JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

DSP, Plug-in and Host development discussion.
echosystm
KVRist
62 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Post Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:24 pm

Hi guys

I'm about to give my first plugin a try and I was just wondering which framework is best to use. I've done a bit of searching, but haven't managed to find any concise comparisons of the available options.

I guess my main query is whether JUCE is worth the cost, or is WDL-OL just as good?

Thanks!

hibrasil
KVRian
772 posts since 24 Jun, 2002 from Huddersfield, UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:11 am

i'm copying here a post i did on the Cycling74 forum answering a similar question:

JUCE:
  • has good documentation
    has consistent and high quality code
    has a big user base
    very good graphics capabilities (including vector graphics, accelerated stuff etc)
    has a rather nice project generator (the introjucer)
    much more than just plugins
    still some issues with UIs not getting key events it seems
    doesn’t impose particular thread safety technique - need to work that out yourself
WDL-OL/IPlug:
  • Perhaps easier for C++ beginners
    Concise plugin implementation
    Many helpful scripts (does entire plugin building and packaging workflow)
    IDE projects setup for debugging in lots of common hosts
    Free
    Possible to fork it and “own” your version
    Perhaps less of a moving target
    Uses rather brutal mutex locks for thread safety
I think JUCE is well worth the money, but i like the simplicity of implementing plugins in IPlug.

I’m actually working on a new version of IPlug that is based on VST3 and is lock-free. Also the graphics can be done using whatever framework you like (IGraphics, JUCE, VSTGUI etc)
My Website | WDL-OL | Web Audio Modules - WAMs | Oli Larkin Plugin's Facebook
Available for Audio Dev tuition via Skype (IPlug/JUCE/C++)

hibrasil
KVRian
772 posts since 24 Jun, 2002 from Huddersfield, UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:13 am

if you're just starting, you don't have to purchase JUCE just to experiment with it BTW.
My Website | WDL-OL | Web Audio Modules - WAMs | Oli Larkin Plugin's Facebook
Available for Audio Dev tuition via Skype (IPlug/JUCE/C++)

Mayae
KVRian
528 posts since 1 Jan, 2013 from Denmark

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:46 am

echosystm wrote:Hi guys

I'm about to give my first plugin a try and I was just wondering which framework is best to use. I've done a bit of searching, but haven't managed to find any concise comparisons of the available options.

I guess my main query is whether JUCE is worth the cost, or is WDL-OL just as good?

Thanks!
Since you're worrying about juce's costs, i'm presuming you're not going to GPL it (it's free if you open source the project). Given it's your first plugin, i would go with wdl-ol (very easy).

If you're aiming for crossplatform and you don't have a lot of existing library code to handle that stuff, juce will be a lot less painful since it includes crossplatform classes for nearly everything. And as said, juce has a vast library for extended graphic capabilities.

Remember, the standard model for plugins besides graphics is virtually the same across all known plugin frameworks, so the parameter / dsp / state part of your plugin is easily ported - don't worry about locking yourself in too much.

I would check out both though :)

User avatar
Platinum Samples
KVRist
125 posts since 23 Aug, 2006 from Los Angeles, CA

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:54 am

hibrasil wrote: still some issues with UIs not getting key events it seems
This was recently fixed.

Rail

User avatar
Architeuthis
KVRAF
2964 posts since 28 Jan, 2006 from Phoenix, AZ

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Thu May 22, 2014 2:23 pm

hibrasil wrote:I’m actually working on a new version of IPlug that is based on VST3 and is lock-free. Also the graphics can be done using whatever framework you like (IGraphics, JUCE, VSTGUI etc)
Is that going to improve upon VST2 as well, maybe allow you to use other graphics frameworks for the other plugin formats as well, or strictly be a VST3 fork?

hibrasil
KVRian
772 posts since 24 Jun, 2002 from Huddersfield, UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Thu May 22, 2014 3:03 pm

the new version does VST2,VST3,AU,AAX and standalone app. No more RTAS support. The same GUI is used for all formats whatever you choose to use.
My Website | WDL-OL | Web Audio Modules - WAMs | Oli Larkin Plugin's Facebook
Available for Audio Dev tuition via Skype (IPlug/JUCE/C++)

gnjp
KVRist
172 posts since 11 Feb, 2006

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sun May 25, 2014 12:16 pm

Is the new version available?

hibrasil
KVRian
772 posts since 24 Jun, 2002 from Huddersfield, UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Sun May 25, 2014 12:22 pm

not yet, hopefully within a few weeks i'll find the time to do it
My Website | WDL-OL | Web Audio Modules - WAMs | Oli Larkin Plugin's Facebook
Available for Audio Dev tuition via Skype (IPlug/JUCE/C++)

keyman_sam
KVRAF
4002 posts since 8 Mar, 2005

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:13 am

If I develop a VST3 plugin in WDL-OL can I also build a VST 2.x easily?

User avatar
random_id
KVRist
335 posts since 1 May, 2006 from lancaster, pa

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:23 am

keyman_sam wrote:If I develop a VST3 plugin in WDL-OL can I also build a VST 2.x easily?
Yes. Once you have VST3 and VST SDKs setup, it is very easy. In most cases, you don't have to do anything different to build VST3 and VST. Occasionally, there are some issues, but most things work without any extra coding.

keyman_sam
KVRAF
4002 posts since 8 Mar, 2005

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:07 pm

random_id wrote:
keyman_sam wrote:If I develop a VST3 plugin in WDL-OL can I also build a VST 2.x easily?
Yes. Once you have VST3 and VST SDKs setup, it is very easy. In most cases, you don't have to do anything different to build VST3 and VST. Occasionally, there are some issues, but most things work without any extra coding.
Thanks, that's good to know.

I've followed the WDL-OL guide to get things running in Visual Studio. I might be daft, but how do I get it running in Eclipse Neon? The wdl plugin folder only has Visual Studio solutions. What are the steps to get the build working in Eclipse?

Miles1981
KVRian
1366 posts since 26 Apr, 2004 from UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:18 pm

You need to create all the individual projects you have in VS and configure the same flags for the compiler.
But I don't know why you would leave the best IDE ever, especially for Eclipse...

jabe
KVRAF
1747 posts since 9 Oct, 2008 from UK

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Thu Apr 27, 2017 6:22 pm

I got an email that says JUCE5 is free to personal users as long as their annual related revenue is below $50k. That'll give people chance to try it out. Details on the link below.

https://www.juce.com/releases/juce-5
[W10-64, T5/6/7/W8/9, 32&64, Spike],[W7-32, T5/6/7/W8, Gina16] everything underused.

Xenakios
KVRian
1159 posts since 9 Sep, 2005 from Oulu, Finland

Re: JUCE vs. WDL-OL vs. ?

Post Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:28 am

jabe wrote:I got an email that says JUCE5 is free to personal users as long as their annual related revenue is below $50k. That'll give people chance to try it out. Details on the link below.

https://www.juce.com/releases/juce-5
This is a nice development in the JUCE licensing. However, nothing is really free in this world...Using JUCE with that licensing option means your app/plugin will have to show a JUCE splash logo on start up and JUCE also sends some data to Google Analytics. Especially the latter seems to have been a big deal for many people in the JUCE forum. Personally I think I could probably live with that but of course it has to be made clear for the end users why the software is trying to use the internet connection.

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