KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Winners announced

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?
westcoast2
KVRer
22 posts since 28 Jun, 2010

Post Mon May 25, 2015 8:15 am

"I bet that some could have been groped together..."

That's interesting, an advanced "mixing" technique perhaps?

mixedmind
KVRist
47 posts since 15 Sep, 2014

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Mon May 25, 2015 10:19 am

Hi,

this is my mix. I agree with 3ee that's why I grouped all tracks that had similar names or similiar sounds.
for the rest it was EQ, comp and some panning. again no magic used.

here we go:
https://soundcloud.com/dilutedmind/h-ma ... nd/s-VRQIn


cheers,
mixed mind

Kolyev
KVRist
62 posts since 25 Aug, 2014

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Tue May 26, 2015 9:16 am

Here is my entry:
MP3: https://www.dropbox.com/s/yu0jm3pvfb0ww ... v.mp3?dl=0

WAV: https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ud6hwzl2d407 ... v.wav?dl=0

Drums:
Kickdrum – Eqing and Compression (Cubase Tube Compressor)
Snare – Eqing, Compression for more punch (Tube Compressor) and a bit of saturation (through “drive” parameter of tube compressor)
Hihats – just Eqed
Cymbals routed to “overhead” group, slight compresson and EQing
Drums Group – compression & saturation
All Drum Channels were additionally routed to a group channel with a reverb on it set to 100% wet in order to simulate a room mic recording of the whole drumset (this group channel was then of course also routed to the drums group). This was just an experiment, but I liked the outcome and kept it.
A bit of reverb was added to the different drum elements for placement in the mix.

Bass:
EQing on all Bass Channels.
Sidechain compression (to kickdrum) on deep basses.
Saturation with Quadrafuzz 2.

Chuggas:
All single channels EQed separately and Routed to group channel with additional EQing.
Used Quadrafuzz 2 (4 band distortion/saturation unit) to give more weight.

All other guitars and synths were only EQed, some panning was applied and of course similar sounds were grouped.
2 different Reverbs (Steinberg Revelation; one for guitars one for lead synths) were used for placement in the mix.
Volume automation on several tracks was applied and a bit of filter automation (basically only a hint) was used on the lead for a smoother arrangement.

westcoast2
KVRer
22 posts since 28 Jun, 2010

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Tue May 26, 2015 12:38 pm

My mix.

Wav
https://soundcloud.com/dwgh/h-man-smoke ... stcoast2-1

mp3
https://soundcloud.com/dwgh/h-man-smoke ... westcoast2
An interesting and complex track.

Mixed in Reaper.
Tracks were grouped by apparent instrument name. The Individual tracks in a group, except drums, had no fx only volume adjustment.
There was volume automation on some tracks.

Eq=ReaEQ, SpEQ=SplineEQ,
DC8C2=Klanghelm DC8C2 Compressor
C3=Slim Slow Rider C3 Multi Band Compressor
Reverb=Ambience
GR5=NI Guitar Rig 5

Stick click - EQ
Funky String, Feedback - As is

Deep Bass, Bass Rea, Dirty Bass - SpEQ, DC8C2
Swarm Synth, Tremolo, Hive - EQ, C3, reverb

Lead Arp Extra - SpEQ, C3
Lead wChorus 1 - EQ, SpEQ, C3
Lead wChorus 2 - C3

Chugga 1,2, Mo Chug - EQ, C3
Rock Axe, Rock Guitar - SpEq, GR5
Deep Cymb 1 - Eq, SpEQ

Drums - Reverb
Crash Ride Body, Crash Ride High, Hi Hat Close, Hi Hat Tight - EQ
Kick - SpEQ, DC8C2
Kick Body n thump - SpEQ
Kick woody - SpEQ, ReaEQ
Snare - EQ, DC8C2
Snare Body Low, Snare Body, Snare High Stuff -EQ

FX Amp Buzz, FX Gtr Unplugged, FX Switch 2 - EQ

vasdim
KVRist
31 posts since 7 Feb, 2005 from Sofia, Bulgaria

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Tue May 26, 2015 11:17 pm

Last edited by vasdim on Wed May 27, 2015 6:16 am, edited 3 times in total.

