Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Official support for: bitwig.com
askewd
KVRian
738 posts since 6 Nov, 2004 from UK

Post Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:44 am

I'm not exactly sure what grain delay sounds like in ableton, but check out a fantastic granular sample mangler called "granite" by a company called New Sonic Arts. It's VERY cool.

Sorry if not exactly the same but thought I'd mention this anyway.

8)

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Aiynzahev
KVRAF
3566 posts since 29 Jun, 2011 from USA

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Fri Nov 21, 2014 7:00 am

askewd wrote:I'm not exactly sure what grain delay sounds like in ableton, but check out a fantastic granular sample mangler called "granite" by a company called New Sonic Arts. It's VERY cool.

Sorry if not exactly the same but thought I'd mention this anyway.

8)
Its cool, but its not an effect.
Aiynzahev-sounds
Sound Designer - Soundsets for Repro, Diva, Virus TI, Nord Lead 4, Serum, DUNE2, Spire, and others

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Aiynzahev
KVRAF
3566 posts since 29 Jun, 2011 from USA

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Fri Nov 21, 2014 7:02 am

jaggedarray wrote:
Aiynzahev wrote:
billcarroll wrote:
Aiynzahev wrote:
billcarroll wrote:
Aiynzahev wrote:I hear you. I think the two I liked most from Ableton were Grain Delay and Beat repeat. Just need to find substitutes that don't break the bank.
I'd assume Effectrix or Stutter Edit would replace Beat repeat?

Have you found anything that replaces Live's Grain Delay?
I think Absynth FX might be able to replace Grain delay, but it loses the simplicity.

Effectix could likely replace Beat repeat. But I don't think it has a probability or variation setting. It's also more complicated again, but just a little. It's also another $100 or so.
I hadn't thought of using Absynth FX. Thanks. :)
Tons of presets on the FX version too. Haven't even begun to make my own yet.
.

You can replace beat repeat with replicant http://www.audiodamage.com/ef ... ?pid=AD013by Audio Damage, only 50 bucks and way more functional.
I think I owned this once, I didn't like its function
Aiynzahev-sounds
Sound Designer - Soundsets for Repro, Diva, Virus TI, Nord Lead 4, Serum, DUNE2, Spire, and others

sys2074
KVRist
476 posts since 26 Oct, 2006

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sun Mar 15, 2015 10:36 am

Now I'm curious about Bitwig, too. Can somebody tell me two things? ...

How good is Bitwig's MIDI editing? I still remember that MIDI is rather poor in Live so how is it in Bitwig? I like Cubase's MIDI editor (but I hate many other parts of Cubase).

How is hardware instruments & effects integration in Bitwig? Somebody wrote that this is still messy? How well does it work? I use mainly hardware synths so this is important for me.

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irre
KVRAF
4390 posts since 21 Jan, 2008 from oO

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sun Mar 15, 2015 11:32 am

sys2074 wrote:Now I'm curious about Bitwig, too. Can somebody tell me two things? ...

How good is Bitwig's MIDI editing? I still remember that MIDI is rather poor in Live so how is it in Bitwig? I like Cubase's MIDI editor (but I hate many other parts of Cubase).

How is hardware instruments & effects integration in Bitwig? Somebody wrote that this is still messy? How well does it work? I use mainly hardware synths so this is important for me.

just check out the demo and decide yourself..

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operator
KVRist
215 posts since 6 Jan, 2015 from Austria

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sun Mar 15, 2015 12:49 pm

Aiynzahev wrote:
askewd wrote:I'm not exactly sure what grain delay sounds like in ableton, but check out a fantastic granular sample mangler called "granite" by a company called New Sonic Arts. It's VERY cool.

Sorry if not exactly the same but thought I'd mention this anyway.

8)
Its cool, but its not an effect.
Try to use u-he´s Uhbik-G (grain and pitch effect) inside the delay feedbackFX... i get the best results out of 2 Uh-Gs seriel in the feedbackFX... try to compensate the amount of the first effect with the second instance
e.g.: if you reverse Audio on the first Uh-G (Scale: negative 1) maybe you´d like to reverse it also on the second only with another grainsize... or on the first you Pitch up on the second down with different grainsizes... or go crazy... :clown: :hyper: :clown:
Die Trying...

sys2074
KVRist
476 posts since 26 Oct, 2006

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sun Mar 15, 2015 8:51 pm

Suloo wrote:
sys2074 wrote:Now I'm curious about Bitwig, too. Can somebody tell me two things? ...

How good is Bitwig's MIDI editing? I still remember that MIDI is rather poor in Live so how is it in Bitwig? I like Cubase's MIDI editor (but I hate many other parts of Cubase).

How is hardware instruments & effects integration in Bitwig? Somebody wrote that this is still messy? How well does it work? I use mainly hardware synths so this is important for me.

just check out the demo and decide yourself..
Ok ok, I'm going to download the demo already.

sys2074
KVRist
476 posts since 26 Oct, 2006

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sun Mar 15, 2015 11:40 pm

Had a couple of hours to play with the demo...

Well, maybe in a year it might be a choice for me. I like that it is 'mostly' quite intuitive but there a too many things that are missing, like storing device chain templates and such elementary things like *gasp* audio normalize. Quantizing audio is too confusing. If it takes me more than 5 minutes to figure out it's too complicated (in Cubase it's even more confusing). Reason does this wonderfully simple and intuitive.

