Email from Apple about Catalina :)

[Urs]

Now it's even better - Apple tells Devs what should they write to their customers and Forgotten tells them how they should spend their time

I'll be ultra-snarky and say that re-coughing what Apple suggested to write would have a more positive business outcome than the hissy fits we've seen instead...

We too were like WTAF when we received that email, but then we too send out new product announcements to press people with a ready-to-go news article they can just copy and paste.

[Forgotten]

Why not form an alliance against grammar checkers? I’m sure it would work if you just start out with a small group...

[JCJR]

... It is likely a primary fact that makes me doubt Apple's moves.

I was exactly one of those developers, pioneering the web 20+ years ago, things that largely turned into standards today. The wildest experiments in web-design, stuff nobody ever tried before. Animation, ajax, "responsiveness", video or complex statefull industrial applications (not "apps") from 3D editors over audio to full expert applications. I made a fantastic living as a flash rockstar, flying around the world, working for the fanciest customers, making really good money. Customers were happy!

Until... ...well... ...until Steve wrote one public letter, highlighting one technical decision that killed a whole rather developed market overnight, for political reasons. Today's "apps" ported most of flash's worst disadvantages onto smart devices (closed system, CPU load, political dependence, fast aging, ads everywhere, etc). Web standards are still a pile of hacks and prehistoric ideas. More banners jumping around than ever, we're still short of CPU power. Apple fixed none of these, but they made money for their shareholders. Plenty of it.

"We didn't really mind the KING part about Mad King Ludwig, but the MAD part caused some troubles."

Urs, I get your point as well, the world moves on, history is written by winners, not whiners. But they change in fast and sharp moves. The whole Macromedia ecosystem was elite for almost a decade, until it didn't. Both happened because it was closed. All this right before Apple's big return, effectively applying the same recipe again, with big Wallstreet support. Things change, closed systems get replaced sooner or later. Typically in an unpredictable, irrational manner. Or short: political.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chU90sVsxvw

[elxsound]

So, Forgotten, you basically run from every battle?

This is not a battle. Nothing like it.

It’s more like a gnat biting an elephant.

There is one thing I will never understand: anonymous people who tell you on the internet how you should live your life, what is best or not better to do.
I don't think exactly like Melda, I think he has all his reasons for making some decisions, I respect them and I think he has all the freedom to do so.
When I see a random person trying to give life lessons, I would suggest before considering the following options:
- If you think you're better than Melda and better than him, open a software company and show him how to support Apple without complaining.
- if you already have a software company use your time to write better software than Melda's instead of wasting time criticizing it
- If you work in a more important software company than Melda's then tell me, what do you care? You'll be doing things very well already and you'll have better things to do than spend time giving life lessons to strangers.
- If you are a user and do not have a software company that produces plugins, what do you think you know? You would suffer from the Dunning Krugher effect. Maybe you think that the five minutes he spends here and maybe he likes to spend this way can be used to produce software and products at all costs, as if it were a machine that has to take 100% of the time to work. Maybe in your ignorance you don't know that he has already done this all day, or he doesn't need it because everything already works, and he is free to spend his time on a forum as he pleases, even to complain if it can help him to relieve the tension, and that if he needs an opinion on how to live his life he would ask you to do it
Sorry if I seem abrupt, I don't even know you and for me you could be the best person in the world, but personally I'm a little tired of people trying at all costs to give life lessons to others: if they want to appear better the fastest way is to set an example with facts, not with opinions

Says, the person attempting to give a lesson on who should be allowed to respond to a public post.

f**king hypocrisy.

Not a lesson, just an observation.

Another observation... everyone here is just one more f**king person (anonymous or not) with another f**king opinion that may or may not matter to anyone else (but maybe it was fun typing it).

[Haptix]

"You are reading it wrong" - Zhu De

[elxsound]

"You are reading it wrong" - Zhu De

"f**king flawed humans reading, writing, typing, sharing opinions, interpreting opinions and responding to things out of context, incorrectly, arrogantly, naively, innocently, ignorantly, maliciously and with sincere benevolence. We were always doomed to be replaced by robots." Elxsound

[Haptix]

I bet you are a person who never smiles.

[elxsound]

I bet you are a person who never smiles.

"You are reading it wrong" - Zhu De

[Zaphod (giancarlo)]

So, Forgotten, you basically run from every battle?

This is not a battle. Nothing like it.

It’s more like a gnat biting an elephant.

