Is it time for a post-modern interpretation of nineties music?

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egbert101 wrote:
wagtunes wrote: My point to posting all those videos, for those who missed it and need a diagram, is that the conversation here which, I thought, was supposed to be about recreating 90s style music, ended up a discussion about dnb. I mean there was more going on in the 90s than just dnb. And that's what I subtly tried to remind people.
You can talk about whatever you want on this thread. :hihi: Basically I'm more interested in reinventing the essence of 90s music rather than recreating, hence I used the term post-modern, but if others want to talk about recreating, that's fine by me.
The reality is the 90s beat you to it: this was the decade at The End of History after all. I'd argue that DnB exemplifies this neatly.

If you look at the dominant styles of the 90s they were largely about repackaging styles from the 60s, 70s and bits of the 80s in novel and not so novel ways. Jungle/dnb stole breakbeats from hiphop and sped them up but attached them to the slow bass of dub. Garage slowed the beats back down again and borrowed the bass from disco/house. Primal Scream gaffa-taped 60s psych rock onto house which arrived by way of disco. Trance gave you motorik and ragas strapped to a techno base. Techno (which arrived in the 80s in any case) came by way of Kraftwerk and electro/funk. Grunge mixed punk and rock. And then you had a bunch of shiny power ballads that mixed 80s chord progressions with OTT 70s styles.

If you want a "sound of the 90s" that belonged to the 90s, the sampled, telephone-EQed breakbeat is probably it.

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Funny how everyone focuses on the breakbeat, which to be sure is not unimportant, but for me what attracted me to the best DnB is there is a freedom, musical intelligence and 'elasticity' that comes closest to free jazz (only bad DnB reduces everything to the beat).

Its all there in Brown Paper Bag

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aMUSEd wrote: but for me what attracted me to the best DnB is there is a freedom, musical intelligence and 'elasticity'

A reflection of the time. The 90's were a very free and open and fun time to be alive, when anything was possible and you could live freely. People were having fun.

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aMUSEd wrote:Funny how everyone focuses on the breakbeat, which to be sure is not unimportant, but for me what attracted me to the best DnB is there is a freedom, musical intelligence and 'elasticity' that comes closest to free jazz (only bad DnB reduces everything to the beat).
I'm sure that's true...
aMUSEd wrote:Its all there in Brown Paper Bag
...wait, what? If anyone clings slavishly to the same beat through three-quarters of the track it's Roni Size - you can skip through Brown Paper Bag and practically wherever you land, it's the same repeated backing loop. If you strip off the beat you wind up with pleasant but pedestrian lounge music for much of New Forms. I have the same issue with Alex Reece.

Omni Trio at least had a go at cutting the beats to make something interesting out of the same kind of source material but I'd opt for Photek and Squarepusher as really delivering on the idea of DnB as being true to the spirit of jazz. And the reality is, even then, the percussion is responsible for it sounding different to what came before when you listen to, say, Coopers World or Beep St on HND. Vic Acid later on that album is where you start to get to the point where they start to pull the music away from warmed-over loungecore and plot a course towards drill and bass (for good and ill).

Summary: it is about the beats, pretty much.

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Isn't it about time for a Madchester revival?
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It's time for something different. Personally, I love to take elements from classical works (I'm a 50% classical listener) because simply, that world is full of great ideas and melodies. And for instance, Jean Sibelius will not sue you if you borrow from his En Saga Oboe ending melody. From Ae we know, you can do all sorts of crazy IDM, add very subtle melody to it, fractions of melodies, scattered, however[1] - people love it. So if using melodies or parts of it, why not just using good ones?

[1] going full melody seems to be a taboo in IDM, because hey, our beloved autistic knob twiddlers want to be different

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Gamma-UT wrote: The reality is the 90s beat you to it: this was the decade at The End of History after all. I'd argue that DnB exemplifies this neatly.

If you look at the dominant styles of the 90s they were largely about repackaging styles from the 60s, 70s and bits of the 80s in novel and not so novel ways. Jungle/dnb stole breakbeats from hiphop and sped them up but attached them to the slow bass of dub. Garage slowed the beats back down again and borrowed the bass from disco/house. Primal Scream gaffa-taped 60s psych rock onto house which arrived by way of disco. Trance gave you motorik and ragas strapped to a techno base. Techno (which arrived in the 80s in any case) came by way of Kraftwerk and electro/funk. Grunge mixed punk and rock. And then you had a bunch of shiny power ballads that mixed 80s chord progressions with OTT 70s styles.

If you want a "sound of the 90s" that belonged to the 90s, the sampled, telephone-EQed breakbeat is probably it.
Pretty much the case IMO. And in the world of popular and semi-popular music it has been a downhill stumble since. On the fringes there's some liveliness.
tapiodmitriyevich wrote:It's time for something different. Personally, I love to take elements from classical works (I'm a 50% classical listener) because simply, that world is full of great ideas and melodies. And for instance, Jean Sibelius will not sue you if you borrow from his En Saga Oboe ending melody. From Ae we know, you can do all sorts of crazy IDM, add very subtle melody to it, fractions of melodies, scattered, however[1] - people love it. So if using melodies or parts of it, why not just using good ones?

[1] going full melody seems to be a taboo in IDM, because hey, our beloved autistic knob twiddlers want to be different


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if this post is edited -it was for punctuation, grammar, or to make it coherent (or make me seem coherent).

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