KVR Audio

Caco · Post by **Caco** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:33 am

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:
Rock Hardbuns wrote:Which version of VSTGUI is the good one these days btw? I'm thinking of going there my self.
no idea. i abandoned VSTGUI looong ago.

I am using the stable 3.5 beta at the moment and its working okay for me. After using Infinity API for I while I have returned to VSTGUI and was pleasantly surprised at how much it is improved, plus it longer freezes the host gui.

There is also an early version of a Linux port of VSTGUI 3.0 by www.anticore.org using xlib but last time I checked it uses xpm image format and was not working particularly well.

Muon Software Ltd · Post by **Muon Software Ltd** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:42 am

if you can hack-in and get the signal of the OSC before it gets in the filter to an Oscilloscope - i think you would get just dissapointed/bored.. i believe it's pretty simple there
probably there is a little ugly thing about the negative peak of the square (i just think so, not sure) but otherwise it's really nothing special there..

Actually, its not so hard to do with the Borg mod. You can also get into the raw filter input and pass test tones through the filter. Five minutes with a soldering iron.

Best of luck with what you are doing, its a lot of fun to write a 303 emulation, not so much fun to deal with the 303 fanbois though

Kind regards
Dave

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:18 am

I would stay with Juce if you can stand the project being in GPL as doing bitmap based GUIs with it do not require that much extra steps and it's way better than VSTGUI.
You would support AU format too that way.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:38 am

otristan wrote:I would stay with Juce if you can stand the project being in GPL as doing bitmap based GUIs with it do not require that much extra steps and it's way better than VSTGUI.
You would support AU format too that way.

Hi Olivier,

well, i could stand the project being GPL (or similarly) licensed but i think the problem is, that GPL is incompatible with the VST license. that's why i recently asked for way to do a VST without the SDK. that - however - would then also rule out to use JUCEs convenient plugin wrapper classes (they use the SDK, right?).

...mmm...maybe i should discuss this with jules. or maybe someone else already did? have to check the JUCE forums....

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:40 am

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:
otristan wrote:I would stay with Juce if you can stand the project being in GPL as doing bitmap based GUIs with it do not require that much extra steps and it's way better than VSTGUI.
You would support AU format too that way.
well, i could stand the project being GPL (or similarly) licensed but i think the problem is, that GPL is incompatible with the VST license. that's why i recently asked for way to do a VST without the SDK. that - however - would then also rule out to use JUCEs convenient plugin wrapper classes (they use the SDK, right).

...mmm...maybe i should discuss this with jules. or maybe someone else already did? have to check the JUCE forums....

What I would do is not put in the repository the VST SDK and have a folder
with a file which say: put VST SDK folder here.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:43 am

otristan wrote:What I would do is not put in the repository the VST SDK and have a folder with a file which say: put VST SDK folder here.

commonsense tells me that this would be sensible - formally, however, it would violate GPL, no? but i guess, jules will probably be on the commonsense side of things

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:51 am

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:
otristan wrote:What I would do is not put in the repository the VST SDK and have a folder with a file which say: put VST SDK folder here.
commonsense tells me that this would be sensible - formally, however, it would violate GPL, no? but i guess, jules will probably be on the commonsense side of things

Isn't what jules does already ?

http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/l ... 04141.html

IMHO, the thing is, to get VST SDK, you have to accept some licence which is not compatible with the GPL. Though you can compile GPL code with it.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:03 am

otristan wrote:
Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:
otristan wrote:What I would do is not put in the repository the VST SDK and have a folder with a file which say: put VST SDK folder here.
commonsense tells me that this would be sensible - formally, however, it would violate GPL, no? but i guess, jules will probably be on the commonsense side of things
Isn't what jules does already ?

actually yes. soo...formally, jules would be violating his own license?

which of course is no problem, because he would probably not sue himself for doing so.

bottom line: yes, it's probably indeed the way to go to just point the user to the VST SDK. i will consider this.

...but later. for now, let's tweak the dsp algos...

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:23 am

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote: actually yes. soo...formally, jules would be violating his own license? which of course is no problem, because he would probably not sue himself for doing so.

Jules releases its code as GPL too and allow people to compile VST plugins with it, so no it's not only a matter of Jules violating its own licence...
Anyway I agree this is not the most important part

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:30 am

antto wrote:be aware that when ENVMOD is zero, you still have envelope modulating the filter! no matter where the Cutoff knob is..

yeah, i'm aware of that from the devilfish docs. Robin Whittle states that this is the case for the original 303 but with devilfish, you can actually turn it off completely:

Robin Whittle wrote: The Env Mod pot range has been tripled and made to include no Envelope Modulation.

Rock Hardbuns · Post by **Rock Hardbuns** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:48 am

Jules has gone on record several times saying that VST and ASIO are exempt as far as he is concerned, but he doesn't want to mess with the license. The trouble would be for people who pick it up down stream.

However, with GPL 3, ASIO and VST can reasonably be added under the platform/system files clause. In other words, they would have the same status as windows.h or the directX sdk and would not have to redistributed.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:18 am

Rock Hardbuns wrote:Jules has gone on record several times saying that VST and ASIO are exempt as far as he is concerned, but he doesn't want to mess with the license. The trouble would be for people who pick it up down stream.

However, with GPL 3, ASIO and VST can reasonably be added under the platform/system files clause. In other words, they would have the same status as windows.h or the directX sdk and would not have to redistributed.

aha. good to know. so the issue is cleared then. damn - in this case, i probably would have gone with JUCE right from the start. now i did it with the raw vst-sdk...but then... it's not too bad to have brushed up again how to deal with the vst-sdk directly (as for my other projects i have entirely switched to JUCEs wrapper classes nowadays)

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:40 pm

here's a littel update (link as before):

www.rs-met.com/temp/AciDevil.zip

accent responds now differently, pitch-wheel is implemented, the filter is now multimode and uses polynomial approximations and there's a suboscillator ...and possibly some other details which i currently don't remember

fliffo · Post by **fliffo** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:50 pm

why a sub-osc? Wasn't this a 303 emulation?

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:58 pm

fliffo wrote:why a sub-osc? Wasn't this a 303 emulation?

yes, but as i already stated in the original post:

the plugin should also include the Devil Fish modifications and some useful extensions on its own.

and several real analog 303 clones have introduced sub-oscs as well, so i thought it could be a good thing. and indeed, for some (not necessarily 100% authentic) sounds, it is.

...and you can turn it down such that it is entirely inaudible

Open303 - open source 303 emulation project - collaborators wanted