There is one thing I will never understand: anonymous people who tell you on the internet how you should live your life, what is best or not better to do.
I don't think exactly like Melda, I think he has all his reasons for making some decisions, I respect them and I think he has all the freedom to do so.
When I see a random person trying to give life lessons, I would suggest before considering the following options:
- If you think you're better than Melda and better than him, open a software company and show him how to support Apple without complaining.
- if you already have a software company use your time to write better software than Melda's instead of wasting time criticizing it
- If you work in a more important software company than Melda's then tell me, what do you care? You'll be doing things very well already and you'll have better things to do than spend time giving life lessons to strangers.
- If you are a user and do not have a software company that produces plugins, what do you think you know? You would suffer from the Dunning Krugher effect. Maybe you think that the five minutes he spends here and maybe he likes to spend this way can be used to produce software and products at all costs, as if it were a machine that has to take 100% of the time to work. Maybe in your ignorance you don't know that he has already done this all day, or he doesn't need it because everything already works, and he is free to spend his time on a forum as he pleases, even to complain if it can help him to relieve the tension, and that if he needs an opinion on how to live his life he would ask you to do it
Sorry if I seem abrupt, I don't even know you and for me you could be the best person in the world, but personally I'm a little tired of people trying at all costs to give life lessons to others: if they want to appear better the fastest way is to set an example with facts, not with opinions

Says, the person attempting to give a lesson on who should be allowed to respond to a public post.

f**king hypocrisy.

Not a lesson, just an observation.

Another observation... everyone here is just one more f**king person (anonymous or not) with another f**king opinion that may or may not matter to anyone else (but maybe it was fun typing it).

The difference between those two is simple: Melda is exposing himself as public figure, and he proved to be an expert about the matter, and, more important, an expert about his business. The other one is an anonymous user giving lessons of life about the way Melda should spend his time. I don't agree with Melda, and for other reasons I don't agree with Urs, but I respect their opinion and they are not trying to provide lessons of life here, they are not telling me the way should I spend my time, or the way I should optimize my time for improving my products.
As I said before, Dunning Krugher 100%
That simple

[MeldaProduction]

So, Forgotten, you basically run from every battle?

This is not a battle. Nothing like it.

It’s more like a gnat biting an elephant.

There is one thing I will never understand: anonymous people who tell you on the internet how you should live your life, what is best or not better to do.
I don't think exactly like Melda, I think he has all his reasons for making some decisions, I respect them and I think he has all the freedom to do so.
When I see a random person trying to give life lessons, I would suggest before considering the following options:
- If you think you're better than Melda and better than him, open a software company and show him how to support Apple without complaining.
- if you already have a software company use your time to write better software than Melda's instead of wasting time criticizing it
- If you work in a more important software company than Melda's then tell me, what do you care? You'll be doing things very well already and you'll have better things to do than spend time giving life lessons to strangers.
- If you are a user and do not have a software company that produces plugins, what do you think you know? You would suffer from the Dunning Krugher effect. Maybe you think that the five minutes he spends here and maybe he likes to spend this way can be used to produce software and products at all costs, as if it were a machine that has to take 100% of the time to work. Maybe in your ignorance you don't know that he has already done this all day, or he doesn't need it because everything already works, and he is free to spend his time on a forum as he pleases, even to complain if it can help him to relieve the tension, and that if he needs an opinion on how to live his life he would ask you to do it
Sorry if I seem abrupt, I don't even know you and for me you could be the best person in the world, but personally I'm a little tired of people trying at all costs to give life lessons to others: if they want to appear better the fastest way is to set an example with facts, not with opinions

Says, the person attempting to give a lesson on who should be allowed to respond to a public post.

f**king hypocrisy.

Not a lesson, just an observation.

Another observation... everyone here is just one more f**king person (anonymous or not) with another f**king opinion that may or may not matter to anyone else (but maybe it was fun typing it).

The difference between those two is simple: Melda is exposing himself as public figure, and he proved to be an expert about the matter, and, more important, an expert about his business. The other one is an anonymous user giving lessons of life about the way Melda should spend his time. I don't agree with Melda, and for other reasons I don't agree with Urs, but I respect their opinion and they are not trying to provide lessons of life here, they are not telling me the way should I spend my time, or the way I should optimize my time for improving my products.
As I said before, Dunning Krugher 100%
That simple

[elxsound]

So, Forgotten, you basically run from every battle?

This is not a battle. Nothing like it.

It’s more like a gnat biting an elephant.

