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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6992 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:16 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

Most basic interfaces do not have MIDI. In fact, fewer and fewer. Our Scarlett 2i2 doesn't, neither does our Yamaha AG06 or Line6 UX 2. Even our Line6 KB 37 and Edirol PCR 1 don't have MIDI and they're both frickin' keyboards!

When I go over to my bandmate's place I use his gear, so it would never occur to me to bring my own I/O device - there wouldn't be anywhere to plug it in. The only time I take my interface is to gigs and even the big ones are insignificant in the face of everything we take to a show. That said, if I can use the Analog Keys or Ultranova as the I/O device, that's what I do. But that's about streamlining the set-up more than portability or anything.

If portability is a big consideration, then that's another big tick for the Zoom U24. It's actually designed to be thrown into a bag without you having to worry about damaging a knob shaft or having settings screwed up in transit. It can even run on batteries so it won't drain your laptop battery. That it's also the best interface I've ever had is almost a bonus.

As for "arguing", nobody is arguing. It's called a discussion and it involves the free and frank exchange of ideas. If it seems otherwise, it's because you provided too little information for the rest of us to have a full understanding of what your needs are. Now that you've explained further, it is completely obvious why you wouldn't make do with ASIO-4-All. It's exactly why I tend to waffle on and rarely make one line posts.
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Acer Switch5 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, MicroMonsta
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11022 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:21 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

BONES wrote:Most basic interfaces do not have MIDI. In fact, fewer and fewer. Our Scarlett 2i2 doesn't, neither does our Yamaha AG06 or Line6 UX 2. Even our Line6 KB 37 and Edirol PCR 1 don't have MIDI and they're both frickin' keyboards


Granted, the bottom of the barrel choose to leave them off, but that's not "most" basic interfaces. That's just the most basic of interfaces. As you go up in price, and you don't have to go very far, you will find few exceptions. I should have just said most interfaces include a midi connector because it is still a useful feature to many musicians.

My advice is, in fact, to avoid the bottom of the barrel stuff that you've apparently embraced. Get a decent basic interface that isn't scraping so low that a midi interface makes it unprofitable and you might get a few other useful features in the bargain.

When I go over to my bandmate's place I use his gear, so it would never occur to me to bring my own I/O device


Sounds like you don't have the kinds of experiences that I'm talking about then, right?

- there wouldn't be anywhere to plug it in.


How about extra inputs on his home interface? You might want to consider that your use cases are very narrow. It also sounds like your mates don't have very much gear. When my friends come over to jam they plug their interfaces into either one of my mixers or my multi input interfaces.

If portability is a big consideration, then that's another big tick for the Zoom U24.


I'm not suggesting that one compromise their selection for portability. That's some marketing crap there, you can put most any interface in a backpack and it will be fine. I wouldn't buy or recommend a Zoom. They are not known for their drivers. I have considered them several times in the past for particular use cases and decided against their recorder/interface products because so many people had problems with their drivers.

As for "arguing", nobody is arguing.


Certainly you are, you're arguing that midi ports aren't important but that's coming from your narrow perspective. I jam with friends, friends of friends, and strangers regularly and have more than once needed the midi port exactly SO I could use their gear.

Again, I wouldn't compromise on this and I certainly wouldn't scrap the bottom of the barrel.

YMMV and all that
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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6992 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:34 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

ghettosynth wrote:My advice is, in fact, to avoid the bottom of the barrel stuff that you've apparently embraced. Get a decent basic interface that isn't scraping so low that a midi interface makes it unprofitable and you might get a few other useful features in the bargain.

Well, in my considerably greater experience, your advice is garbage, I'm afraid. Consider the facts, the cheapest I/O device I own is actually the best of the lot of 'em and the ones that cost the most do very little, if anything, to justify their higher price tags. You might want to try and justify spending more than you had to but it's pretty poor form to advise others to make the same mistakes you've made. The reality is that if you want low latency and a clean signal in and out, you can get that for under $100, with MIDI if you want that too.
Sounds like you don't have the kinds of experiences that I'm talking about then, right?

We know that now, don't we? But we didn't before.
How about extra inputs on his home interface?

So we'd have one interface feeding into another. Why do that when you can use ASIO-4-all and just plug it into a mixer? I only need an interface if I want to record something external and his will do as well as mine.
You might want to consider that your use cases are very narrow.

