KVR Audio

Forgotten · Post by **Forgotten** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:20 am

telecode wrote:I guess it really depends what level of music theory training you have and the type of music you make.

Not necessarily - I know how to arrange, but most of the time I'll figure it out by ear as it's quicker than thinking it through. A lot of musicians don't know a lick of theory, but they instinctively know what fits into an arrangement.

dodeca · Post by **dodeca** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:31 am

Forgotten wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:51 pm If I use a chord sequence I want to hunt it, skin it and cook it myself rather than get it in a vacuum sealed package from the supermarket.

Best line I've read in a while.

telecode · Post by **telecode** » Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:49 pm

Forgotten wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:20 am
telecode wrote:I guess it really depends what level of music theory training you have and the type of music you make.
Not necessarily - I know how to arrange, but most of the time I'll figure it out by ear as it's quicker than thinking it through. A lot of musicians don't know a lick of theory, but they instinctively know what fits into an arrangement.

In my experience it have found it to be opposite. When collaborating with others who use a more organic approach, timing , structure, timing and other weird things constantly come up. When you use tools , it helps with keeping things straight and even and correct. Sort of like a hand saw vs mitre saw.

Tj Shredder · Post by **Tj Shredder** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:18 am

Has anyone looked at it from an instrumental point of view? I mean even if I know the basics of harmony, I still need to learn to play the chords. Depending on the instrument I need to get a lot of positions into my muscle memory.
I envision an instrument that simply plays the chords with a single stroke on a pad. I am inspired, I’ll cobble together a chordstrument in Max for my Launchpad mini or better the Sensel Morph for its espressivity...

Michael L · Post by **Michael L** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:27 am

^^^Check out Fabrizio Poce's chord and harmony instruments he made in Max as standalone and Ableton devices, and use Launchpad as isomorphic controllers:
http://fabriziopoce.com/download.html

"The J74 ISO Controllers standalone desktop application turns the popular Novation Launchpad controllers (Launchpad Pro, MK2, classic, S and Mini) into multi-template isomorphic instruments. By re-assigning notes to the pads and using colors to give essential and intuitive information about the harmonic characteristics, the layouts turn the controllers in easy to play instruments for harmony and melody."

I have his J74 Progressive Standalone, but not Launchpad yet

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:16 pm

It happens that I use chord generator tools, but it is very rare and it is essentially to see "what they are capable to suggest compared to my tool". And quasi-systematically I come back to my usual tool. Which one is it ? Simply a circle of fifths. When I'm missing inspiration to go on a new path when I compose, most of time I use simply the famous chord wheel (the circle of fifths)... and if I need an help I prefer to refer to these four books (click the pictures):

They all are available on all the worldwide platforms of Amazon. And the first one has even been translated to French.

These four books and a circle of fifths (online) are my only tools for the chord progressions. Several example of interactive circles of fifths (my preferred is the first one):

https://websemantics.uk/tools/circle-of ... ord-wheel/

http://www.all-guitar-chords.com/circle-of-fifths.php

https://randscullard.com/CircleOfFifths/

https://www.fachords.com/tools/circle-of-fifths/

More technical:
https://mdecks.com/graphs/mcircle.php

It is very easy (and even extremely easy) to learn the circle of fifths, and it is the best tool to perfectly and definitely understand the chord progressions, the transpositions, the modulations, the inversions, etc.

telecode · Post by **telecode** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:42 pm

Yeah. But no one reads books anymore in this stuff. why would you when the functionality is built within the tool you are using? It's sort of like keeping a dictionary and thesaurus next to the computer on which you are using to write a document in Word. So unless you are writing an essay on ancient Judaic scrolls, you really just need the built in dictionary and tools.

I'll read stuff on philosophical musings on music and theory and creativity such as below, but I won't referece a book on chords since it's a function I already paid for with my purchase of the DAW.

vurt · Post by **vurt** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:51 pm

which is why we cant have nice things

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:56 pm

telecode wrote: ↑Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:42 pm Yeah. But no one reads books anymore in this stuff. why would you when the functionality is built within the tool you are using? It's sort of like keeping a dictionary and thesaurus next to the computer on which you are using to write a document in Word. So unless you are writing an essay on ancient Judaic scrolls, you really just need the built in dictionary and tools.

I'll read stuff on philosophical musings on music and theory and creativity such as below, but I won't referece a book on chords since it's a function I already paid for with my purchase of the DAW.

It's a personal choice. You talk for you, not for everybody. There are many more persons than you know who still read books, especially when it is excellent books. And also in the music world.

And anyway... you can also learn the circle of fifth with excellent websites and with plethora of videos on Youtube, with a good bunch of them being of high quality for teaching of learning.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:39 pm

telecode wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:11 am But.IMO, there.is nothing wrong with using those tools as long as you are creating interesting and original material.

How does one create original material when they can't even deal with chord changes as their own idea because they don't really know how? Rhetorical question, note well.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:43 pm

telecode wrote: ↑Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:42 pm Yeah. But no one reads books anymore in this stuff. why would you when the functionality is built within the tool you are using? It's sort of like keeping a dictionary and thesaurus next to the computer on which you are using to write a document in Word.

who reads this kind of book and needs to keep it as a reference right by their side for life?
Someone with a real deficiency of memory at the least.

You're actually trying to say never learn it because you'll never learn it with that. It's virtually unbelievable a person has this degree of difficulty understanding the concept.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:44 pm

One internalizes the concepts and learns to think for oneself with a coherent and useful grounding under one.
No, the notion that one is going to write something original from not knowing how to do basic stuff, it's maybe original like The Shaggs were. Maybe if one has huge energy one can keep a bunch of very talented people drinking your Kool-Aid held captive in a trailer in the desert, one of them being a John French, and come away with a Trout Mask Replica...

Forgotten · Post by **Forgotten** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:46 pm

jancivil wrote: ↑Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:44 pm You internalize the concepts and learn to think for yourself with a coherent and useful grounding under you.

I actually find that separation of learning and playing very useful, as it allows me to give consideration to concepts and ideas where there simply isn't time to do so while playing.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:48 pm

One thing I remember wekk from being a very young musician is someone advising 'Don't write with a book in your hand.'.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:52 pm

why would you when the functionality is built within the tool you are using?

Asked and answered many times already. So that when you write a chord progression, you're doing it from your own idea. It is just a richer experience than what you're after.

But keep waving your arms about as though we might miss the extent of you not getting it.

Do you use chord generator tools or similar plugins to create chords? Which ones?