Icarus or Hive?
-
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5664 posts since 7 Feb, 2013
Well, most likely I don't actually need either of them - with Virus TI and softwares like Serum, Rapid and Dune3 I pretty much have everything wavtetable covered, but you know: new gui, new features and tricks, new presets (despite I don't use them much) - this all may be a source of inspriation.
I have had demos of both for long time, so some of my conclusions/notes
Icarus pros:
- Much more features, interesting osc warp modes, FM and Sync, the ability to gererate wavetables within the synth
Icarus cons
- Very restricted unison, it seems to have only few preset unison modes with no adjustable detune or stereo spread [EDIT: all good with the unison, I'm stupid]
- Don't like the FM, there is a very narrow range where it sounds any good and it quickly goes too noisy and dirty. Though I have very frist version, I think they added real cross-osc FM, did they?
Icarus sound:
- Well, this is the most improtant part (I rate synths by their sound, a synth can have all features in the world but if I don't like the sound for whatever reason it's useless for me), and in case of Icarus it's the most tricky one. Whenever I load Icarus and start browsing the presets I feel very impressed but after a while something in the sound starts bothering me, like it's too artifical. It's like cheeseburger or shawarma may be the best food in the world when I'm hungry but half an hour later I'm like "why the f*ck did I eat this ". Sort of the same feeling My own attempts to program it gave me mixed results, it seems to easily go into "too digital/thin/aritficial sounding" territory, though it may occasionally sound very cool.
Hive pros:
- The included wavetable content sounds very nice
- Controllable unison
Hive cons
- No FM, no sync, no vowel filters
- No wavetable warp/editing/creation. I know about uhm scripts but the idea of generating/editing wavetables outside of the synth without immediate previewing the results doesn't inspire me much.
Hive's sound
- Compared to Icarus it's more balanced and "warm", it actually reminds me on early digital VA classics like Virus or Sylenth rather than modern bold and shiny sound, which is a good thing for me. Maybe not as immediately impressive as Icarus, but probably putting it into an actual mix would be somehow easier.
Your thoughts?
I have had demos of both for long time, so some of my conclusions/notes
Icarus pros:
- Much more features, interesting osc warp modes, FM and Sync, the ability to gererate wavetables within the synth
Icarus cons
- Very restricted unison, it seems to have only few preset unison modes with no adjustable detune or stereo spread [EDIT: all good with the unison, I'm stupid]
- Don't like the FM, there is a very narrow range where it sounds any good and it quickly goes too noisy and dirty. Though I have very frist version, I think they added real cross-osc FM, did they?
Icarus sound:
- Well, this is the most improtant part (I rate synths by their sound, a synth can have all features in the world but if I don't like the sound for whatever reason it's useless for me), and in case of Icarus it's the most tricky one. Whenever I load Icarus and start browsing the presets I feel very impressed but after a while something in the sound starts bothering me, like it's too artifical. It's like cheeseburger or shawarma may be the best food in the world when I'm hungry but half an hour later I'm like "why the f*ck did I eat this ". Sort of the same feeling My own attempts to program it gave me mixed results, it seems to easily go into "too digital/thin/aritficial sounding" territory, though it may occasionally sound very cool.
Hive pros:
- The included wavetable content sounds very nice
- Controllable unison
Hive cons
- No FM, no sync, no vowel filters
- No wavetable warp/editing/creation. I know about uhm scripts but the idea of generating/editing wavetables outside of the synth without immediate previewing the results doesn't inspire me much.
Hive's sound
- Compared to Icarus it's more balanced and "warm", it actually reminds me on early digital VA classics like Virus or Sylenth rather than modern bold and shiny sound, which is a good thing for me. Maybe not as immediately impressive as Icarus, but probably putting it into an actual mix would be somehow easier.
Your thoughts?
Last edited by recursive one on Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
You may think you can fly ... but you better not try
- KVRAF
- 18561 posts since 16 Sep, 2001 from Las Vegas,USA
I too own Dune 3 and I find Hive 2 to be an indispensable tool and perfect complement to D3.
By the way you can use Dune 3 to create Wavetables for Hive 2.
By the way you can use Dune 3 to create Wavetables for Hive 2.