And you might want to consider that I have put a lot more thought, time and effort into it than you and my set-up is far better optimised than yours for anything I might want or need to do. After all, I've been doing this for a very, very long time and I've tried pretty much every variation known to man. The reality is that I am almost certain that my use cases are far broader than yours, in that we perform live as well as release studio albums. Our music includes vocals and absolutely all of it gets done on my laptop. I'm struggling to think what else anyone might want or need to do that I couldn't do with my set-up.
It also sounds like your mates don't have very much gear.

He's got twice as much stuff as I do, so much that he's had to buy a 16 channel mixer to make it all work together.
When my friends come over to jam they plug their interfaces into either one of my mixers or my multi input interfaces.

Sounds like the perfect use case for ASIO-4-All to me.
I wouldn't buy or recommend a Zoom. They are not known for their drivers.

Ah, so you make decisions based on perception, not reality. I don't worry about reputations, I make the effort to find out for myself. Read any review of the U-24 or U-44 and you'll see how absurd your point of view on the subject is. Take one home to try out and you'll be kicking yourself for being such an idiot.
I have considered them several times in the past for particular use cases and decided against their recorder/interface products because so many people had problems with their drivers.

Funny, I must have read a dozen or more reviews before I bought mine and don't recall reading anything about problems with their drivers. nine months in I have certainly never had any problem. On the contrary, it has exceeded all my expectations at doing what you buy an audio interface to do.
Certainly you are, you're arguing that midi ports aren't important but that's coming from your narrow perspective. I jam with friends, friends of friends, and strangers regularly and have more than once needed the midi port exactly SO I could use their gear.

So "more than once" is all the justification you need. I have so many workarounds for the lack of MIDI in an interface that it's just not funny. e.g. Both my KeyStep and MiniLab output MIDI and can act as MIDI through from my PC. And who would go somewhere for a jam without a keyboard of some type. MIDI is always going to be covered, even if I leave the U24 at home.
YMMV and all that

Your arrogance is breathtaking. It almost matches your ignorance.
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Acer Switch5 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, MicroMonsta
dellboy
KVRian
 
545 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Postby dellboy; Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:48 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

ghettosynth wrote:
I wouldn't buy or recommend a Zoom


The most succinct review ever.

Ghettosynth is so intelligent he reviews without ever even owning or using one.

Upcoming next: Ghettosynths exclusive "hands off" review of the latest Bugatti Veyron :hihi:
bbtr
KVRist
 
381 posts since 21 Nov, 2005

Postby bbtr; Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:52 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

I wouldn't buy or recommend that, whatever it is!

Err, what is it, actually?
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11022 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:38 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

dellboy wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:
I wouldn't buy or recommend a Zoom


The most succinct review ever.

Ghettosynth is so intelligent he reviews without ever even owning or using one.

Upcoming next: Ghettosynths exclusive "hands off" review of the latest Bugatti Veyron :hihi:


Who said I haven't ever "used" a zoom product. Moreover, what I wrote isn't a review, it's my recommendation. There are, however, many things that I've never used and still wouldn't recommend, Amway, for example.

We're talking about interfaces, where drivers are really important, in fact, I'd argue one of the most important aspects and something that is often challenging to sort out quickly. So, yes, like Amway, many people are going to base their recommendation off of reputation and the shared experiences of those that they trust.

If you think all of that reflects my intelligence, more power to you, FWIW, I think that your inability to perform the above simple analysis on your own reflects similarly.
dellboy
KVRian
 
545 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Postby dellboy; Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:36 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

ghettosynth wrote: like Amway, many people are going to base their recommendation off of reputation and the shared experiences of those that they trust.



The original posters requirement was in the budget sub £120 euro range which the Zoom U24 easily falls into. It also fills another of the OP's requirements - to quote the OP, "Now, I seek suggestions from KVR community who has experience of these ones".

Well, a number of us gave our experiences of the ones the OP mentioned, plus, I and Bones,suggested another one,the Zoom U24,of which a good review can be found here (U44,upgrade to U24) ..........

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/zoom-u-44

Your reply filled neither of those tasks,whereas "Bones" did very well,both coming in on budget, and personal experience.

And to top it all, when gently chided, you quote "Amway". What ?
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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6992 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:08 pm Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

ghettosynth wrote:Who said I haven't ever "used" a zoom product.

