Sharps And Flats

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fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:20 pm

Here's something I wrote using my own set limitations. I'm only using the black key sharps and flats. No transposing. This is for full orchestra with the addition of an extra harp for the last section. There are also eight trumpets sharing chores with up to four parts for breath sharing in that trumpet based section. There are just two horns in that trumpet based section so four of the six horn players are switching to trumpet.

I replaced the EWSO Timpani, cut back on the verb for many of the instruments that have some already baked in. I also lowered the Flute and Clarinet and upped the Bassoon a little on the woodwind section. 8/5/19

https://app.box.com/s/ky5x66wbjxhfj7fd1kemjlcv36qjc4mw
Last edited by fastlanephil on Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Benedict
KVRAF
2949 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:30 pm

Hi Mr Phil

I like the immediate sense of melodic drama and that overall it is built from melody. Sadly then you do succumb to the "ever-present pulse" thing which rather overshadows the melodic narrative.

I like your core ideas and where it wants to go so well done. I take it that this is a relatively new thing for you so the overall sense of flow with arrangement & mixing lets you down. these can be fixed either with time (more learning) or by engaging another who is stronger already in these areas.

:-)

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markkuja
KVRian
824 posts since 28 Oct, 2005 from Finland

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:57 am

Great job. Interesting music with different parts.
Dynamic composition and arrangement.
Pleasant melody lines and nice sounds.

fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:50 pm

Benedict wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:30 pm
Hi Mr Phil

I like the immediate sense of melodic drama and that overall it is built from melody. Sadly then you do succumb to the "ever-present pulse" thing which rather overshadows the melodic narrative.

I like your core ideas and where it wants to go so well done. I take it that this is a relatively new thing for you so the overall sense of flow with arrangement & mixing lets you down. these can be fixed either with time (more learning) or by engaging another who is stronger already in these areas.

:-)
Thanks for commenting.

I appreciate your critic and advice but the direction of this music was quite intentional and for some listeners possibly quite desirable.

You got me pegged backwards. Believe me! :)
Last edited by fastlanephil on Mon Jul 22, 2019 4:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:52 pm

markkuja wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:57 am
Great job. Interesting music with different parts.
Dynamic composition and arrangement.
Pleasant melody lines and nice sounds.
Thanks much markkuja!

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Forgotten
KVRAF
2077 posts since 15 Apr, 2019 from Nowhere

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 4:30 pm

I think to appreciate it fully I would like to hear it mixed better. It sounds like each instrument was recorded in a different hall with the mics at different distances.

The overall ambience is missing something too. Maybe revisit reverb choices?

I won't comment on it overall as I think it's hard to appreciate in its current mix.

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Frantz
KVRAF
5134 posts since 18 Jul, 2008 from New York

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:45 pm

An interesting piece. It runs the gamut from Rite of Spring Lite to something more gentle and oriental sounding.

I am not sure if it is the mix or the orchestration but it can sometimes be hard to make out what is happening in the busier sections.

Overall quite good! :tu:

Wholiveira
KVRist
35 posts since 16 Mar, 2015

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:00 pm

My favorite part was the woodwind section at the beginning. You really need to tell the flutes and clarinets to tone down, and the oboe player to play louder. I know it's hard work for them. I think part of my interest in live orchestral music is the desire to see an oboe player pop from internal air pressure. I hope I'm there to sample it.

Overall the piece has an interesting suggested parallelism. Like others have said, the mix is off. A conductor mixes live off a composer's suggestions over multiple rehearsals. The composition has a ringing, intimate tone, so it might benefit to think of yourself as a conductor now instead of the composer, telling players to back off or come forward. Also, the release tails on some of the instruments are too long.

Of course, if this is purely compositional experimentation and not realistic design, then ignore me.

fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:56 pm

Forgotten wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 4:30 pm
I think to appreciate it fully I would like to hear it mixed better. It sounds like each instrument was recorded in a different hall with the mics at different distances.

The overall ambience is missing something too. Maybe revisit reverb choices?

I won't comment on it overall as I think it's hard to appreciate in its current mix.
Sorry to get back to this so late.

The woodwind section, mostly the second part, I admit, is hard to make out.
I originally intended this to be a musical tomfoolery fun project, seeing what I could come up with using only the black key notes.

Maybe I’ll put some more work it. It actually inspired a composer of piano works to try some similar things at a more traditional music forum.

Thanks for commenting.

fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:58 pm

Frantz wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:45 pm
An interesting piece. It runs the gamut from Rite of Spring Lite to something more gentle and oriental sounding.

I am not sure if it is the mix or the orchestration but it can sometimes be hard to make out what is happening in the busier sections.

Overall quite good! :tu:
Thanks Franz!

I guess I’ll have use the hammer and anvil on this thing. :D

fastlanephil
KVRian
799 posts since 3 Jan, 2016

Re: Sharps And Flats

Post Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:15 pm

Wholiveira wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:00 pm
My favorite part was the woodwind section at the beginning. You really need to tell the flutes and clarinets to tone down, and the oboe player to play louder. I know it's hard work for them. I think part of my interest in live orchestral music is the desire to see an oboe player pop from internal air pressure. I hope I'm there to sample it.

Overall the piece has an interesting suggested parallelism. Like others have said, the mix is off. A conductor mixes live off a composer's suggestions over multiple rehearsals. The composition has a ringing, intimate tone, so it might benefit to think of yourself as a conductor now instead of the composer, telling players to back off or come forward. Also, the release tails on some of the instruments are too long.

Of course, if this is purely compositional experimentation and not realistic design, then ignore me.
Thanks for you ideas and other comments Wholiveira.

It was an experiment but I can try to shore it up some. Maybe some of the issues have to do with using only the black key notes combined with sampled instruments.

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