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
- KVRian
- 827 posts since 14 Sep, 2017
I can't respond all in the best way right now, but you're very wrong in a lot of aspects, to be honest I don't like most of Icarus presets and I don't even use any of them (You absolutely never shouldn't never judge a synth based on presets or demos), and I never judge a synth based in demos (very often I don't like most of the them). But the sound is very very good for me, I think that all of this fuss about "the sound" is very subjective and you shouldn't jump in over-generalizations about a product.
Is like the previous overhyped massive X, people talking about the sound in an exaggerated way only to say something good about a half baked product release and saying the other products sounds "thin", it was ridiculous.
Is like the previous overhyped massive X, people talking about the sound in an exaggerated way only to say something good about a half baked product release and saying the other products sounds "thin", it was ridiculous.
-
- KVRAF
- 11166 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales
100% agree.
Hive is much simpler, it may be all you need. Icarus (especially the upcoming V2) has far more complexity and depth...Its possible I2 will be the most advanced WT synths ever made, but that doesn't necessarily you mean you will need/use 5% of what it can do or like how it sounds!
I would defiantly try the Icarus '2' demo before deciding…it will be out very soon.
X32 Desk, i9 PC, S49MK2, Studio One, BWS, Live 12. PUSH 3 SA, Osmose, Summit, Pro 3, Prophet8, Syntakt, Digitone, Drumlogue, OP1-F, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Nord Drum3P, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!
-
- KVRAF
- 3959 posts since 10 Sep, 2010 from A shit hole (Ireland).
Different beasts really... Both are great and I like both of the Devs.
I think you've answered your own question though, really. If you don't like the sound of Icarus then Hive is the one.
But Icarus can do a lot of stuff and I find it very inspiring to use. It's really easy to tweak and get sounds really fast or just to experiment with. Some of the presets aren't great to be fair but as there is a big update coming that should also be considered into you buying decision.
To be fair, you can't go wrong with either!
I think you've answered your own question though, really. If you don't like the sound of Icarus then Hive is the one.
But Icarus can do a lot of stuff and I find it very inspiring to use. It's really easy to tweak and get sounds really fast or just to experiment with. Some of the presets aren't great to be fair but as there is a big update coming that should also be considered into you buying decision.
To be fair, you can't go wrong with either!
I will take the Lord's name in vain, whenever I want. Hail Satan! And his little goblins too.
-
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5664 posts since 7 Feb, 2013
I see, makes sense to me. Similar sonic aesthetics but different flavour, sort of.
Or Serum I guess... still going back and forth between different synths/tools isn't gping to be very convenient.
Thanks for your input
Makes sense. Could you briefly say what are the main things to be added? I think I read something about glitch sequencer (cool!) and some kind of drum machine (not sure what's the point of that in a synth but maybe cool too)
As I said I have both demos for a long time (I think I installed Icarus demo the very same day it was released) and I tried making my own sounds many times. For that matter Hive's demo is really generous, it allows me to save and load presets. I've made some cool stuff in it so I may eventually buy it just to use these sounds. In Icarus everything is lost after 30 minutes or whatever is the demo time.JunSev wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 11:36 am I can't respond all in the best way right now, but you're very wrong in a lot of aspects, to be honest I don't like most of Icarus presets and I don't even use any of them (You absolutely never shouldn't never judge a synth based on presets or demos), and I never judge a synth based in demos (very often I don't like most of the them).
You may think you can fly ... but you better not try
- KVRAF
- 5878 posts since 12 Jan, 2018
Might be a bit off-topic, but iZotope Iris 2 is quite awesome and the library is pretty big, too. May not be as advanced as the synths we are talking here, but it's easy to use and has great modulation options. Looks like it is not talked about much here.
There is an excellent 20-minute video series that is a must watch for anyone that has Iris 2.
https://www.izotope.com/en/learn/learn- ... nutes.html
There is an excellent 20-minute video series that is a must watch for anyone that has Iris 2.
https://www.izotope.com/en/learn/learn- ... nutes.html
-
- KVRAF
- 11166 posts since 2 Dec, 2004 from North Wales
Very hard to be brief- they added a lot, I hell of a lot! Check link bellow for overview....recursive one wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 11:58 amMakes sense. Could you briefly say what are the main things to be added? I think I read something about glitch sequencer (cool!) and some kind of drum machine (not sure what's the point of that in a synth but maybe cool too)
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=530373
X32 Desk, i9 PC, S49MK2, Studio One, BWS, Live 12. PUSH 3 SA, Osmose, Summit, Pro 3, Prophet8, Syntakt, Digitone, Drumlogue, OP1-F, Eurorack, TD27 Drums, Nord Drum3P, Guitars, Basses, Amps and of course lots of pedals!
