If Roland made a D50 vst emulation, would you purchase it?

[BBFG#]

... yes I HAVE used a D50 before. As I said, I OWN one as part of my V-Synth XT.

Not the same at all.

WTF? It definitely is the same. Do you own a V-Synth XT?

The reviewers have reported identical sound and performance between a real D50 and the software recreation inside a V-Synth XT or V-Synth 1's add-on card. The difference in resampling quality is even accommodated for in a setting on the V-Synth XT. It defaults to a cleaner sound but can be set to emulate the older D/A or resampling, or whatever it was that defined the crunchiness of the hardware D50.

I own a VSynthGT, I've owned D-5; D110; MT-32 and traveled with/played the D-50/D550. I've played the V-Synth using the D50 card. Propaganda aside, the sound is quite noticeably different.

[aciddose]

D50 and DX7 have entirely different synthesis architectures.

As for loathing the sound...

Reading comprehension fail.

[sfd]

And for the features - well my D-20 is a pain to program and so was the D-550 (I've never programmed a D-50 but I assume that there's no difference). So...no. Not for that either.

D-50 is identical to a lot of hardware from that era. Cheesy effects "20-in-1" rack units, almost all the synthesizers and sound modules released around that time, notably the DX-7 which arguably first brought this type of interface into view for most people.

I wouldn't say it is difficult. It isn't in my opinion any more difficult using the menus than using the programmer, much like the junos. For instruments like the DX-7 you'd end up hopelessly lost trying to use sliders or knobs without a digital readout of the value you're entering.

That said, most people seem to loath it.

I didn't say it was difficult. Just a pain. A small tiny display. Buttons with multi functions. It was very uncomfortable.

At least D-50 and D-20 had better buttons then those terrible flat ones that didn't say "click" on DX7

[aciddose]

Well that is what I meant by "difficult" though, "a pain", I don't see the difference.

It depends upon how you're using it and what you're trying to do. With a DX-7 for example I know that if I've started to get high-frequency ringing, I probably have the feedback above 5 and the gain of the modulator above 82... IIRC.

There are a lot of similar weird little glitches and caveats with the D-50... I haven't used one in such a long time I've forgotten most of the technical details. There are cases though where the envelopes will behave weirdly... The DX-7 does this too! Although differently of course there are similar situations where both synthesizers will not behave the way you'd expect.

With the D-50 in subtractive mode I remember having the filter resonance above a specific level would cause you to get noise and the bottom end would drop out at the filter was swept... I'm fairly certain this went away just as you adjusted the parameter by a few steps, so it was one of those "82" things much like the DX-7. "81 is okay, 82 is too much".

Using knobs or sliders on a control unit might seem easier, but that only makes sense while you're quickly making tweaks to a sound. In the case of synthesizers like the DX-7 and D-50 however a huge amount of effort tends to go into making fine tweaks and you really need to be very aware of exactly what you're doing and which number you're inputting.

So, for me at least, using a programmer for the D-50 wouldn't really make any difference to how much of a pain it is to program. I think that is simply a result of the sort of synthesizer it is rather than the LCD display or anything else.

That's something related to the comments about "I don't consider the D-50 a ROMpler"... I can appreciate this point of view... Just that in my own experience trying to use the D-50 as a replacement for an analog subtractive is just painful to even consider, let alone actually attempt. I found myself disgusted with the results I got much like early VST plugins.

[SeeGee]

I don't know if I'd buy one or not. Back in 1987 I was working in the keyboard department in a large music store and sold plenty of D-50s, but I got kinda tired of them after a while. They certainly have a distinctive sample set (and yes, the samples are often looped - the "DigitalNativeDance" factory patch shows this clearly), but to me there just wasn't much else to recommend them. I think the integrated effects probably had more to do with their popularity than anything since there really weren't any other mid-priced keyboards that offered that until the M1 came out a few months later, and to me they were a bit of a one-trick-pony.

In my case, if I did buy the VST it'd be a purchase made out of nostalgia more than practical musical use. I did get the M1/Wavestation VSTs though.

[BBFG#]

I don't know if I'd buy one or not. Back in 1987 I was working in the keyboard department in a large music store and sold plenty of D-50s, but I got kinda tired of them after a while. They certainly have a distinctive sample set (and yes, the samples are often looped - the "DigitalNativeDance" factory patch shows this clearly), but to me there just wasn't much else to recommend them. I think the integrated effects probably had more to do with their popularity than anything since there really weren't any other mid-priced keyboards that offered that until the M1 came out a few months later, and to me they were a bit of a one-trick-pony.

