Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Official support for: bitwig.com
xbitz
KVRAF
2286 posts since 3 Oct, 2013 from Budapest

Post Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:41 am

personally I miss the multi-clip editing feature best from AL, so in BWS u can try out many scene variations quickly with it (or can emulate the ghost/linked clips in the arrangement view)

Image

it's working only with MIDI but quite big help (copying automations also much faster)
"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

sacer
KVRist
467 posts since 8 Jan, 2012 from frankfurt, Germany

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:18 am

Aiynzahev wrote:
billcarroll wrote:
Aiynzahev wrote:I hear you. I think the two I liked most from Ableton were Grain Delay and Beat repeat. Just need to find substitutes that don't break the bank.
I'd assume Effectrix or Stutter Edit would replace Beat repeat?

Have you found anything that replaces Live's Grain Delay?
I think Absynth FX might be able to replace Grain delay, but it loses the simplicity.

Effectix could likely replace Beat repeat. But I don't think it has a probability or variation setting. It's also more complicated again, but just a little. It's also another $100 or so.

there is a freeware dbglitch from Illformed which was the inspiration or predecessor for effectrix.

As more synths and effects i own, I barely use Ableton effects, synths and samplers, I only use some M4L apps, the great midi tools and racks to structure my tracks from ableton.

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u-u-u
KVRian
908 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Wed Mar 25, 2015 12:15 pm

xbitz wrote:personally I miss the multi-clip editing feature best from AL, so in BWS u can try out many scene variations quickly with it (or can emulate the ghost/linked clips in the arrangement view)

Image

it's working only with MIDI but quite big help (copying automations also much faster)
Great tip! THX, xbitz :tu:

mahhest
KVRer
11 posts since 24 Mar, 2015

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Wed Mar 25, 2015 5:59 pm

Ive been using FL Studio for years, though I have a copy of Ableton and Pro Tools (Ive never finished anything in Ableton, but I actually know how to use Pro Tools) and I can say BitWig is by far the easiest to use. Idk bout yall, or how yall produce music, but BitWig simplified the most important tasks for me. I would rarely alter sounds in FL Studio, I just had a soundfont player with around 3000 sounds I gathered, but I'm much happier using BitWig's modulation system. Which is incredible by the way. I recommend the Demo at least for this, and if you like it as much as I do, I would make the switch. I don't think BitWig is a top of the line DAW just yet though. There are a few things that need to be cleaned up, but nothing that will prevent you from getting what you want done. So I wouldn't abandon a well-mastered DAW for this, but if you just love making music, and want more effort put into the ability to make the music rather than the broadness of the music-making capabilities, BitWig is the way to go.

I just wish the community was more active. I have been searching long and hard for an Akai MAX49 script, to no avail whatsoever. I just hope someone with the MAX49 and some JavaScript expertise gives BitWig a try and publishes a Controller Script finally...its only been a year lol.

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HamHat
KVRist
301 posts since 28 May, 2013 from Utah

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:16 pm

Bitwig is the future, everything about this program i already love. It's missing a few features here and there and it's biggest hold back is the software it self is not polished yet. But i'm guessing by time it hits v3 it will have all the bugs fixed and all the awesome features you could ever need. So I will gladly support the company until it gets there.

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StudioDave
KVRian
962 posts since 23 Jun, 2007 from Findlay OH USA

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:01 am

Greetings,

Ardour has been my DAW for as many years as it's been available. Much of my work is worlds away from EDM and other pop styles - I do a lot with Csound - so I've rarely required beat-matching/slicing/wacking/whatever, nor have I needed many plugins. I've been using Bitwig for a solid year now, it's become a mainstay in my work, thanks mostly to its proliferation of features useful to the experimental composer. The histogram control is terrific, the modulation capabilities are a joy, and the track editor is a real pleasure to use. Ditto for the MIDI and automation editors.

Things I like in Ardour I'd love to see in BWS:

Full track resizability. Ardour permits free vertical and horizontal resizing of the tracks, BWS is limited to "big and not-so-big" vertical views. It's not a show stopper, but the feature is hugely useful when I work in Ardour.

Freesound portal. Ardour includes an nice UI to access the database at Freesound.org. Sometimes I use it to kick-start the creative process, it's altogether a very handy utility.

Soundcloud connection. Ardour lets me post my exported audio directly to my SoundCloud account. Again, nothing earth-shaking, just a useful feature.

Full JACK support. Of course, Ardour has complete JACK support, not surprising when Paul Davis has authored both Ardour and JACK. The experimentalist in me is all lathered up for JACK master transport control over both applications. :)

Full support for MTC/MMC. In lieu of or in addition to a complete JACK implementation.

More extensive plugin support for Linux. FalkTX's excellent Carla plugin brings all LADSPA/LV2/DSSI plugins into Bitwig, but I'd like to see direct support for LV2 in BW. I know it's on the TODO, I'm just sayin' ...

Ardour also includes some neat features for controlling multiple mutes/solos. When working with a boatload of tracks it's nice to be able to mute or solo groups.

Maybe it's just me, but while Ardour "feels" like a conventional (but very powerful) DAW, Bitwig feels more like a very powerful instrument (with a complete DAW), one I've been learning how to play for the past year. And no, I'm not interested in it as a performance instrument, it just feels like one.

So much to like and appreciate in both applications. Both are fundamental here at Studio D. I doubt BW could replace Ardour for me at this point, but then it doesn't have to replace it. I like 'em both and I'll continue to use both. Given the recent wonderful evolution of my other favorites - Csound, SuperCollider3, Pure Data, RTcmix - I am indeed wallowing like a hog in the fat-house.