I like Bitwig better than Live but it does look alot like Live with a sterile, grey UI akin to Native Instrument products. This is not very inspiring to me to be honest.

The plugin sandboxing is a big plus but at the end of my session the whole DAW just crashed to desktop! :-/

xbitz
KVRAF
2329 posts since 3 Oct, 2013 from Budapest

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 12:15 am

sys2074 wrote:like storing device chain templates /
preset.png
it's working using BWS own preset system, and working on clip based too (so dropping a clip to the browser also can save the affected track devices)
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"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

She Changed Her Mind
Banned
452 posts since 22 Nov, 2014 from Amsterdam

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 2:01 am

I guess any sensible comparison could be made in about 6 months.

woodsdenis
KVRAF
1517 posts since 25 Feb, 2005

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:19 am

Ableton is a lot more mature with loads of extra features, I prefer to use Bitwig. Comparisons a lot of the time are pointless, it all depends on the individuals workflow and needs. I am finding BWS great for workflow and inspiration , which is what I want from it. I wouldn't want to score a movie on it though, horses for courses etc.
Mac Pro
10.12.6 Digi 96 io
Cubase 9, Ableton Live 9.7, Bitwig 1.3

SLiC
KVRAF
3297 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:38 am

Yup- BWS great for workflow and inspiration, love the way the wigs think for so many things -BUT I am getting way to many crackles and pops at fairly low CPU use, Live and Cubase don't give me these issues (I can load a lot more VSTis or get a lot more polly on hungry VSTs in Live, maybe 5x better performance!... maybe something to do with multiple core use, I'm on an i7)
i7 Win 10 + Surface, BWS, StudioOne 4, X32 Desk. Rubicon R8s, DM12, P8, Virus TI, Syst1m, 500hp Eurorack, Elektron A4, RYTM, OT, Heat, Digitone, MPC Live, OP-Z, Mother+DFAM, Drums, Guitars, Basses and Amps

askewd
KVRian
738 posts since 6 Nov, 2004 from UK

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:09 am

SLiC wrote:Yup- BWS great for workflow and inspiration, love the way the wigs think for so many things -BUT I am getting way to many crackles and pops at fairly low CPU use, Live and Cubase don't give me these issues (I can load a lot more VSTis or get a lot more polly on hungry VSTs in Live, maybe 5x better performance!... maybe something to do with multiple core use, I'm on an i7)
Is that a mac?

Are the buffer settings the same between apps?

It's just that I have an i7 mac and tested it vs logic X (considered an efficient daw) and the tests shows that bitwig latest versions could handle same number of plugins.

Although there are more crackles when moving the screen around (ie scrolling, zooming etc)

Dale

gnosis123
KVRist
131 posts since 11 Apr, 2011 from Paris, France

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:13 am

In spite of its youth, I find BWS more robust than my other two warhorse DAWs, Live and Cubase. It sandboxes plugins, for one thing, which is great. Cubase and especially Live both blow chow pretty regularly, leading to loss of work, complete project reload, and frustration. Live also has that annoying Indexer that scans *everything* without giving me any choice, bringing my laptop to its knees. BWS also lets you decide the disposition/rescanning/etc of plugins on an individual basis. I've always wondered why other DAWs don't do something so simple, useful, and obvious.

BWS is a modular, very well thought out piece of software that learned all the right lessons from its predecessors. The Integrated Modular System will probably give them many of the cool things about Max, but built-in by design, rather than tacked-on as an afterthought, like M4L. The features BWS lacks matter relatively little to me. The main reason I still use Live and Cubase at all is because of the proprietary content I've accumulated. That's where I hope BWS will put more of their effort. Don't really care about network-based jamming or the like.

SLiC
KVRAF
3297 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:36 am

askewd wrote:
SLiC wrote:Yup- BWS great for workflow and inspiration, love the way the wigs think for so many things -BUT I am getting way to many crackles and pops at fairly low CPU use, Live and Cubase don't give me these issues (I can load a lot more VSTis or get a lot more polly on hungry VSTs in Live, maybe 5x better performance!... maybe something to do with multiple core use, I'm on an i7)
Is that a mac?

Are the buffer settings the same between apps?

It's just that I have an i7 mac and tested it vs logic X (considered an efficient daw) and the tests shows that bitwig latest versions could handle same number of plugins.

Although there are more crackles when moving the screen around (ie scrolling, zooming etc)

Dale
PC, Win 7 3.7Gz i7 Ivy Bridge (16 Gig Ram, SSD, NV 560ti Graphics Card) - Fast audio only machine, I am not used to getting any kind of audio glitching unless I really push things, I get crackles in BWS with one instance of ACE!

I would argue if there are crackles for ANY reason then it isn't handling things very well, as things on the screen are animated/scrolling....)
i7 Win 10 + Surface, BWS, StudioOne 4, X32 Desk. Rubicon R8s, DM12, P8, Virus TI, Syst1m, 500hp Eurorack, Elektron A4, RYTM, OT, Heat, Digitone, MPC Live, OP-Z, Mother+DFAM, Drums, Guitars, Basses and Amps

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