Musikmesse 2012: Propellerhead to share "exciting news"

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headquest wrote:
Crackbaby wrote: Still the question on crossgrades exist. Personally i think that buying a plug should include all formats. It usually does.
Agreed - and the same applies to sample libraries that come in multiple formats including the Reason ReFill alongside Acid, Wav, etc.

BUT - I don't see how this could work if the Re version has to be bought from the Propellerhead marketplace with a 70/30 split. That would surely be the Re version only, and the Re version surely couldn't be bundled with the VST version by the developer without Propellerhead getting their cut.... so it looks like you will be buying one or the other.
I wouldn't be too off-put by this 70/30 equation. Software creators are happy to pay for the privilege of reaching a broader audience. If you assume that the Re price will be the current VST price + 30% to off-set the Re fee, I think that's off target.

A larger buying audience with fewer roadblocks (platform differences, piracy prevention and so on as already mentioned) between the product and the buyer means that devs can sell more 'units' for a lower price and make MORE money than they currently do.

Look at the Apple marketplace which this is clearly emulating.

How much do you pay for most iPhone or iPad apps?

Is 'Angry Birds' (just one example) a piece of crappy, off-the-cuff programming, or a pretty sophisticated and polished effort? Like the game or not, it is VERY polished, from the graphics to game play to music and everything. And yet they sell it for a dollar, and somehow manage to make serious money.

What did the 'Apple Marketplace' approach do to the price of Logic Pro?

Changes are inevitable and some of them will be drastic, and yes the music production community is much smaller than the community that will purchase something like Angry Birds, so that analogy is not without its flaws, but change will happen regardless.
Music is something you DO. Spend time, not money.
http://www.myspace.com/skipkent
http://soundcloud.com/skipkent

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Another benefit of the 'Reason Marketplace' approach is what I would call an 'impulse-friendly' sales venue. In the Apple Marketplace, you only need to enter your credit card and other purchasing info once. After that, when you see something you like at a price you're willing (in that moment) to pay, you hit 'Buy' and it's a done deal.

Currently, I see lots of interesting things for sale (VST's and such) but the impulse to buy is severely throttled by the need to yet again enter my purchase info (PayPal being the obvious exception of course). Even with something like PayPal, nagging doubts as to the stability of the purchasing process and the resulting avenues for downloading, installing and registering the product are also factors that, for me at least, have a serious impact as to whether or not I actually buy the product

Compare this to a Reason user browsing a Reason Marketplace page, seeing some shiny new device or effect, auditioning and then saying "Yes!" and hitting the Buy button. The device offered here will be for Re only, but will probably be sold for much less than half the price it's sold for elsewhere.

That said, VST plugs will probably be sold with vouchers giving a discount for the Re version. There are ALL SORTS of ways the 2 will feed into and off of each other. Maybe someone will create a walled 'VST Marketplace' that streamlines the shopping, auditioning, installation, security and purchasing processes providing devs follow some fairly strict guidelines to help ensure a smooth result for users.

That is the benefit of 'walled gardens' and restricted marketplaces. The wild frontier and marketplace jungle will always be there too, and producing good things, but some will prefer to follow someone else's guidelines in return for an impulse-friendly marketplace and a larger pool of impulsive buyers.

I think Props have made a very smart move with this approach. I think it will be very successful. The success and broader user base will in turn urge them to make other desirable changes to their base product (sequencer, midi out, etc.) to keep this audience happy.

Maybe we'll even get the ability to hear a bit of pre-roll and punch in/out our guitar tracks instead of having to adopt non-intuitive and non-traditional work-arounds.

And maybe more right-click functionality, and more flexible and extensive key-commands.

And...and maybe they'll dump the whole rack/device paradigmn and hire Jules from Raw Material to make Reason more Tracktion-like!!!

:oops: :hihi: :cry: :help: :cry: :hihi: :oops:
Music is something you DO. Spend time, not money.
http://www.myspace.com/skipkent
http://soundcloud.com/skipkent

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highkoo wrote:
VitaminD wrote: Reason as a product is crippled in it's current form due to the micro GUI. The only conclusion to which I can arrive is at the UI being tied very deeply, internally in the code... I suspect this is the only reason why they haven't updated it in 12+ years Reason has been a product; It would be A LOT of work.
Yeah that sounds like a dirty secret.
Geezuz, after seeing that GUI for the first time in a while I am just at a loss as to why this is even being discussed. Props are being discussed as the architects of this whole new ecosystem while their history is basically a tale of keeping poor pace with technology and users. Hype for hypes sake.
It was wrote: Reason as a product is crippled
+1
Know what happens to horses..? :P
In one of my comments I mentioned 1024x768 as the optimum resolution designed for Reason. But I was mistaken. I downloaded the v6 demo now and lowered screen resolutions until the rack width fit perfectly and discovered it is 800x600!!! :lol: eight hundred by six hundred pixels. That is laughable.

But that makes more sense... since I can get the double rack to fit at 1680x1050. I won't even try it at 1920x1200 or 1920x1080... would need a magnifying glass (literally) to see the text on rack modules.


I guess if I was using an older laptop with a 1366x768 resolution it wouldn't be too bad.. however, I find at current 22+ inch 'high' resolution desktop monitors it is unusable.

Perhaps the other way to use Reason currently is dual monitor - one tiled 90 degrees for the rack and one in landscape mode for the sequencer and playlist. But I'm not going out and buying a second monitor just to use Reason. :shrug:

The concept of Reason has always appealed to me.. I even suggested it to them back in Rebirth days (as I'm sure a million people did) but the GUI implementation is causing me to not give them any money.

