Need Help With Trance Project (CD Completed)

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?
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Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:43 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:39 am
he has something going on with his cut off knob
Wiggle it until it spits acid 8)

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wagtunes
KVRAF
14579 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:47 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:39 am
Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sat Oct 20, 2018 11:14 pm
wagtunes wrote:
Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:50 pm
what DO you use?
https://www.musicradar.com/news/tech/5- ... ins-639062

These are all good. Though I don't have any experience of that 808 vsti but rest I've tested and they're all good.

Xfer Nerve is really kickass, though it's a drum machine.

Microtonic, a drum machine again but at some point widely used.

Wave alchemy evolution is insanely good, though it doesn't involve synthesis but works with samples.

Izotope Breaktweaker is also fun if your machine can handle it.


But staying in kick machines, mostly I use BazzISM and Punchbox. Though my needs are a bit different than what they are in liftup/epic/etc trance.
I know I said I wouldn't post, but I can't not help someone who clearly is trying to make solid trance (this is not meant for distorted horizon, he has something going on with his cut off knob)...In agreement with Mushy and above, I use Kick 2, Bazzism and most of the time Metrum from Vengeance. It allows 4 layers and you can see them all. Sure some of the GUI is a bit tiny, but the functions make up for it. And you can synthesize your own kick and shape it. The easiest one I think, and I still use it, is Big Kick. You have 2 layers, you can tune your kick (pretty important) easily and there are deeper functions if you need them. Its well laid out and you can load your own samples. It works well for a beginner. At the next level of complexity are Kick 2 and Metrum, both of them allow shaping of the kick at multiple points along the waveform. So its all good. I really like Punchbox and want to find a use for it since it does really hard kicks real easy. Most kick vst's can do everything you need to make a good trance kick. I recently started using Spark from Arturia and Stix from Xils to add my percussion and kick in one sequencer and both are awesome. It all depends on your own personal workflow and what you prefer.
Thanks. This is very helpful.

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Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:51 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hduyLU9 ... tu.be&t=25

This seems interesting.. Shame it's a RP plugin.

JoaquinAce
KVRist
115 posts since 8 Apr, 2018 from SC, USA

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am

Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:51 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hduyLU9 ... tu.be&t=25

This seems interesting.. Shame it's a RP plugin.
I tried this within 2 min that I received the email that its released and I was very disappointed. The idea behind it is fantastic for my workflow, but I had the feel there was huge latency between adjusting the knobs (not distorted horizons cut off knob) and sound coming out. Almost as if it wasn't working smoothly. Definitely buggy in my hands. Went back to the previously mentioned kick synths. I also have Punch-BD and that works ok I guess, but if you can use Metrum, no need to use Punch-BD. For Wags I would really recommend Metrum or Kick 2 or Big Kick, but its better to pick one and just keep using it unless it really inhibits your workflow. On a side note, I also use FM8 to synthesize my own kicks. You can make a super nice layered kick (multiple layers in one instance of FM8) using FM synthesis as well as tune them. I then use 2 or 3 FM8 instances, each with 3-4 layers. Keep in mind, these "layers" are each just a wave that I am modulating with another wave, ie FM synthesis. Then I use compression and EQ and some other tools to shape the kick further. Here is a link to my Soundcloud where I made a single layered FM kick: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282/fm-kick-1.
Keep in mind that this kick would now be layered another 2-3 times and then further processed so its as far from a finished kick as me from cut off knob issues.
Artist name: Joaquin Ace
SoundCloud: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282

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Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:10 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am
(not distorted horizons cut off knob)
Should I be worried of your obsession to my cutoff? 8)

JoaquinAce
KVRist
115 posts since 8 Apr, 2018 from SC, USA

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:17 am

Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:10 am
JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am
(not distorted horizons cut off knob)
Should I be worried of your obsession to my cutoff? 8)
Depends on the filter
Artist name: Joaquin Ace
SoundCloud: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282

User avatar
Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:06 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:17 am
Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:10 am
JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am
(not distorted horizons cut off knob)
Should I be worried of your obsession to my cutoff? 8)
Depends on the filter
Fat and juicy :lol:

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14579 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:32 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am
Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:51 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hduyLU9 ... tu.be&t=25

This seems interesting.. Shame it's a RP plugin.
I tried this within 2 min that I received the email that its released and I was very disappointed. The idea behind it is fantastic for my workflow, but I had the feel there was huge latency between adjusting the knobs (not distorted horizons cut off knob) and sound coming out. Almost as if it wasn't working smoothly. Definitely buggy in my hands. Went back to the previously mentioned kick synths. I also have Punch-BD and that works ok I guess, but if you can use Metrum, no need to use Punch-BD. For Wags I would really recommend Metrum or Kick 2 or Big Kick, but its better to pick one and just keep using it unless it really inhibits your workflow. On a side note, I also use FM8 to synthesize my own kicks. You can make a super nice layered kick (multiple layers in one instance of FM8) using FM synthesis as well as tune them. I then use 2 or 3 FM8 instances, each with 3-4 layers. Keep in mind, these "layers" are each just a wave that I am modulating with another wave, ie FM synthesis. Then I use compression and EQ and some other tools to shape the kick further. Here is a link to my Soundcloud where I made a single layered FM kick: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282/fm-kick-1.
Keep in mind that this kick would now be layered another 2-3 times and then further processed so its as far from a finished kick as me from cut off knob issues.
Thanks for the suggestion on Metrum or Kick 2. With a synth like FM 8, don't you have the problem with the oscillators not cycling properly ending up with a mushy sounding kick? I know there are some synths that I've tried to make a solid kick with that it's just impossible.