You may not have used those exact words but it's pretty much what you said.
Moreover, what I wrote isn't a review, it's my recommendation. There are, however, many things that I've never used and still wouldn't recommend, Amway, for example.

Really? I have no idea how good or bad Amway products are and I wouldn't even think to discount them on some vague principal.
We're talking about interfaces, where drivers are really important, in fact, I'd argue one of the most important aspects and something that is often challenging to sort out quickly. So, yes, like Amway, many people are going to base their recommendation off of reputation and the shared experiences of those that they trust.

Seriously? You install the driver, you attach the device and off you go. What's complicated about that? It's not 1998, things just work on PCs these days.
FWIW, I think that your inability to perform the above simple analysis on your own reflects similarly.

Thank you, I appreciate the compliment.
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Acer Switch5 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, MicroMonsta
BBFG#
KVRAF
 
5347 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:52 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

An update on the driver situation;

Seems Windows will not update using my hotspot connections, so I dragged both systems down to the spouse's office FiOS system and spent a good five hours getting them to update. Drivers appeared to finally install correctly and I'm taking the 'studio' computer up a little later to see if it communicates the way it's supposed to with the Montage.

IIUC, Montage may make the Steinberg redundant. But it depends whether there is a trade off to use it that way that will decide. Which is also why I originally decided to replace my VS100 as an interface and just use it as a back up session recorder.

This also adds more reasons to the driver controversy though. Because one update from anyone can break them and all it takes is for the product company to decided to no longer support it. (Which has happened to me sometimes with Korg and far too often with Roland.)

Also confirms my decision to eliminate any company that has adopted restrictive download managers (like NI Access).
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rod_zero
KVRAF
 
2832 posts since 28 Jan, 2011, from MEXICO

Postby rod_zero; Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:11 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

I got a zoom handheld recorder with USB interface integrated.

The drivers never worked on my windows 7 PC, had to sell it.
dedication to flying
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11022 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:14 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

BBFG# wrote:recorder.
This also adds more reasons to the driver controversy though. Because one update from anyone can break them and all it takes is for the product company to decided to no longer support it. (Which has happened to me sometimes with Korg and far too often with Roland.)


Yep, but, it's hard to know whether a company is going to be disciplined about this or not beyond their reputation. Personally I avoid M-Audio products for this reason but they may be fine for some people. Of the two products that I have from them that require drivers, they dropped support for one for some time and have dropped support for the other completely.
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11022 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:21 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

rod_zero wrote:I got a zoom handheld recorder with USB interface integrated.

The drivers never worked on my windows 7 PC, had to sell it.


And there we go. Likely you're talking about the same product that I rejected a few years back after doing some research and found that many other people experienced the same problems.

Look, if people want to trust vendors with past histories of issues, that's their call, but, the OP is saying that he doesn't want to make a "mistake." Consequently, IMNSHO, that calls for conservative recommendations for the most reliable and reputable vendors of interfaces.
sjm
KVRAF
 
1571 posts since 17 Apr, 2004

Postby sjm; Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:49 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

Your requirements may not be the same as the op's. Just a thought...
Voted KVR's resident drunk Robert Smith impersonator (thanks Frantz!)
Dee.P.Tree
KVRist
 
236 posts since 25 Aug, 2015

Postby Dee.P.Tree; Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:14 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

rod_zero wrote:I got a zoom handheld recorder with USB interface integrated.

The drivers never worked on my windows 7 PC, had to sell it.


Which one was that? If you remember and want to share...

something similar to current models: H4n Pro, H5, H6.. ?

Can a Handheld/portable Recorder with a usb port be considered as usb audio interface? Yes? No?

Or was it like UR 44 ... An Audio Interface with portable/handheld recording facility?

Thanks and Regards
Last edited by Dee.P.Tree on Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
 
22613 posts since 27 Jul, 2005, from the wilds of wanny

Postby thecontrolcentre; Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:16 am Re: Seeking help to avoid mistake in buying USB Audio Interface as a first timer

I've been using an NI Audio Kontrol 1 for the last 10 years or so. The drivers have been updated regularly, and its worked well on 3 different Windows OS' ...

If I had to replace it, I think I'd go for NI's Komplete Audio 6. Its slightly higher priced than the OPs budget, but well worth it imho (I paid the same price for its predecessor in 2008).

https://www.native-instruments.com/en/p ... e-audio-6/
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