I'll wait until they update their GUI to accommodate modern display resolutions from this century. THEN it will probably be on! :band:

We don't know what is in v6.5 though.. beyond Rack Extensions. Perhaps they have more they are holding back to announce until closer to release time.

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etherdesign wrote:Hmm.. Maybe they licensed Silent Way from Expert Sleepers and are coming out with a hardware cv module that extends patching to physical modules?
nope...os says it would be possible to do a RE version of Silent Way but no plans to do so...shame, i like what i've seen in the video...if there was at least midi out, i'd still consider Reason...
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Chuck E. Jesus wrote:
etherdesign wrote:Hmm.. Maybe they licensed Silent Way from Expert Sleepers and are coming out with a hardware cv module that extends patching to physical modules?
nope...os says it would be possible to do a RE version of Silent Way but no plans to do so...shame, i like what i've seen in the video...if there was at least midi out, i'd still consider Reason...
I have been using Reason to control my modular with an ES-3, without Silent Way. It actually works pretty well. Of course you can't callibrate oscillators or anything like that but you can send an LFO, Envelope or Sequencer out of Thor's audio outputs via the mod matrix and route it to your sound card. Silent Way is generally more flexible in this regard but it's cool to know that it can be done.

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The most interesting point imho is why so many people that don't bother with Reason still bother with replying to this thread...

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justin3am wrote:I have been using Reason to control my modular with an ES-3, without Silent Way. It actually works pretty well. Of course you can't callibrate oscillators or anything like that but you can send an LFO, Envelope or Sequencer out of Thor's audio outputs via the mod matrix and route it to your sound card. Silent Way is generally more flexible in this regard but it's cool to know that it can be done.
As have I. Works really well. It took some fiddling and a good ear to get the oscillators to track properly from the keyboard via Thor. Especially the scaling was tricky but still doable.

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eXode wrote:The most interesting point imho is why so many people that don't bother with Reason still bother with replying to this thread...
That is an interesting point.

I think, perhaps the largest reason, is because of the limitations mentioned in the posts of the people who don't bother with reason. :)


You have to understand that some of us critique not because we want to just critique, but because we see the system as having fixable issues and would LOVE to use this system if these issues were resolved.

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justin3am wrote:
Chuck E. Jesus wrote:
etherdesign wrote:Hmm.. Maybe they licensed Silent Way from Expert Sleepers and are coming out with a hardware cv module that extends patching to physical modules?
nope...os says it would be possible to do a RE version of Silent Way but no plans to do so...shame, i like what i've seen in the video...if there was at least midi out, i'd still consider Reason...
I have been using Reason to control my modular with an ES-3, without Silent Way. It actually works pretty well. Of course you can't callibrate oscillators or anything like that but you can send an LFO, Envelope or Sequencer out of Thor's audio outputs via the mod matrix and route it to your sound card. Silent Way is generally more flexible in this regard but it's cool to know that it can be done.

always the mad scientist!

after looking at some videos of Reason in action, i think i'm going to get Essentials to at least check out the sampling/etc...it seems like what i've been looking for in a very integrated work environment... i suppose i can use SW in another DAW via Rewire? (never used it)
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Chuck E. Jesus wrote:
justin3am wrote:
Chuck E. Jesus wrote:
etherdesign wrote:Hmm.. Maybe they licensed Silent Way from Expert Sleepers and are coming out with a hardware cv module that extends patching to physical modules?
nope...os says it would be possible to do a RE version of Silent Way but no plans to do so...shame, i like what i've seen in the video...if there was at least midi out, i'd still consider Reason...
I have been using Reason to control my modular with an ES-3, without Silent Way. It actually works pretty well. Of course you can't callibrate oscillators or anything like that but you can send an LFO, Envelope or Sequencer out of Thor's audio outputs via the mod matrix and route it to your sound card. Silent Way is generally more flexible in this regard but it's cool to know that it can be done.

always the mad scientist!

after looking at some videos of Reason in action, i think i'm going to get Essentials to at least check out the sampling/etc...it seems like what i've been looking for in a very integrated work environment... i suppose i can use SW in another DAW via Rewire? (never used it)
Please download the trial first!

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eXode wrote:The most interesting point imho is why so many people that don't bother with Reason still bother with replying to this thread...
this thread is what got me to take a closer look at Reason...
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eXode wrote:
justin3am wrote:I have been using Reason to control my modular with an ES-3, without Silent Way. It actually works pretty well. Of course you can't callibrate oscillators or anything like that but you can send an LFO, Envelope or Sequencer out of Thor's audio outputs via the mod matrix and route it to your sound card. Silent Way is generally more flexible in this regard but it's cool to know that it can be done.
As have I. Works really well. It took some fiddling and a good ear to get the oscillators to track properly from the keyboard via Thor. Especially the scaling was tricky but still doable.
That's pure masochism, man! I think I tried to get my Piston Honda to track over an octave using the Sequencer in Thor, for about 5 minutes. I gave up and and just used my Doepfer quantizer. :lol:
Last edited by justin3am on Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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VitaminD wrote:Please download the trial first!
i'm more a "jump right in the pool before testing the water" type...
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Not having to program to windows vs mac, set up a store-front website, and a free SDK makes me want to make a few things I've been itching to have in Reason (mostly CV mangling in a more refined and easier way). Now I need to figure out how the hell to start a corporation and get a tax id. Wish that wasn't a requirement but I can understand the need for tax laws.

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Chuck E. Jesus wrote:
VitaminD wrote:Please download the trial first!
i'm more a "jump right in the pool before testing the water" type...
What if there is a rock where you're going to land?? :-o

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