Compyfox
KVRAF
14279 posts since 19 Oct, 2003 from Berlin, Germany

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 4:15 am

A friendly reminder: less than 24 hours remaining.
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jhkennedy5
KVRist
34 posts since 7 Sep, 2014 from Allen, TX

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 3:36 pm

Here is my mix:

WAV: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/896 ... ennedy.wav
MP3: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/896 ... ennedy.mp3

Grouped the following into buses for processing:

Guitar1 : Chugga, Chukka (4 tracks)
Guitar2 : Rock Axe (3 tracks)
Guitar3 : Rock Guit (3 tracks)
Guitar4 : Tremolo Pick (4 tracks)
Guitar5 : FX, Feedback, and Fx Amp Buzz (7 tracks)
Synth1 : Synth Lead Chorus (2 tracks)
Synth2 : Lead Synth Arp (2 tracks)
Synth3 : Mo Chug (4 tracks)
Strings : Funky String Mute (2 tracks)
Bass1 : Deep Bass (2 tracks)
Bass2 : Bass Real (2 tracks)
Kick (2 tracks)
Snare (3 tracks)
Stick (2 tracks)
HiHats (2 tracks)
Cymbals (3 tracks)

EQ or DynamicEQ on all instruments (after busing). Minimal compression (some on drum bus and mix bus only). Touch of reverb only.

User avatar
piranha81
KVRer
29 posts since 1 Aug, 2014 from Italy

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 3:43 pm

Tracks:
Wav
https://soundcloud.com/roberto-ortenzi/ ... -piranha81
Mp3
https://soundcloud.com/roberto-ortenzi/ ... anha81-mp3

Ok, for this mix I tried to enhance my use of two technics: parallel compression and group GENTLE mixing, touching the single channels only when (if) needed.
All mix work made in Reaper and when not stated eq used was the excellent FabFilter Pro-Q 2.

I created 5 groups: Drums, bass, guitars, keys and noises, but I didn’t followed always the H-Man names.

On Drums group I started removing the odd middle peak I heard (202 & 375 Hz), hi-pass @28 Hz and a small dip @843. Then some tape saturation, RBass to add the missing weight and RedEQ to add some lows and sparkle to the cymbals.
All Kicks where grouped, saturated and then added some lows and click @5k with a API eq, then removed some sustain with Reaper’s TransienController.
On snare some hi/lo pass filter and some 386 odd mids where removed. Kick and snare where parallel compressed with a 1176 copy.
All cymbals tracks where grouped and then hi-passed and smooted with eq and deessing. Only on the ride I removed some 2664hz.
All drums where sent to a parallel compression channel.
On Bass group I added some lows and attack @1.5k, then I compressed 3 times via NI Supercharger in parallel, a multiband for add some low weight and via ReaComp for sidechain with kick. Only in Dirty Bass Synth channel I removed some clicking and low/low-mids and narrowed the low end via Alex Hilton A1.
On Guitars all chugs where grouped, panned, hi-passed removed some low-mid mud and added some 1358 and 6k. Parallel compressed via NI Supercharger and saturated with Saturation Knob. Rock guit/axe channels where grouped and made more electric guitar sounding via eq.
Tremelo where grouped and treated with Amplitube free and the included wah.
Feedbacks where grouped and equalized.
On Keys I put some of the less natural sounding guitars, that whare mainly eq’d. All Chuggas where grouped, saturated, equalized to remove some 500 Hz, hi/low passed and some lows where added via RBass. A small clipping amount on the bus added some nastiness.
Lead Arps where grouped, added some mids via eq and smothed a little via deesser.
Hive Lead and Lead wChorus 1 & 2 where grouped, saturated and eq’d to add 2-4k and with a dip @591 Hz.
Small work on Noises.

Delay and Reverb (Replika and FreeverbToo) where used via sends. A small and a long reverb where used.
On Master bus there where some eq, multiband compression to remove sustain to lows/low-mids, broadband compression via Kotelnikov, saturation via CamelCrusher and some attack added via BitterSweet.

Compyfox
KVRAF
14279 posts since 19 Oct, 2003 from Berlin, Germany

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 6:58 pm

Ringing in the final hours of this mix round.

If you finished your mix, but forgot to send it in - now is your chance.
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Fender19
KVRist
202 posts since 30 Aug, 2012

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 7:52 pm

This mix was a real challenge to find "who's on first" and keep the melody in focus. Hope I succeeded!

mp3: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxuC5 ... authuser=0

wav: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxuC5 ... authuser=0

Mix was assembled in Cubase 6 using no external plugins. EQ and Roomworks Reverb on the drum tracks to give them some depth. EQ on bass tracks to bring out the fundamentals and cut the mud. No compression anywhere, no stereo bus FX.

All the rest are track/part volume edits, fades, etc., to keep the mix moving.

