KVR Audio

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:45 pm

Sure you can do similar things with other tools but i really like the easy and consistent workflow/GUI and fast set-up (plus very low CPU for quality results).
Maybe not the usual usage but f.e. here 4 synths layered with the same preset. Just the second instance got a midi delay with one repeat, the third with 2 and the fourth with 3 repeated midi notes.
Each instance has the same Precedence and Breeze 2.1 preset but with different distance and angle settings.
So easy said the sound moves from near left to the far right. Of course you could do much more delays and fine steps etc. but i wanted to just do a simple 4 as demo here. Maybe not useful...but however

First dry then Precedence and Breeze 2.1 activated.
https://soundcloud.com/user-790535032/bp-echo-test

XComposer · Post by **XComposer** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:35 pm

Ok… bought Precedence! Once again, a very happy 2CAudio customer!

yellowmix · Post by **yellowmix** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:25 am

I bought it a few days ago after putting it up against Dear Reality dearVR, fiedler stage, and Nuspace Muze. I didn't bother comparing to mono input plugins. dearVR and Muze can do elevation and put the sound source behind the listener, but I kept them within the confines of Precedence. Short conclusion is that Precedence sounds better for music placement/mixing purposes. It's even better with Breeze after it. Works wonders on a drum kit to separate individual percussion but keep them in a cohesive space.

What I do miss are the creative possibilities. Muze has built-in modulation and encourages it (using a pitch/yaw/roll model), while dearVR allows smooth automation (XYZ). fiedler can be automated but it has a narrower range so it's not as useful in this regard. I know mathematically it becomes a completely different problem to solve, and you've already intimated your goals with this, but this placement is so good I can feel the restlessness. Cinebient's echo setup is a good way to solve that for now.

jbraner · Post by **jbraner** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:51 am

How are people using Precedence with drum kits?
(with Superior drummer)
I've got drum tracks with a little bleed on them, and then room and overheads are separate tracks - I don't think Precedence will add a lot here.
I'm thinking it wants clean drum tracks with sends to a reverb buss (or Breeze on each track)

Gamma-UT · Post by **Gamma-UT** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:01 am

jbraner wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:51 am How are people using Precedence with drum kits?
(with Superior drummer)
I've got drum tracks with a little bleed on them, and then room and overheads are separate tracks - I don't think Precedence will add a lot here.
I'm thinking it wants clean drum tracks with sends to a reverb buss (or Breeze on each track)

Where do you want your drums? If you want larger than life pop mixing, Precedence is not going to be that much help - IMHO it's intended primarily for localising sounds. If you want a drum kit in a defined part of the sound stage, then Precedence should help with overheads – a drum kit isn't very big and this is going to stop the room sound taking over the room. For a jazz quartet, it probably makes sense.

Personally, I'd use it in a pop scenario for contrast. Carving out specific locations for certain instruments while others let rip with the over-emphasised stereo effects. Maybe percussion that isn't kick/snare/hats.

jbraner · Post by **jbraner** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:08 am

Hi Gamma,
I think, for me, the drums are fine the way they are - I guess I was looking for a use case where you would put it on a drum kit (well, the individual pieces to be more precise).

I think it *will* be great for percussion parts - like congas, shakers etc.

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:46 am

Another (a bit longer) Precedence and Breeze 2.1 test. Yeah...i´m bored

First dry (at least as dry as i could get it), then each time more and more mix/balance (balance in this case) and distance added until it reach 100%.
At the end again a dry improved thing and then Precedence and Breeze 2.1 added.
You hear always 2 layered strings. When i add Precedence one is 30 degrees left and one 30 right. Just the distance change each time.
https://soundcloud.com/user-790535032/a ... ze-21-test

yellowmix · Post by **yellowmix** » Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:25 pm

jbraner wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:08 am I think it *will* be great for percussion parts - like congas, shakers etc.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm using it for. And cowbells. =)

Also, I should have explained I meant on electronic/synthesized/dry sounds that don't have stereo/room/overhead, which Precedence + Breeze can make up out of thin air.

Andrew Souter · Post by **Andrew Souter** » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:14 am

Here's some more audio demos. I'm adding many to the sound-cloud playlist, but here are some as 24-bit .wav so you can here full fidelity.

