Does production even matter?

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killmaster
KVRian
1020 posts since 5 Oct, 2003

Post Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:23 pm

fluffy_little_something wrote:I know songs from the 30s or so up to today, and the funny thing is that the sound quality barely matters. A song that has that special something does so regardless of the production quality, and a boring song will never get beyond that no matter how great production is.

For instance I was just listening to an old Duke Ellington tune, Solitude, it is simply touching and beautiful no matter how poor the sound quality is.
Same with modern music, none of my favorite songs would probably get anything above a C if rated for production.

In short, aren't people spending too much time and effort on trying to produce the heck out of music that basically just isn't worth it? 8)
I couldn't agree more!! thanks for posting!

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Frantz
KVRAF
4975 posts since 18 Jul, 2008 from New York

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:47 pm

thecontrolcentre wrote:What exactly do you think is wrong or lacking in the production of Solitude? Sounds good to me ...
It sounds great. There is very little production on 1930s recordings. Everything was recorded live in one take.

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Aleatoriac
KVRAF
1686 posts since 31 Dec, 2004 from betwixt

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:55 pm

No, I actually love the sound of destroyed recordings. Just tape noise, drop outs, distortion, fuzzed up lo-fi
I thought I was nearly alone in that

Something that sounds like a demon-possessed old cassette recording, I love that, it's what I grew up making on crappy little single-speaker cassette recorders, it sucked, I want more of it

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herodotus
KVRAF
5515 posts since 8 Dec, 2004 from The Twin Cities

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:14 pm

The problem is that 'production' has come to mean so many things.

In the old sense, all 'production' meant was capturing a song on tape. In that sense the only bad production is one that didn't sound like the band or artist performing the song. The goal was fidelity to the original, which is where the phrase 'high fidelity' came from.

Today, 'production' comprises a huge amount of different activities, from standard recording, to overusing whatever effects are popular, to someone actually creating whole songs using little more than samples provided by the artist whose name is on the album cover. Between these extremes lie an infinitude of different possibilities. In this environment, it is kind of hard to know what constitutes a 'good' production, unless you want to use sales figures as a guide (which I don't).

Personally, I like the old standard, but not many agree with this.

Inversion Of Control
KVRer
26 posts since 9 Jan, 2018

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:33 pm

VariKusBrainZ wrote:Alot of 80s/90s Death Metal would have benefited from better production

I loved Autopsy's Severed Survival album even though the drums sounded like cardboard boxes
I think the same, and also many of old thrash bands (even Metallica) are hard for me to listen because of pure sound production.

With modern metal I think the problem is that producers found some 'safe spots' - recording on Mesa etc. and too many bands sound exactly the same.

musicartist
Banned
102 posts since 3 Apr, 2018

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:49 am

I think it depends on the genre.

For example, EDM requires its tunes to be LOUD, which means the production must be good.

I also think the idea and chord progression or melody of a song is important, no matter how loud it sounds, but different people have different ideas about music.

Nammick
KVRer
8 posts since 8 Jun, 2018 from UK

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:57 am

It mattered at the time and it matters now...
Hi I'm Nammick, Musical Artist and Professional Hacker Geek!
https://nammick.com/blackbox

Acid Mitch
KVRAF
1894 posts since 5 Oct, 2005

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:30 am

fluffy_little_something wrote:
For instance I was just listening to an old Duke Ellington tune, Solitude, it is simply touching and beautiful no matter how poor the sound quality is.
So if you had the choice of a typical 1930’s recording of Solitude and one where you can actually hear the bass and high frequencies and more of the little details in between you’d be like “meh, doesn't matter I’ll take the poor recording” ?
As a music lover that seems nuts to me.

In the 80’s and early 90’s a local market used to sell bootleg tapes from various concerts. Sure, you’d love the songs on them but often most people were dying to hear them properly, no matter how good the performance was.

If there’s a piece of music I particularly like I’ll always pick the recording where you can hear it properly over the same thing poorly recorded.

fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
12923 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:16 am

Frantz wrote:
thecontrolcentre wrote:What exactly do you think is wrong or lacking in the production of Solitude? Sounds good to me ...
It sounds great. There is very little production on 1930s recordings. Everything was recorded live in one take.
That is indeed one of the better productions/versions in terms of sound quality.
There are inferior versions on YT, which however sound just as if not more appealing to me.

As someone else said, the definition of the word production is also important. It seems a rather broad term including all kinds of aspects. Some think it is more the technical side, others include the musical side as well...

fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
12923 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:20 am

Acid Mitch wrote:
fluffy_little_something wrote:
For instance I was just listening to an old Duke Ellington tune, Solitude, it is simply touching and beautiful no matter how poor the sound quality is.
So if you had the choice of a typical 1930’s recording of Solitude and one where you can actually hear the bass and high frequencies and more of the little details in between you’d be like “meh, doesn't matter I’ll take the poor recording” ?
As a music lover that seems nuts to me.

In the 80’s and early 90’s a local market used to sell bootleg tapes from various concerts. Sure, you’d love the songs on them but often most people were dying to hear them properly, no matter how good the performance was.

If there’s a piece of music I particularly like I’ll always pick the recording where you can hear it properly over the same thing poorly recorded.
As odd as it might seem, with a tune from the 30's, I indeed prefer an inferior sound quality. It seems odd to have such an old recording sound as bright and perfect as music sounds today. I suppose it is also why some R&B and HipHop artists deliberately add vinyl noise to their songs.
It's like with black and white movies, some of their charm lies in not being color. It works like a time machine.

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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
23501 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:27 am

So your question is actually "does sound quality even matter?" ... yeah?

fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
12923 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:30 am

thecontrolcentre wrote:So your question is actually "does sound quality even matter?" ... yeah?
Isn't that a big part of production? Many producers are at the same time recording engineers, be it with a degree or based on their long experience.

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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
23501 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:34 am

fluffy_little_something wrote:
thecontrolcentre wrote:So your question is actually "does sound quality even matter?" ... yeah?
Isn't that a big part of production? Many producers are at the same time recording engineers, be it with a degree or based on their long experience.
Not really. You said you preferred poor sound reproduction over good quality reproductions of older music. That has nothing to do with music production. Its down to bad copies.

fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
12923 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:44 am

What I mean is that I prefer the sound associated with the era and genre the music represents.

The disco era for instance had its typical sound. If late 70's disco music were produced with today's technology and production methods, it would sound wrong somehow. So, the fact that of course modern music sounds much more perfect, does not help, it would even be negative.

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Nielzie
KVRAF
8986 posts since 28 May, 2005 from Netherlands

Re: Does production even matter?

Post Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:05 am

Try Metallica's "…And Justice for All" album. Man did they f**k up the production on that one. Despite some songs being pretty good (if you like that style of course), I just can't listen to it without thinking how they would sound if they where properly produced.
None are so hopeless enslaved as KVRians with GAS.

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