Davias
KVRian
763 posts since 3 Apr, 2013 from Belgium

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Mixing and Submissions until 27-MAY-2015 11:59pm PDT

Post Wed May 27, 2015 8:40 pm

Here is my attempt for this session :

hearthis.at : https://hearthis.at/davias/h-man-smoke- ... 10-davias/

dropbox mp3 : https://www.dropbox.com/s/v1sif9m55eke9 ... s.mp3?dl=0
dropbox flac : https://www.dropbox.com/s/pfya0jk7bxg2x ... .flac?dl=0

I found it very difficult to mix, but awesome track ! to think all was made only with one synth...

More details about the mix to come soon...

Good luck to everybody ! :tu:

Compyfox
KVRAF
14279 posts since 19 Oct, 2003 from Berlin, Germany

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Submission period ended, in evaluation

Post Thu May 28, 2015 5:50 am

It's the 27th May, and the (first) mixing round of the KVR MC#10 has ended.

If you want to fine tune your reports, now if your time. Please watch this spot for the evaluation.

--------------------------------------------------



In the meantime, there were questions and concerns that I've over read, but like to answer quickly.
mixedmind wrote:well. I don't understand why there are two MCs in parallel. guess most of us are hobbyists doing this mixes in our spare time. and spare time is rare.


I do understand where you're coming from, but the overlap had one main reason: to get the challenge back on track again, and back to it's original time slot (1st to 21st for initial mixing process).

As of Mix Challenge 10, we're also not extending the submission period anymore. Only in really rare cases. Other challenges on the web also have a clear time limit. So after 10 months of the KVR Mix Challenge, it's time to tighten the strings a bit.



On the "time constraints" thing:

If you're a producer and/or an audio engineer, you do try to juggle several projects at once, and especially as freelance/professional to keep your income flowing. Meaning, you do work on several things in parallel. Some of our participants are also involved with the OSC (One Synth Challenge) and the SCC (Song Cafe Competition), also handle their (freelance) company at the same time, create new content, etc.

We (and also I) do understand that the Mix Challenge participants are also hobbyists. But this is part of the challenge - time management. We still try to simulate a real C2B relationship, which can go both ways. So if you say "I can't manage it in time", then so be it. You've measured yourself and set clear goals. And even if you started to mix, but didn't make it in time - it's not the end of the world either. You got some experience out of it after all.

There are hundreds of challenges and competitions on the web. One of them will always run out on you. And I forgot to count how often that happened for me while I was half done, or 90% done with my production (especially in correlation with handling the Mix Challenge). That's just life.




mixedmind wrote:and a song with 50 tracks needs time even if you figured out that 1/3 are redundant.
3ee wrote:Why the absolute need of so many tracks? I bet that some could have been groped together... call me picky but honestly I'm a bit annoyed by this.
The client said that all(!) tracks are relevant and that you need to mix/group/layer them.

What would you say if we suddenly get a production for the challenge with 48+ or even 72+ audio tracks (for example a symphony production, a massive pop mix)? Would you then also say "these are too many tracks to sift through, I'm not joining"? Or rather "I have to figure out if 1/3rd of them are redundant"? Or even "not my style of mixing - pass", "too much reverb - pass?!"?

It is a challenge after all.

And this is what the "pro's" have to deal with every day (especially those that are not set to work within one genre). Not just 8-track stereo STEMs. And most of the time they only have 5-10 days max to get these mixes done, else the client is gone - maybe even way less (like the usual: "hey, I need it by tomorrow 8am, I know it's already 10pm at your place and you closed 3 hours ago, can you do it?!"). And sometimes not one track alone, maybe even an EP with 4-6 tracks, each with 32+ WAV tracks (at 10 days and 5 tracks, that's 2 days a 6 hours per track).




3ee wrote:I can't even load all the tracks... too much work trimming and sorting all of them for me atm, sorry but I'm skipping this one...
Was this "I can't load all the tracks" related to an error or something? Because I always check the files PRIOR to uploading and they all were fine. Or is this down to rig limitations (lack of HDD space comes to mind).

Else, see the the paragraphs above.





I/We do understand that such a challenge has to be fun and engaging as well. But we can't always choose the easy route. Else, the learning factor is gone.

Which brings be back to one main thing: if you think that you have a track that suits this challenge, and is not a 48+track "mess" in your opinion, then please get in touch with us.
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3ee
KVRAF
3669 posts since 8 Mar, 2006

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Submission period ended, in evaluation

Post Thu May 28, 2015 7:42 am

My DAW wouldn't let me load all the tracks.... it's a 32bit restriction that has to do with memory capacity ...
It has a 64bit version but that doesn't run on my system atm for some reason.... ffs!