User avatar
Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:14 am

wagtunes wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:32 am
don't you have the problem with the oscillators not cycling properly ending up with a mushy sounding kick?
Bounce a 4 bar loop to audio and pick the kick that sounds the best. Then use that for the whole song.

JoaquinAce
KVRist
115 posts since 8 Apr, 2018 from SC, USA

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:23 am

wagtunes wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:32 am
JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:37 am
Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:51 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hduyLU9 ... tu.be&t=25

This seems interesting.. Shame it's a RP plugin.
I tried this within 2 min that I received the email that its released and I was very disappointed. The idea behind it is fantastic for my workflow, but I had the feel there was huge latency between adjusting the knobs (not distorted horizons cut off knob) and sound coming out. Almost as if it wasn't working smoothly. Definitely buggy in my hands. Went back to the previously mentioned kick synths. I also have Punch-BD and that works ok I guess, but if you can use Metrum, no need to use Punch-BD. For Wags I would really recommend Metrum or Kick 2 or Big Kick, but its better to pick one and just keep using it unless it really inhibits your workflow. On a side note, I also use FM8 to synthesize my own kicks. You can make a super nice layered kick (multiple layers in one instance of FM8) using FM synthesis as well as tune them. I then use 2 or 3 FM8 instances, each with 3-4 layers. Keep in mind, these "layers" are each just a wave that I am modulating with another wave, ie FM synthesis. Then I use compression and EQ and some other tools to shape the kick further. Here is a link to my Soundcloud where I made a single layered FM kick: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282/fm-kick-1.
Keep in mind that this kick would now be layered another 2-3 times and then further processed so its as far from a finished kick as me from cut off knob issues.
Thanks for the suggestion on Metrum or Kick 2. With a synth like FM 8, don't you have the problem with the oscillators not cycling properly ending up with a mushy sounding kick? I know there are some synths that I've tried to make a solid kick with that it's just impossible.
See distortion horizon's suggestion. You don't use the MIDI, you bounce down to audio and only use 1-4 kicks and duplicate.
Artist name: Joaquin Ace
SoundCloud: https://soundcloud.com/user-654529282

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Distorted Horizon
KVRAF
1529 posts since 17 Jan, 2017

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:01 am

JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:23 am
See distortion horizon's suggestion. You don't use the MIDI, you bounce down to audio and only use 1-4 kicks and duplicate.
Aaaaaand from this we can go to the subject "what you're after really" :D

If you're after "organic sounds" you don't bounce and let it roll like it rolls, if you're after "modern and tight" you bounce it and use only the kick that has the best snap and tightest sound.

Same goes with psy bass, except that modern vst's can give stable bbb without bouncing.

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vurt
addled muppet weed
40529 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 11:30 am

Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:43 am
JoaquinAce wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:39 am
he has something going on with his cut off knob
Wiggle it until it spits acid 8)
:scared:
:hihi:

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14579 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:50 pm

Something really strange is happening to me.

As I'm closing in on 250 tracks listened to (probably in the next couple of days) and after watching the structure breakdown video, I'm starting to feel the music better because I know what's coming. In fact, with some of these artists (I listen to a lot of songs from some of these artists) I can even recognize their style. Now that's when you know that somebody is special when they sound like themselves in a genre that has so many similarities.

I'm finding I'm also really enjoying this music. It doesn't sound monotonous to me anymore because I'm anticipating the subtle changes, which really comes down to arrangement for most of these songs. The main hook stays pretty consistent throughout, with the exception of the breakdowns. And even there, you can sometimes hear the relationship to the rest of the track.

I also love the artists who "break" the rules without really breaking the rules. It's hard to explain what I mean without playing a track and pointing out where the twist comes in while still holding true to the genre.

All of this has become quite a surprise to me. And I think it will be reflected in my next track.

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
40529 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:58 pm

name a few of the ones youre enjoying then.
be interesting to see where your tastes lie :)

User avatar
wagtunes
KVRAF
14579 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: Need Help With Trance Project

Post Sun Oct 21, 2018 2:27 pm

vurt wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 1:58 pm
name a few of the ones youre enjoying then.
be interesting to see where your tastes lie :)
My tastes are actually all over the place, from Hardcore to Vocal Trance bordering on a typical 90s pop song.

Here are just a few of my favorites but don't try to read any consistency in any of this.

Juno Reactor
The Cynic Project
Paul Van Dyk
Gareth Emery
Jorn Van Deynhoven
Art Of Trance
Headhunterz
Ratty
The Thrillseekers
Cygnus X
Astrix

That should keep you busy for a while

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