First several examples where I use Precedence and Breeze 2 with P-Link, and simply change the position in Precedence and update the Breeze mix value accordingly. (I segment across multiple tracks/instances to do this -- not using automation -- just to quickly demonstrate the diversity of different positions and the left/right front/back positioning...) Some show only Precedence. Some with P and B.

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ak_Dry.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... am_Dry.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reoMic.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... itions.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ya_Dry.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... da_Dry.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... te_Dry.wav

Here are some pretty great contemporary vocals where the combo of P and B produces pretty stellar short vocal ambience appropriate for current mix styles:

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... edence.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ay_Dry.wav

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... Longer.wav

These are all real-world instruments/humans recorded with a mic. The "oud" example is stereo miced which you can year in the dry example. I used the "mono-input" mode to discard one channel and used P to reposition. The rest mono mic-ed. Precedence is responsible for all the positioning info in all of these therefore...

Paulnz · Post by **Paulnz** » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:08 am

Hi Andrew,
I saw that the introductory offer lasts for 30 days but when did it start? (ie when does it end?

)

cthonophonic · Post by **cthonophonic** » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:30 am

The email announcement went out on Oct 11, the same day this forum topic was posted, which would put the end date around Nov 10.

Andrew Souter · Post by **Andrew Souter** » Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:52 am

Intro will likely last all of Nov... as I am still finishing the manual, and making more demo sounds, and I'm also looking at potentially offering some kind of "perfect mono compatibility" mode for users where that topic is of concern.

...and we are attempting to establish robust auto-linking between P and B instances in some manner as mentioned and it is unknown exactly how long that will take as it is a new topic for us. We hope it can happen sometime this month, but let's see.

Andrew Souter · Post by **Andrew Souter** » Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:57 am

Some more examples:

Drum mix with Precedence and Breeze 2, one instance on each drum instrument. Source was Cubase Groove Agent, which outputs stereo drums, but I disagreed the existing stereo info and used mono sources and repositioned with Precedence and applied Breeze 2:

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... edence.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ryMono.wav

Then two guitars playing a similar phrase, using P and position they widely and a little Breeze for ambience:

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... edence.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ar_Dry.wav

Then a nice female vocal, using the P->B combo for short vocal space, which would sound mostly dry in a full mix, but have excellent spatialization:

https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... reeze2.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... edence.wav
https://2caudio.com/sitecontent/product ... ce_Dry.wav

JoaquinAce · Post by **JoaquinAce** » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:20 am

Hi Andrew,
I have a question about using precendence and breeze together (I own both). So I have a section in my track where I have a synth lead, a pretty big pad and then a vocal stab. I know, its a lot of frequencies in one spot. I am thinking of keeping the vocal in the middle and the pad on the sides and then automate the spatial positions that the vocal becomes wider (and increase the unison with Eventide Octovox) over 4 bars. However, I don't want it to clash with the pad too much. I will carve out some frequencies in the pad for the vocal, but I was wondering if using precendence and breeze won't give me some additional spatial breathing room? Do you have any tips to try? I know I can use the Haas effect to make it sound wider but I'm not sure if that will prevent clashing frequencies....I also have Aether if it makes any difference. Thanks!

Andrew Souter · Post by **Andrew Souter** » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:39 am

You could try something like:

1) on the pad use the mid-side input width mode and use something like 150-200% Input Width vale. Then use something similar for the main Width knob as well. Keep angle at 0% or so. Try Distance close to 100%. If you part is particularly bright and you don't want to loose any of this brightness, reduce the Freq Delta to close to 0%.

2) use your 3rd party EQ or dynamic EQ to carve a little freq space out of the pad in the vocal range as you suggest.

3) try to position the lead and the vocal fairly narrow to medium width, using Precedence on each, with one positive and the other negative of the same value. Like +/- 15 degrees or +/- 30 degrees or so. Use medium Distance for both, with some different between them, something like 37.5% and 62.5% or so, or less depending on taste. Follow each with a Breeze 2 instance using P-Link and setting Mix the same value as P-Distance as a guideline. Check if you lead synth is already very wide from whatever FX engine is being used in your synth. If it is, try using the Mid-Side input mode, and use a narrower input Width value of say 50% or so that this does not confuse the position info added by P. This should help keep the Lead and vocal distinct.

2CAudio Precedence | 1.5 | Move Out Of Flatland. Take Precedence.