There is one thing I will never understand: anonymous people who tell you on the internet how you should live your life, what is best or not better to do.
I don't think exactly like Melda, I think he has all his reasons for making some decisions, I respect them and I think he has all the freedom to do so.
When I see a random person trying to give life lessons, I would suggest before considering the following options:
- If you think you're better than Melda and better than him, open a software company and show him how to support Apple without complaining.
- if you already have a software company use your time to write better software than Melda's instead of wasting time criticizing it
- If you work in a more important software company than Melda's then tell me, what do you care? You'll be doing things very well already and you'll have better things to do than spend time giving life lessons to strangers.
- If you are a user and do not have a software company that produces plugins, what do you think you know? You would suffer from the Dunning Krugher effect. Maybe you think that the five minutes he spends here and maybe he likes to spend this way can be used to produce software and products at all costs, as if it were a machine that has to take 100% of the time to work. Maybe in your ignorance you don't know that he has already done this all day, or he doesn't need it because everything already works, and he is free to spend his time on a forum as he pleases, even to complain if it can help him to relieve the tension, and that if he needs an opinion on how to live his life he would ask you to do it
Sorry if I seem abrupt, I don't even know you and for me you could be the best person in the world, but personally I'm a little tired of people trying at all costs to give life lessons to others: if they want to appear better the fastest way is to set an example with facts, not with opinions

Says, the person attempting to give a lesson on who should be allowed to respond to a public post.

f**king hypocrisy.

Not a lesson, just an observation.

Another observation... everyone here is just one more f**king person (anonymous or not) with another f**king opinion that may or may not matter to anyone else (but maybe it was fun typing it).

The difference between those two is simple: Melda is exposing himself as public figure, and he proved to be an expert about the matter, and, more important, an expert about his business. The other one is an anonymous user giving lessons of life about the way Melda should spend his time. I don't agree with Melda, and for other reasons I don't agree with Urs, but I respect their opinion and they are not trying to provide lessons of life here, they are not telling me the way should I spend my time, or the way I should optimize my time for improving my products.
As I said before, Dunning Krugher 100%
That simple

Even in real life, he would have received the same comment.

He opened himself up to it.

CONTEXT

It's not the money (thanks to generous donations) but the potential increase of workload (time is [my] money). We'll see...

Actually I would say it's worse - time is MORE than money to me!

If your time is so valuable, wouldn’t it be better spent coding updates rather than spending so much time in this thread (and others) complaining about things you can’t change?

It’s so eerie that it mirrors a real life conversation.

You complain about anonymity and life lessons, but it certainly follows any real life conversation where no one is anonymous, and the person complaining so much about the thing they don’t want to do, is now adding on how valuable their time is, as reason for not wanting to do it.

Kids have that same conversation about chores and homework.

Politicians do it all the time.

You can apply it to any set of people and either expertise or lack thereof, because this is a normal progression of a conversation, resulting in the same so called life lesson... That “if you had spent half as much time doing it, as you have spent complaining about it, you would be done by now.”

There are plenty of times to react to users telling you what to do with your time instead of improving, or fixing the the thing that they consider most important, but this isn’t one of those times. No, this is the time you post about the Dunning-Kruger effect to make yourself feel better for overreacting.

I will say this though... I don’t agree with Forgotten’s comment about not wasting time on things you cannot change. There are too many important things that belong in Hydepark that for me are worth fighting for. I think many would consider some of them not worth their time fighting for because the don’t seem winnable. But I fight for those things I believe in and I wouldn’t do it any other way.

[Forgotten]

"You are reading it wrong" - Zhu De

I can imagine what the man who led the military enforcement of a totalitarian regime on China meant when he said this...

[fmr]

"You are reading it wrong" - Zhu De

I can imagine what the man who led the military enforcement of a totalitarian regime on China meant when he said this...

Oh, you must know a few things about totalitarian regimes...

[Forgotten]

I will say this though... I don’t agree with Forgotten’s comment about not wasting time on things you cannot change. There are too many important things that belong in Hydepark that for me are worth fighting for. I think many would consider some of them not worth their time fighting for because the don’t seem winnable. But I fight for those things I believe in and I wouldn’t do it any other way.

Just to clarify, I meant specifically this situation, not in general. In this situation I think it’s highly unlikely that a group of small developers in a niche industry will be able to influence Apple to reverse a major change in their operating system strategy.

It would have had more chance two years ago when official announcements were made, but it’s not very likely now that these changes have been implemented. Particularly when the only action (that I’m aware of) is to complain about it on a forum that probably has 0% impact on any strategic decisions that Apple has ever made, or ever will make. Armchair revolutionaries have a track record of not achieving their goals...

[fmr]

It would have had more chance two years ago when official announcements were made, but it’s not very likely now that these changes have been implemented. Particularly when the only action (that I’m aware of) is to complain about it on a forum that probably has 0% impact on any strategic decisions that Apple has ever made, or ever will make. Armchair revolutionaries have a track record of not achieving their goals...

We never know. First of all, you are not well informed. The opposition and anger towards Apple isn't confined to this site or group. Actually, a link was posted on another thread proved that.

In second place, talking against something we don't agree upon is a right we all have in a free world. Sometimes it may have no consequences, and we will have to keep going. Sometimes, we may just initiate a process that leads to changes. We don't have a way to know how much strength we have before we act. Look at the yellow jackets in France, for example. We may be the fuse.

Third place, Apple deserves it. Period.