In my case, if I did buy the VST it'd be a purchase made out of nostalgia more than practical musical use. I did get the M1/Wavestation VSTs though.

We have much in common there.
Although I still voted Fish.

[Jace-BeOS]

D50 and DX7 have entirely different synthesis architectures.

As for loathing the sound...

Reading comprehension fail.

You meant the programming.... Fail indeed. My bad.

UI sucked. No argument. The touch screen version on the V-Synth XT or v-card is much easier to work with.

[Jace-BeOS]

Back to the "would you buy it"... Nostalgia can be a powerful thing. i actually bought my V-Synth XT as a sound source for the D50 sounds. Nostalgia indeed, but not of the D50 itself. My nostalgia was of the Amiga Soundtracker sound set created by sampling the D50 (and other synths of the era). i was insane, buying such an expensive device, just for the D50 sounds, but there it is.

Anyway, the synth is cool. i just need to use it more. i barely use the D50 mode except for the time i recreated the ST-01 samples that originally came from a D50. Actually, i did route it through my Korg M3m's Radias card. Using the D50 as an OSC source on the Radias is fun Running that through further processing is even more fun.

[kbaccki]

Who knew a crappy old 80's digital synth was so divisive?

[V0RT3X]

Who knew a crappy old 80's digital synth was so divisive?

I hear ya

[mztk]

There are a lot of similar weird little glitches and caveats with the D-50... I haven't used one in such a long time I've forgotten most of the technical details. There are cases though where the envelopes will behave weirdly... The DX-7 does this too! Although differently of course there are similar situations where both synthesizers will not behave the way you'd expect.

With the D-50 in subtractive mode I remember having the filter resonance above a specific level would cause you to get noise and the bottom end would drop out at the filter was swept... I'm fairly certain this went away just as you adjusted the parameter by a few steps, so it was one of those "82" things much like the DX-7. "81 is okay, 82 is too much".

Using knobs or sliders on a control unit might seem easier, but that only makes sense while you're quickly making tweaks to a sound. In the case of synthesizers like the DX-7 and D-50 however a huge amount of effort tends to go into making fine tweaks and you really need to be very aware of exactly what you're doing and which number you're inputting.

So, for me at least, using a programmer for the D-50 wouldn't really make any difference to how much of a pain it is to program. I think that is simply a result of the sort of synthesizer it is rather than the LCD display or anything else.

That's something related to the comments about "I don't consider the D-50 a ROMpler"... I can appreciate this point of view... Just that in my own experience trying to use the D-50 as a replacement for an analog subtractive is just painful to even consider, let alone actually attempt. I found myself disgusted with the results I got much like early VST plugins.

the keyfollow/bias point and all that stuff are pretty inconceivable to program through the
LCD but represent a lot of what those synths were aimed at at that time performance
parameters. a friend of mine who has a D550 with PG1000 prefers it to the MKS70+PG800
next to it.

would you want it to replace an analogue when they are digital and have a different
character? they can do a few sounds 'like' analogue, and you'll be put off by waveforms
like 'Chiffs'(?) and glass/bottle etc. unless you really want to get into the 80s/GM spirit.
if you want to check out that sound maybe best to get a jd800 covered in faders? same
sort of thing, i haven't really checked one out to see what it misses from the jd990 rack.
(was interested to note that a tx802 sounds fatter next to a jv1080 doing a similar sound)

i find the D-110 i have raw and dirty, quite limited in an interesting way, and also
quite versatile and credible. pain to program even with the PG-10 progger, but i'm
keeping it. needs a memory card to expand user memories. wondering how different the
d550 might be with the extra LFOs - you really need the additional waveform cards.

[mztk]

@acidose: have you managed to put keyscaling and breakpoints etc.
in your xhip yet? i'm struggling with modulation routing in synthedit,
merging cvs etc., on a hybrid project with synth+'pcm'. i've got the
waveform mangling working quite well, not specifically accurate but
you can go sound digging with it. just need to get all the modulators
working correctly, and it is costing lots of cpu just running the prefab.

[sfd]

I believe it was the impact the D50 had on it's time that makes it a memorable classic. Rather then anything else.

So, I would only, and eventually, buy a VST version for nostalgic reasons Like a gimmic or something.

[mztk]

which is where VST is good, if you're only going to go for a sound once
in a while.

[ghettosynth]

That's something related to the comments about "I don't consider the D-50 a ROMpler"... I can appreciate this point of view... Just that in my own experience trying to use the D-50 as a replacement for an analog subtractive is just painful to even consider, let alone actually attempt. I found myself disgusted with the results I got much like early VST plugins.

Yeah, that filter, it's not much better on the JD-800 really.