Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Effects discussion
SparkySpark
KVRian
1304 posts since 30 Aug, 2004 from Skövde, Sweden

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 6:48 am

Hi,

I am using the CM edition of Vielklang. It is a great product!

However, I would like to supply the chords (like hook it up to a MIDI track on my host) and let the plugin do the voice leading itself. Does anyone know if this is possible?

From what I can tell the LE edition only supports manual configuration on a per note basis and the full edition also based on MIDI input, but then the voice leading and auto-arrangement are lost (I think).

Really cool would be if a MIDI track could define both the chords and when the plugin should produce its music, like a vocoder or like the old Roland VP70.
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
From 9 PM to 5 AM.
Go MuLab!

SparkySpark
KVRian
1304 posts since 30 Aug, 2004 from Skövde, Sweden

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 7:10 am

BTW, for a Vielklang 3: since this is Zplane (makers of elastique) why not set the arrangement one octave higher or lower as an option, to get a make lead vocalist with a female choir (or opposite)?
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
From 9 PM to 5 AM.
Go MuLab!

Etienne1973
KVRist
293 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:58 am

SparkySpark wrote:However, I would like to supply the chords (like hook it up to a MIDI track on my host) and let the plugin do the voice leading itself. Does anyone know if this is possible?
Not possible with Vielklang 2 full version.
Manual wrote:In MIDI input mode no automatic harmonization is generated. Harmonization is controlled by MIDI input. Play up to 3 voices on a MIDI keyboard or a MIDI track at the input of vielklang2 to control the harmonies.

SparkySpark
KVRian
1304 posts since 30 Aug, 2004 from Skövde, Sweden

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 3:44 pm

Etienne1973 wrote:
SparkySpark wrote:However, I would like to supply the chords (like hook it up to a MIDI track on my host) and let the plugin do the voice leading itself. Does anyone know if this is possible?
Not possible with Vielklang 2 full version.
Manual wrote:In MIDI input mode no automatic harmonization is generated. Harmonization is controlled by MIDI input. Play up to 3 voices on a MIDI keyboard or a MIDI track at the input of vielklang2 to control the harmonies.
Thanks, that's what I feared. That means I don't get the workflow really. Let's say I have a normal pop song where I would like a fat choir section on the chorus. I obviously know the chords of the song, but a pop song is normally not that melodic so it's not possible for the auto-harmonic tool to recognize the chords.

For example: In my current song, it's Am, F, C, G (or actually another key, but this is easier to grasp), but the auto function thinks it's Am, Am, Am, G. This means I must manually tweak every note, saying it's Am or whatever chord it should be. It would be SO MUCH easier if I could just draw the chords on a MIDI track, and perhaps also via the notes tell other things, like voice spreading, and what octaves the choir should engulf. This could be done a bit like the excellent AAS Strum Session, where one note means a major chord, and the note plus the white key below means the minor version of the chord (so if I draw A and G it would be Am), etc.

I hope there will be a Vielklang 3, and that this feature will be implemented then. Actually, Vielklang is better for me than Melodyne: Melodyne can only be either in standalone (unsynced) mode or in need of ARA. My host does not have ARA, so that means no syncing to my music. Vielklang on the other hand works as a VST instrument, so I can listen to my edits as I make them.

The way the plugin is designed today, it seems like the auto-recognition and the auto-harmonizing are almost wasted, since one has to choose between a rather clumsy way to change the chords on the timeline, one by one as I understand it, or get no auto features at all, if using MIDI input. ...or perhaps I have misunderstood the whole thing! :wink:
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
From 9 PM to 5 AM.
Go MuLab!

Etienne1973
KVRist
293 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:04 pm

SparkySpark wrote:Melodyne can only be either in standalone (unsynced) mode or in need of ARA. My host does not have ARA, so that means no syncing to my music.
You can insert Melodyne as an effect plugin in any DAW.

SparkySpark
KVRian
1304 posts since 30 Aug, 2004 from Skövde, Sweden

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:17 pm

Etienne1973 wrote:
SparkySpark wrote:Melodyne can only be either in standalone (unsynced) mode or in need of ARA. My host does not have ARA, so that means no syncing to my music.
You can insert Melodyne as an effect plugin in any DAW.
Wow, you're right! It works via Rewire. Thanks a lot, really helpful. :clap:
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
From 9 PM to 5 AM.
Go MuLab!

Etienne1973
KVRist
293 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:32 pm

SparkySpark wrote:
Etienne1973 wrote:
SparkySpark wrote:Melodyne can only be either in standalone (unsynced) mode or in need of ARA. My host does not have ARA, so that means no syncing to my music.
You can insert Melodyne as an effect plugin in any DAW.
Wow, you're right! It works via Rewire. Thanks a lot, really helpful. :clap:
Does your DAW provide VST? If yes, you can load the Melodyne VST effect plugin and you use without Rewire.

SparkySpark
KVRian
1304 posts since 30 Aug, 2004 from Skövde, Sweden

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:43 am

Oh sure (it's MuLab). Thanks!
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
From 9 PM to 5 AM.
Go MuLab!

bitman
KVRist
140 posts since 18 Aug, 2008

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Tue Jun 26, 2018 6:21 am

The TC Helicon Voicetone H1 hardware pedal has a sidechain input called guitar so the diatonic harmonizer can chase the incoming chords. You have to have enough i/o on your interface to do this as well as impedance matching. But..... yeah.

User avatar
martinjuenke
KVRAF
2331 posts since 28 Dec, 2015 from Germany

Re: Vielklang or similar: voice leading from chords

Post Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:10 am

SparkySpark wrote:Hi,

I am using the CM edition of Vielklang. It is a great product!

However, I would like to supply the chords (like hook it up to a MIDI track on my host) and let the plugin do the voice leading itself. Does anyone know if this is possible?

From what I can tell the LE edition only supports manual configuration on a per note basis and the full edition also based on MIDI input, but then the voice leading and auto-arrangement are lost (I think).

Really cool would be if a MIDI track could define both the chords and when the plugin should produce its music, like a vocoder or like the old Roland VP70.
Maybe I misinterprete the OP but Zplane Vielklang (I have the full version) is very capable for example to take a voice phrase from a vocal library, to analyse the melody, generate a three or four voicing or whatever on basis of chord rules the users chooses, then to export the whole note set into a Midi file, reimport that file and put some quality voice library on it.

For me it‘s an amazing thing. Sometimes I correct the rather conventional chord voicing to some more exotic or strange, but that‘s more pleasure than burden...

Flowing atmospheric music
http://www.sonoryth.bandcamp.com/music

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