Bass "Mono-izer" plugins

[Sparky77]

A lot of Brainworx Plugin have a mono-izer somewhere.

bx_control
bx_digital
bx_xl

Yes, and I find these work very well on bass to make a mono track that sits in the center of the mix.

[mutantdog]

I guess all this analysis leads to the question: where to mono out? I hear 100hz or even higher bandied around (was it David Guetta who said 250hz or something crazy like that?) but in my experience it really starts shrinking your stereo width beyond 100hz if you have big moments happening in the music (the choruses feel more wimpy etc). I'm liking more down around the sub depths, like 40-50hz to be more transparent - just so you're sure that the real super lows are mono and that's all. Some 120hz width in the kickdrum or even bass isn't a bad thing.

I think it really depends on the material. I find VUMT at between 80Hz and 100Hz works well, i just adjust the amount to whatever seems most reasonable. I'm not after perfectly mono bass, but to my ears it all just sounds nice and tight if its fairly central. Of course there are exceptions (Juno style chorus bass). If there's a need to focus the sub then i add the monobass from SlickM at around 30Hz.

[MogwaiBoy]

Bought Mongoose. I did an A/B test between Ozone Imager and Boz Mongoose on a drum bus. 200hz, 100% width reduction, Imager set to Analog or Hybrid crossover type, Mongoose set to 12db slope.

Exported both as separate renders and then compared in RX5. I liked Mongoose the best as it was the most natural and unnoticable.

Next I'm going to try on a full mix at 100hz and also throw SlickEQ and A1StereoControl in the ring.

I wish Mongoose had 3 bands so you could widen the mids just a touch but leave the top end alone

[MogwaiBoy]

I think it really depends on the material. I find VUMT at between 80Hz and 100Hz works well, i just adjust the amount to whatever seems most reasonable. I'm not after perfectly mono bass, but to my ears it all just sounds nice and tight if its fairly central. Of course there are exceptions (Juno style chorus bass). If there's a need to focus the sub then i add the monobass from SlickM at around 30Hz.

I dig your music and I value your opinion

I'm wondering if it really is best to mono out low end on group buses and instruments in mixing - or just ignore it and do it once-off on the master bus. Maybe a balance between them is best... ie: do your main heavy lifting in the mix (higher mono crossover on bass, drum bus etc) and then just do something gentle and nearly invisible on the master.. ie: like you say, 30hz or something really low like that just as a failsafe.

[Digivolt]

So what happened with the other tests ? How did the Audiority one fair, did you ever get to test Mongoose ?

[mutantdog]

Yeah, it all kinda forgotten. Maybe I'll revive the concept again at some point.

I think i found a way to test this with PluginDoctor which would be better... if i ever get round to it.

[Digivolt]

Yeah, it all kinda forgotten. Maybe I'll revive the concept again at some point.

I think i found a way to test this with PluginDoctor which would be better... if i ever get round to it.

Would be great if you did as it's been interesting to read through

[FabienTDR]

Very cool stuff mutantdog!

SlickEQ M's bass mono filter has been specifically designed for transparency. i.e. produce the least amount of audible change possible. Hence the very smooth curve and small compensating bump in the sum path.

I wouldn't recommend using steep filters in SUM/DIFF configuration.

Something interesting can be done with Nova GE with the recently added channel modes:

SUM (SC: DIFF)
DIFF (SC: SUM)

These allow dynamic widening or narrowing in dependence of the stereo difference or stereo sum's level. More clearly, one can widen narrow signals only, and keep the wide ones intact. And vice versa, all in dependence of frequency. I haven't found the time to prepare presets, but it's well worth a try imho. In context of LF mono, one could reduce the LF width only if it really is unreasonably large, but keep "not too wide bass" stuff untouched.

In my experience, most tracks greatly benefit from a wide LF, so maybe it can make sense to reduce width, but with some tolerance.

[random_id]

I will also throw LVC-Audio's Toned-MAX in the list of options (http://lvcaudio.com/plugins/toned-max/).

There are stereo controls for width that can be configured a variety of ways.

The L-MONO control mono-izes the signal below the frequency point. The overall width of the signal can also be altered, or just the high frequencies can be altered using the H-FREQ control.

Also, every EQ node can be set to Stereo, Mid, Sid, Left, or Right. This is a great way of tightening up the bass from a width perspective. When the EQ node is switched to dynamic mode, it can as tighten up the low end without becoming overly boomy.

[Dasheesh]

Nugen Monofilter Elements is $49.
cheep price and visual feedback is good.

http://www.nugenaudio.com/stereo-pack-e ... -vst-au_48

this, the best.

[Dasheesh]

also, i don't see dyneq listed yet, which can monochannel.

[mutantdog]

I wouldn't recommend using steep filters in SUM/DIFF configuration.

Something interesting can be done with Nova GE with the recently added channel modes:

SUM (SC: DIFF)
DIFF (SC: SUM)

These allow dynamic widening or narrowing in dependence of the stereo difference or stereo sum's level. More clearly, one can widen narrow signals only, and keep the wide ones intact. And vice versa, all in dependence of frequency. I haven't found the time to prepare presets, but it's well worth a try imho. In context of LF mono, one could reduce the LF width only if it really is unreasonably large, but keep "not too wide bass" stuff untouched.

In my experience, most tracks greatly benefit from a wide LF, so maybe it can make sense to reduce width, but with some tolerance.

Interesting idea, I may have to give it a try in future, Nova GE gets criminally underused by me. As I've mentioned in other threads I really like SlickGE as a side EQ, something about the saturation can really emphasise the width without any noticable increase in levels but the high-passes aren't ideal for this use.

Since this project I've moved away from the whole mono-bass thing, too many times the phase issues can end up having a detrimental effect on transients. I've come to agree that some moderate width on the bottom end can usually sound better, it all depends on the source though. I've had a few cases where I've needed to remove some low-end mud on tracks processed with wide reverb, these can be tricky.

VUMTdeluxe is still my favourite for mono-bass when i need it although LF Max Punch is a good option when more extreme or colourful processing is required.

[MogwaiBoy]

These allow dynamic widening or narrowing in dependence of the stereo difference or stereo sum's level. More clearly, one can widen narrow signals only, and keep the wide ones intact. And vice versa,

Whoa! This is exactly something I asked about in another thread last year I think - if this kind of thing was possible, an intelligent stereo threshold system. I think my idea was that it would "make narrow-ish things more narrow and wide-ish things wider, at the same time, dynamically". Sounds great, please make the presets!

[Caine123]

hey guys, i use mostly the BX Plugins for mono filter, but which advantages do the NUGEN Monofilter give me over these? and did someone test the Mongoose vs Nugen one?

i use the soundradix PI to get a coherent mix with the mono signals, but for seperate channels/instruments like low pads, sounds where i still want a nice low end besides kick/sub i guess a Mongoose or Nugen plugin would be great.

thx

[plexuss]

I use Nugen Monofilter. I've used PA's monoizer as well. I can't say anything about sound quality. But Monofilter allows way more control over what's going on. for example the slope down to mono and the ability to not go exactly to mono (so its more of a cross-over where you can control the slope of the cross over and the stereo width on either side of it. also the cross over has various modes like natural and linear phase. I usually set it this way: HPF 25Hz, mono to about 60Hz, start monoizing at about 120Hz. I prefer more stereo in the upper-low-end for my material. I might set it differently for other material as necessary. I use it because it was part of a bundle. Since it has more control over monoizing I decided to make it my go-to. I use it on every mastering project towards the end of the chain.