Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Anything about hardware musical instruments.
lfm
KVRAF
4951 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Post Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:32 pm

I overly enjoyed the couple of weeks I had Neutron, it really brings something new to the table. And just incredible fun and lovely sounding too.

What is the best way to extend it?
Obvious things are using external audio input from audio sources, synths, organ and whatnot, that is one way for sure.

But if to be able to combine modules to another neutron or model d, is one way as well.

Thinking midi in to model d - and thru to neutron.
And audio out model d to external input as extra oscillator to neutron.

Or are analog module cables between the two as modules better?

Personally I do possible arpeggios and sequencer stuff in daw.

Did anybody do this yet, or?
Is it enough connections to use as separate modules from model d?

Thanks.

imrae
KVRian
565 posts since 2 Jul, 2010

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:40 am

Best way to extend a Neutron? Get a Happy Ending Kit and a Disting mk4. Try all the Disting programs with the neutron. Decide which mode you find the most useful and get a dedicated eurorack module that does it better. Repeat until rack is full.

AnX
KVRAF
3939 posts since 17 Nov, 2015

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:55 am

Behringer Crave

Shabdahbriah
KVRAF
4920 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:02 am

AnX wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:55 am
Behringer Crave
Although I wish it were Eurorack format, that's on my 'short-list' to use with the Nuetron, as well.
Perception is the ultimate "reality" ~ but not, the ultimate Truth.

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EvilDragon
KVRAF
17714 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:47 pm

You have CVs, use them. Why would you bother with MIDI between Neutron and Model D?

lfm
KVRAF
4951 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:27 am

EvilDragon wrote:
Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:47 pm
You have CVs, use them. Why would you bother with MIDI between Neutron and Model D?
Thanks everybody.

What you say is what I hope for, that I can just use modules, each one, as I please.

Tricky part is gate, I think. If midi to both gate is supplied.
I had to fiddle some to get VCA velocity driven as well in Neutron, realizing velocity value stays from last note - it did not go away when gate released.

But there is no release point in Model D envelopes - as I recall - so maybe not so dependent on gate?

Neutron has midi gate output that do 3.3V, but Model D says gate inputs need 5V?

Envelopes in Neutron trigger at +1.5V.

So not sure if this will work.

And a bit different if doing long winding sound effects, not so much for notes playing though.

Mutant
KVRAF
3381 posts since 9 Oct, 2004 from Poland

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:20 am

lfm wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:32 pm
Thinking midi in to model d - and thru to neutron.
That could create some problems because of MIDI latency.
Better do that via CV gate and V/pitch.
[====[\\\\\\\\]>------,

Ay caramba !

lfm
KVRAF
4951 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:03 am

Mutant wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:20 am
lfm wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:32 pm
Thinking midi in to model d - and thru to neutron.
That could create some problems because of MIDI latency.
Better do that via CV gate and V/pitch.
Thanks, yes that could be one thing.

I will make some tests rendering from daw what response times are for Neutron to start with. Very different for different midi gear, Nordlead about 128 samples, Yamaha about 300-400 something, Hammond 270 or so.

Then could test midi thru as well on Neutron to see how much is changing for the secondary unit.

Looking in manual for Model D I don't think there is enough patch points.

"Inputs (TS 3.5 mm)
Modulation source Noise is the modulation source if there is no
connection present
Oscillator 1 Control voltage: 1 V per octave
LFO Control voltage: -5 V to +5 V
External input Input impedance: 1 MΩ
Cutoff frequency Control voltage: 0 to +5 V controls the cutoff
frequency
Loudness Control voltage: 0 to +5 V controls the loudness
Filter contour Gate: +5 V input triggers the filter contour
Loudness contour Gate: +5 V input triggers the loudness contour

Outputs (TS 3.5 mm)
LFO triangular waveform +/-2 V
LFO square waveform +/-2 V
Mixer output max. 0 dBu
Filter contour 0 to +4 V
Loudness contour 0 to +4.6 V
Main audio output max. 0 dBu"

Crave seems to have better, looking at front panel, will have to await manual and release of the unit.

Maybe a second Neutron is the most interesting.

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Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
4940 posts since 7 Jan, 2005 from Corporate States of America

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:19 am

If you don’t mind the sometimes incompatible ranges (specifically with pitch tracking), there’s also the semi-modular Korg MS-20 mini. It has a different character, so, variety.

I’m considering getting:

• Behringer Neutron
• Behringer Model D
• Korg MS-20 mini
• Korg SQ-1 (for sequencing and modulation; supports both pitch tracking formats)
• Maybe the Behringer Crave

I’ve been assured repeatedly that interfacing these is safe.
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud

lfm
KVRAF
4951 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden

Re: Combine Neutron and Model D - best way - what do you think?

Post Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:43 am

Jace-BeOS wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:19 am

I’ve been assured repeatedly that interfacing these is safe.
That seems nice, thanks.

I looked quickly at Moog Mother-32 etc which looks very different in what panel has to offer. But quite a bunch of patch points.

But these voltages and stuff, could be in for a lot of calibrations if to run together on voltages alone.

But Neutron is such a clever little box, and using some extra modules with two of those together - feels more and more right.

Little sum() patch points and multi() and stuff like that with other things from two complete Neutrons. The ATT1 being voltage controlled as well. So much much good thinking from Behringer guys here.

Since I have to choose either mod wheel or velocity to Assign - and I can do both if having two units. And some extra envelopes as well to interfere.

Maybe time to get a couple of IKEA Billy bookshelves and build a rack right away. :D

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