul, 2006 from Tasmania, Australia

Re: SynthEdit - Midi Filtering

Post Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:07 pm

Maybe everyone wants to code in x64 now?
I hear quite some modules are available for the new standard,
but all that awesome stuff in x86 may be a little discarded now.
Hopefully we'll see SE re-emergent in a powerful form-
and 3rd party resource/discussion fora etc.
I've got to pick it up again myself and see how robust the build is and keep tabs on it
Personally I have moved to x64 for playing music

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