Of course that I'm talking about FL Studio (God, I'm so sick of it's silly limitations and workarounds sometimes! , FWIW, I have some good reasons why I keep using it)

Back to the track count: I know what you mean, but this is suppose to be a FUN competition. 48+ tracks IMO is not fun for me anymore. People don't want to "work", they want to mix! :P ;)

westcoast2
KVRer
22 posts since 28 Jun, 2010

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Submission period ended, in evaluation

Post Thu May 28, 2015 8:30 am

"but this is suppose to be a FUN competition. 48+ tracks IMO is not fun for me anymore. People don't want to "work", they want to mix! "

True. It seems there was a pre-mix stage. I, as did others, grouped the instruments together effectively reducing the number of tracks to mix.

e.g Rock Guit 1, Rock Guit 2, Rock Guit 3 --> Rock Guit

Some used Fx on each track, others Fx on track and group. I just adjusted the levels of these 'layers' and applied Fx to the group.

Essentially the adjustment of the individual sounds is a sound shaping exercise. The choices made could affect the sound of the instrument quite drastically. Is this mixing or producing? Does this approach require more input from the Artiste?

In previous challenges, I have split the snare drum into 2 parts to try and get a sound. In this challenge the sounds are already split. So in some ways this is good, others not so much.

Mixing is painting by sounds, so It could be argued the bigger the palette the more choice. A good thing. On the other hand if this more complex type of mix means: 1 Mixing the project is not possible in DAWs some use due to restraints in technology and 2 The result is an enthusiastic and talented mixer unable to take part, then some consideration needs to be taken account of this.

When I first loaded the project, I almost passed at that point. I then spent a long time getting everything sorted. This was tedious and again lead to me almost giving up. I persevered and was able to submit a mix. Along the way I did learn a lot, so from my perspective it was worth it, though I do appreciate where 3ee is coming from.

anyways, just some thoughts,

west

Compyfox
KVRAF
14279 posts since 19 Oct, 2003 from Berlin, Germany

Re: KVR MIX CHALLENGE - MC10 May 2015 - Submission period ended, in evaluation

Post Thu May 28, 2015 10:57 am

I don't know what the issue with FL Studio and 32bit is, but I could load the 49 tracks into Cubase 7.x 32bit just fine.


Regarding the comment:
3ee wrote:... but this is suppose to be a FUN competition. 48+ tracks IMO is not fun for me anymore. People don't want to "work", they want to mix! :P ;)
Again, what if we some day get an orchestra production with a track amount BEYOND 40 tracks. Which is pretty normal for a 40 seater, plus choir (four extra mics), piano (four extra mics, two close, two room), maybe even additional electronic percussion (split tracks, additional 6-8), etc. And here I already speak about "grouped" instruments. Meaning: Solo Violin L Legato, Solo Violin L Staccato, Solo Violin L Pizzicato/runs, etc.

Or what about the other extreme - should we ever get an acoustic recording (e.g. Acoustic Guitar, Vocals, Background vocals - 4-6 tracks) or Acapella (Barbershop - 5 singers, 2-5 mics, maybe additional room)?

Heck, a normal "metal" production can easily exceed 32 tracks as well. Two guitar tracks per guitar part (rhythm, solo, harmony). So let's assume we're already at 8-10 tracks. Bass can be 2-3 tracks (DI, two split tracks with distortion), vocals (Solo, doubles, chorus - let us assume 6 tracks), drum set 16-20 tracks (Kick In/out, Snare Top/Bottom, Hihat, Ride, OH in A/B with an additional center, 4 toms - all played, room mics, additional percussion like Cowbell and Roto Toms). All together 39 tracks. And these were already consolidated.

Is this "fun" or is this "work"?




Yes, mixing is supposed to be fun, especially if this is your forte and/or maybe your day job, but beggars can't be choosers. Again - this is a challenge after all. And where is the challenge if you have 10 already great mixed tracks where you only have to "brush off the dust"? If we look at the Mix Challenge history, this can also go both ways.

Another example:
In terms of MC03 (Eric Dahlberg's entry), I split the tracks (especially the vocals) up to fine tune as much as possible. And I think I easily exceeded 32 tracks in the end. Not counting groups and sends (AUX returns). Since I'm used to such "massive" projects (I worked with more already at way shorter time frames, think way beyond 48 tracks), I absolutely didn't mind. Actually, the more freedom I have to mix, the better. Depending on the production of course. I can't fix severe issues with 8 stereo STEM tracks where various instruments were already consolidated, fades not properly set, volume was mismatched, etc. So to me, it's the complete other way around.



And herein lies the challenge - no matter which route you have to go according to the source files.

Of course, this is a challenge where you're not obligated to do anything, since you were/are not paid beforehand. But let us assume that you were - for example as part of a cost estimate deal - would it then look different? Can you then simply say "<reason XYZ> - pass?".



Food for thought.
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