KClip 3 - Early Access Download

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Tp3
KVRAF
2118 posts since 8 Feb, 2007

Post Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:45 pm

Can see the installer, not the license.

I tried to register offline - not luck here either.

Support ticket has been submitted.
What is best ? How do you define 'best'? If you're talking about what you can think, what you can feel, what you can listen and hear, then 'best' is simply marketing signals (ie. hype) interpreted by your brain.

Eleventh
KVRist
317 posts since 1 Dec, 2012

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:08 am

Hey, congrats on the release. Checking it out now. And I've got a couple items of feedback about the interface already :D

1. No threshold indicator in the waveform view. I just checked GClip's implementation and it's not very accurate, i.e. peaks that pass through the threshold into clipping are dimmed in the visualizer, but they're still present in the signal accoring to a following oscilloscope. Is this difficult to implement? I mean a proper visual cue for the threshold would be very useful in my opinion. Pre/post signal overlayed?

2. Still no fine adjustment modifier for the mousewheel :) please also add to other plugins when you have time.

3. The FFT visualizer is a bit jarring. Is there a technical reason for this or could it be made smoother? Could also maybe benefit from pre/post overlay?

4. The knob tooltips are just displaying an empty transparent box here, Reaper x64, Win7SP1

(5. a "projected lufs" mode, which would show the LUFS as if the link button was not engaged)

6. the "clipped" meter is not accurate at all. For example switching between Crisp and Germanium totally changes the peak level, but this is barely reflected in the meter.

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Robert Randolph
KVRAF
2111 posts since 25 May, 2003 from Saint Petersburg, Florida

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 6:37 am

Kazrog wrote:
Robert Randolph wrote:
Kazrog wrote:You sure you have 3.0.1? The knob throws have been carefully adjusted since the prerelase version. 3.0.1 should display its version number by the logo.
Yes. I have 3.0.1

I can make a video of this behaviour tomorrow morning for you if you need.
I appreciate the offer, and info. No video is needed, I believe what you're saying. The knob throws are set specifically with the most typical use cases in mind, though.
The knobs are ok-ish if you're working with a high RMS/LUFS signal. The issue I see is that when you're using kclip on a signal that's at average mix levels.

I'm providing a gif below. I have a signal (cut out bit of a dense speed metal guitar part, looped) that's turned up to 0dbVU (-18dbFS calibrated). I centered the kclip GUI on my screen.

This is a scenario where I would definitely use kclip in a mix, and at the levels I'd likely experience.
  • In order to begin using the threshold control I have to totally bottom out my mouse cursor at the bottom of the screen. Then I have to reselect the control again to begin to tune it.
  • I can't set it to 100% Mid mode without dragging the control twice.
  • I can only set it to 35% dry without dragging the control twice.
  • Max ceiling that I can set is -10.9db without multiple drags.
  • With soften at 100%, I can just barely set it to 0% without multiple drags. If the GUI is slightly below centered on the screen then I can not get to 0%.
This experience just ends up with lots of mouse lifting, resetting cursor position, having the hidden dock (or taskbar) popup, etc...

In the context of using kclip for mastering I understand that the signal will be higher and that use of linked in/out controls may be preferred over threshold, and that threshold has enough throw. Ceiling likely would be set to -0.1 or -0.2. The wet/dry controls are still annoying to use, and soften is still bothersome.

That said, I am thankful that you don't capture the mouse cursor and release it over the center of the knob. If you decide to implement a solution, please keep this.

---

Sidenote, I believe I just noticed a bug in the .gif. I have Reaper set to release the audio driver in the background. This passes no audio to kclip, but kclip continues to show a graphic with a solid block of audio while visible. You can see these flat blocks in the .gif.

It seems to display the last value instead of basing it on the current input. Other VSTs with similar visualization work properly.

Image

Thank you for reading.
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Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:14 am

Dealing with some release day issues right now, but I will respond to detailed feedback as time permits.

PS - I did most of my testing on a high DPI gaming mouse in Windows, so perhaps that explains the disparity. In all truth, with as many devices as there are out there now for mousing around, I don't think it's possible to ever get this right for everyone with the same settings, so I'm going to add mouse sensitivity settings into the global settings panel as soon as that launches.
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

frthib
KVRist
109 posts since 29 Nov, 2017 from Québec, Québec, Canada

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:37 am

Mouse reacts as Robert mentionned for me too.

My mouse settings are "Windows 10 stock" (didn't touch anything) and my mouse is a HP who came with the pc tower from factory.

I would be surprised to have to adjust the mouse settings in the parameters since it would be the first time I would ever have to do that in a VST.