-
- KVRist
- 436 posts since 20 Aug, 2010
Detune knob?Icarus cons:
- Very restricted unison, it seems to have only few preset unison modes with no adjustable detune or stereo spread
Modes:
Stereo
Mono Hypersaw 3,5,7,9, Supersaw
Stereo Hypersaw 4,6,8,10
Unison 2x 4x , 4x Stereo
-
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5664 posts since 7 Feb, 2013
Great, they indeed added a lot. The lack of S&H LFO was my another concern btw.SLiC wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:02 pm Very hard to be brief- they added a lot, I hell of a lot! Check link bellow for overview....
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=530373
Seems that the unison is not going to change though.
It's not that I dislike it actually. The other day I was just trying out the presets and randomly switching back and forth between Icarus and Virus TI and I some point it was like I'm playing the same synth all the time (I deeply love the Virus' sound).
It's indeed feels a bit weird, in 99% cases I can almosy immeditely decide if I like the sound or not. But for some reason it's not the case with Icarus which puzzles me quite a bit.
I guess I should indeed wait for v.2 demo.
You may think you can fly ... but you better not try
-
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 5664 posts since 7 Feb, 2013
I thought it detuned one osc against another, not sure why. I'm an idiot
You may think you can fly ... but you better not try
-
- Banned
- 3889 posts since 3 Feb, 2010
He is wrong that his opinion doesnt meet yours? well you are right his opinion doesnt sound the same as yours, but your opinion is just an opinion, so it shouldnt matter for others to have their opinions to meet yoursJunSev wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 11:36 am I can't respond all in the best way right now, but you're very wrong in a lot of aspects, to be honest I don't like most of Icarus presets and I don't even use any of them (You absolutely never shouldn't never judge a synth based on presets or demos), and I never judge a synth based in demos (very often I don't like most of the them). But the sound is very very good for me, I think that all of this fuss about "the sound" is very subjective and you shouldn't jump in over-generalizations about a product.
Is like the previous overhyped massive X, people talking about the sound in an exaggerated way only to say something good about a half baked product release and saying the other products sounds "thin", it was ridiculous.
- KVRAF
- 3338 posts since 6 Aug, 2009
opinions opinions. i like hive (but rarely use it), use icarus a lot, and am really getting into using MX. unless 2 plugins are doing the exact same things (and even then...) they don't have to compete. you can own all of them, some of them... none of them. whatever works for each of us, that's the right plugin for us to use.
-
- KVRian
- 521 posts since 19 Jun, 2016
like someone said you can't go wrong with each/either imo and can have both.....
just finished a preset in Icarus to show you some of the things you talked about....
it's using access virus wavetables, has unison and FM
https://soundcloud.com/tatsyn/icarus-2- ... wavetables
diferent sounds, diferent specs yet one can do a lot of what the other can while each doing things the other can't.....
what i can say about icarus is that it was the 1st synth that made me want to sound design for hours...
and it's sound ("qualities") speak to me too
*hive also does but i had to pick one at the time and hive didn't have wavetables back then....
just finished a preset in Icarus to show you some of the things you talked about....
it's using access virus wavetables, has unison and FM
https://soundcloud.com/tatsyn/icarus-2- ... wavetables
diferent sounds, diferent specs yet one can do a lot of what the other can while each doing things the other can't.....
what i can say about icarus is that it was the 1st synth that made me want to sound design for hours...
and it's sound ("qualities") speak to me too
*hive also does but i had to pick one at the time and hive didn't have wavetables back then....
-
- KVRian
- 521 posts since 19 Jun, 2016
yes, detune knob is for voice pan, fine knob does the dettuning
*one thing about Icarus is somethings have diferent functions according to modes/filters/etc selected
Last edited by tasty tatsyn on Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.