Best,

dp

Matt Riley
KVRist
33 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:45 am

I would love to be able to do this in Bitwig:
1. Select midi notes
2. Go to the velocity editor
3. Hold down Command and click/drag and crescendo with only the selected notes being affected. In Ableton, a dotted line shows up as I drag.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xbJa ... sp=sharing

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u-u-u
KVRian
908 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 7:26 am

StudioDave wrote:Ardour also includes some neat features for controlling multiple mutes/solos. When working with a boatload of tracks it's nice to be able to mute or solo groups.
In BwS: just select multiple tracks and adjust Solo/Mute/Arm/Pan/Volume in the inspector.
And groups in 1.2 probably will make it even easier.

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StudioDave
KVRian
962 posts since 23 Jun, 2007 from Findlay OH USA

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 7:40 am

u-u-u wrote:
StudioDave wrote:Ardour also includes some neat features for controlling multiple mutes/solos. When working with a boatload of tracks it's nice to be able to mute or solo groups.
In BwS: just select multiple tracks and adjust Solo/Mute/Arm/Pan/Volume in the inspector.
And groups in 1.2 probably will make it even easier.
Thank you, a real time-saver. :tu:

dp

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u-u-u
KVRian
908 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 7:41 am

StudioDave wrote:
u-u-u wrote:
StudioDave wrote:Ardour also includes some neat features for controlling multiple mutes/solos. When working with a boatload of tracks it's nice to be able to mute or solo groups.
In BwS: just select multiple tracks and adjust Solo/Mute/Arm/Pan/Volume in the inspector.
And groups in 1.2 probably will make it even easier.
Thank you, a real time-saver. :tu:

dp
Thank the devs! ;)

takaii
Banned
1601 posts since 29 Sep, 2014 from Halmstad, Sweden

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 8:27 am

Matt Riley wrote:I would love to be able to do this in Bitwig:
1. Select midi notes
2. Go to the velocity editor
3. Hold down Command and click/drag and crescendo with only the selected notes being affected. In Ableton, a dotted line shows up as I drag.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xbJa ... sp=sharing
Use inspector for this on selected notes ;)
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Matt Riley
KVRist
33 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Thu Mar 26, 2015 8:51 am

ronnyrydgren wrote:
Matt Riley wrote:I would love to be able to do this in Bitwig:
1. Select midi notes
2. Go to the velocity editor
3. Hold down Command and click/drag and crescendo with only the selected notes being affected. In Ableton, a dotted line shows up as I drag.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xbJa ... sp=sharing
Use inspector for this on selected notes ;)
Not a solution at all. Doesn't make a crescendo.

JBlongz
KVRist
122 posts since 29 Jun, 2010 from NYC

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:49 am

Background: I use Live since 2004 (over 3,000 projects) for creative work, Logic since version 8 for my personal mixing , ProTools for clients and collaborations, Reason when I'm bored. I am doing new projects in Bitwig and plan to keep it that way...using the other DAWs only for old projects.

Ableton core Advantages:
-independent grooves per clip
-group tracks (coming soon to Bitwig)
-decent sound library (Suite version)
-auto-truncate clips (Live knows you wanted an 8-bar loop when you went slightly over).

Bitwig core Advantages:
-bounce midi clip to audio while retaining track's midi functionality
-Enhanced Interface and multi screen support
-tabbed projects
-Better browser (still needs some tweaks)

Bitwig feels like a fusion of Live and Logic. Yes there are many improvements to be made, but no DAW that I know of has been well-featured at version 1.x as BitWig. The included devices and future modular ideas are great...but most of us who do this for a living are NOT planning to ditch our VSTs and custom libraries. So we professionals look more closely at the features of the sequencer, quality of the sound engine, and workflow. Bitwig is on the right path to become a serious competitor.

Lets be clear...Ableton is more mature at the moment, but maturity will only increase with support, feedback, and patience. Bitwig have some advantages over Live out of the box. Both DAWs have similarities that put workflow ahead of the other companies.

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HamHat
KVRist
301 posts since 28 May, 2013 from Utah

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sat Mar 28, 2015 4:27 am

Matt Riley wrote:I would love to be able to do this in Bitwig:
1. Select midi notes
2. Go to the velocity editor
3. Hold down Command and click/drag and crescendo with only the selected notes being affected. In Ableton, a dotted line shows up as I drag.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xbJa ... sp=sharing
Going to have to second this, I use the line tool so much in midi data for smooth crescendos.

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u-u-u
KVRian
908 posts since 31 Mar, 2014

Re: Bitwig vs Ableton and other DAWs. User thoughts please!

Post Sat Mar 28, 2015 5:29 am

HamHat wrote:
Matt Riley wrote:I would love to be able to do this in Bitwig:
1. Select midi notes
2. Go to the velocity editor
3. Hold down Command and click/drag and crescendo with only the selected notes being affected. In Ableton, a dotted line shows up as I drag.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xbJa ... sp=sharing
Going to have to second this, I use the line tool so much in midi data for smooth crescendos.
It takes some more time than this line but you can achieve pretty decent crescendi with this:
Start with 2 notes with different velocities. Then make clever use of the histogram for velocity (the Mean and Spread parameters are your friends) and duplicate the notes. For turning it into a decreshendo, use the 'reverse pattern' function. Of course it's a bit more tricky for parts where you already have the notes and want to apply a crescendo to them.
1 Crash'n'Do short.PNG
2 Hist O'Gram.png
3 Crash'n'Do long.PNG
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