User avatar
Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:46 am

Many VSTs have absurdly fast knob tolerances. Some offer lethargic speed with a modifier key. I'm trying to do better. Obviously, there's some fine tuning to be done here.
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

frthib
KVRist
109 posts since 29 Nov, 2017 from Québec, Québec, Canada

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:49 am

:tu:

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Robert Randolph
KVRAF
2111 posts since 25 May, 2003 from Saint Petersburg, Florida

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:15 am

Kazrog wrote:Dealing with some release day issues right now, but I will respond to detailed feedback as time permits.

PS - I did most of my testing on a high DPI gaming mouse in Windows, so perhaps that explains the disparity. In all truth, with as many devices as there are out there now for mousing around, I don't think it's possible to ever get this right for everyone with the same settings, so I'm going to add mouse sensitivity settings into the global settings panel as soon as that launches.
FWIW, I'm extremely persnickety about mouse/cursor usage. I use my own custom generic mouse driver that I wrote to allow me to have proper 1:1 mouse tracking in macOS. I use a variety of generic PMW3360 sensor based mice (like my preferred nixeus revel), generally considered to be the best sensors available (besides proprietary 336X implementations).

Despite how I set my DPI, from 10 to 12,000 and varying levels of mouse acceleration, the issue still exists. I always bottom out on the knobs. I'm actually somewhat curious how to setup cursor movement so that wouldn't happen... :?:

I agree that many plugins do this in weird ways, but I am very happy with how the thermionik series handles it.

Thanks for considering adding a global sensitivity. Kclip 3 is fantastic sounding.
http://admiralbumblebee.com/
Audio Software Reviews, Woodworking, Programming and more... new posts every weekend!

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Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:34 am

Eleventh wrote:Hey, congrats on the release. Checking it out now. And I've got a couple items of feedback about the interface already :D
Thanks!
Eleventh wrote:1. No threshold indicator in the waveform view. I just checked GClip's implementation and it's not very accurate, i.e. peaks that pass through the threshold into clipping are dimmed in the visualizer, but they're still present in the signal accoring to a following oscilloscope. Is this difficult to implement? I mean a proper visual cue for the threshold would be very useful in my opinion. Pre/post signal overlayed?
It's not whether it's difficult to implement or not, it's just that I haven't gotten to it yet. Everything in KClip 3 is a totally new codebase as of January of this year, so there's still a lot of stuff I plan to add post-release. Stay tuned!
Eleventh wrote:2. Still no fine adjustment modifier for the mousewheel :) please also add to other plugins when you have time.
Clicking and dragging has been deemed too slow (as others have mentioned), so at least the scroll wheel gives you a fast mode for now. :lol:
Eleventh wrote:3. The FFT visualizer is a bit jarring. Is there a technical reason for this or could it be made smoother? Could also maybe benefit from pre/post overlay?
It's the nature of this particular style of visualiser. I agree with everything you've said here, FWIW.
Eleventh wrote:4. The knob tooltips are just displaying an empty transparent box here, Reaper x64, Win7SP1
Same setup here, and it's working fine. Not sure what to say about that. Is that a consistent behavior?
Eleventh wrote:(5. a "projected lufs" mode, which would show the LUFS as if the link button was not engaged)
Not sure what you mean... please clarify when you have a chance.
Eleventh wrote:6. the "clipped" meter is not accurate at all. For example switching between Crisp and Germanium totally changes the peak level, but this is barely reflected in the meter.
The clipped meter is accurate in single band mode. In multiband mode, it's not as accurate as I'd like it to be yet, but that's an easy fix. In single band mode, though, it's exactly accurate in terms of the highest peak value that's been passed to the clipper. What happens as a result of that is where you want to look at the other meters.
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

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Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:40 am

Robert Randolph wrote:It seems to display the last value instead of basing it on the current input.
Use the plugin's internal bypass if you want to see correct visualisation of the input audio for now. I'm not sure what's causing this issue, but I am aware of it. Thanks!
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

User avatar
Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:56 am

Robert Randolph wrote:Despite how I set my DPI, from 10 to 12,000 and varying levels of mouse acceleration, the issue still exists. I always bottom out on the knobs. I'm actually somewhat curious how to setup cursor movement so that wouldn't happen... :?:
Deathmetal? :borg: :hyper:
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

User avatar
Kazrog
KVRian
787 posts since 24 Oct, 2009

Re: KClip 3 - Early Access Download

Post Fri Apr 13, 2018 2:23 pm

Closing this thread as the early access period is over. Thanks again to everyone for helping to make this release a success!
Shane McFee
CEO/CTO - Kazrog LLC

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