New ExpressiveE instrument: Osmose

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Echoes in the Attic wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:06 pm
Oh I didn't even think about the fact that Y axis expression isn't there. For some reason I thought it would be, like Touch Keys.
Ahh! I thought the same! :) For some reason, I thought it has SLIDE (Y axis). We have been mesmerised by the sheer beauty of the thing! :D
http://www.electric-himalaya.com
VSTi and hardware synth sound design
3D/5D sound design since 2012

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I think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!

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In another video the Pitch Bend also reaches just around a """semitone""", which is present (as a feature) in any touch surface linear grid (Roli, Sensel, Continuum, smartphone screen, grid of any sort). Maybe they can extend the range via software... but again the control melodically would be interesting to see if it will be available.
:pray:

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EvilDragon wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:18 pm I think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!
Yeah... that shake is cool... a fair trade for the Y axis.

The Osmose has lots of possibilities different from my Linnstrument. Likewise the Linnstrument can do stuff Osmose cannot. I love the poly pitch slides on the Linnstrument. They will make a good compliment to each other.

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That's exactly what I have been thinking. Osmose perfectly compliments other, less 'traditional' (ie: keyboard-less) MPE instruments. I can see it working beautifully alongs side the Linnstrument, or the Soundplane, the RISE, or Continuum. For a total smorgasbord of MPE extravaganza! :D
http://www.electric-himalaya.com
VSTi and hardware synth sound design
3D/5D sound design since 2012

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Ok, further more observational thoughts.
Seems like the underlying layout follows standard piano keyboard. In the following video the Pitch Bends shown on the respective "white" keys reach the next adjacent "white" in a "second" interval all the way through. (starts at 1:24 min.)
I am wondering if it can trigger/control a "min. second = semitone" interval at that place?
Same to the previous video example where "black" key (they are always next to "white") thus only reached a "semitone" Pitch bend interval. When it comes out will go and try one, but something tells me not to get hyped that much.

https://youtu.be/hJtBCyY0Isc?t=84
Last edited by Pashkuli on Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Quite relieved. Thought my Seaboard was going to start feeling like old news :phew:

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Pashkuli wrote: Fri Nov 15, 2019 6:28 pmPitch Bend is a different story.
It has to be actually achieved by sliding the finger, like on Roli and that is not Pitch Bend.
How is that not Pitch Bend? It's a very similar action to using a Pitch Bend Wheel which makes it perfectly natural for a synth player.
Pashkuli wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:52 pmWith slides you do not alter the note's frequency. You slide / glide / pass trough other notes as they appear on the instrument.
Again, what are you talking about? Of course you alter the note's frequency and of course it's Pitch Bend. You can do it on a Seaboard either by sliding left-right or you can program it to do pitch bend up/down the keys. It doesn't step form one note to the next, the frequency ramps up/down smoothly.
himalaya wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 8:51 pmOsmose looks absolutely beautiful. Congratulations to the designers!
No it doesn't. Those keys look like they have been whittled by hand and painted with a brush. Hopefully it's just a prototype because it looks very rough.
Looks like it's very expressive as well.
Less so than a Roli Seaboard.
Urs wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:37 pmI can not wait to get my hands on this again. Some of u-he had the chance to test this during Superbooth and it felt like a revelation. I kid you not, it was really good.
Urs, what makes it better than a Roli? It seems to be more limited from what I've seen and even though it looks like a more conventional keyboard, you certainly couldn't play it like a piano so I can't see anyone swapping their Seaboard for one of these.
Echoes in the Attic wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:05 pmI think the Seaboard could actually do something similar by just having the initial range separate from the deeper range.
Roli already does this with STRIKE and PRESS (velocity and aftertouch). That's all that's going on here as far as I can see. If you look at how he is playing at 3:30 in the Engadget video, you can see he is not pressing the keys down at all (PRESS) but he is hitting them solidly (STRIKE). And, for me, that's what makes it less than stellar - it may look familiar but you will have to develop a very similar technique to that required to master the Seaboard to take full advantage of it.
EvilDragon wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:18 pmI think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!
What "shake gesture"? If you mean wiggling your finger to get vibrato, they all do that.
himalaya wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:51 pmI can see it working beautifully alongs side the Linnstrument, or the Soundplane, the RISE, or Continuum. For a total smorgasbord of MPE extravaganza! :D
I'd be far more likely to buy a second Seaboard than one of these. In fact, for the price I could buy three more Seaboards.
Pashkuli wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:23 amOk, further more observational thoughts.
Seems like the underlying layout follows standard piano keyboard. In the following video the Pitch Bends shown on the respective "white" keys reach the next adjacent "white" in a "second" interval all the way through.
I am wondering if it can trigger/control a "min. second = semitone" interval at that place?
Same to the previous video example where "black" key (they are always next to "white") thus only reached a "semitone" Pitch bend interval. When it comes out will go and try one, but something tells me not to get hyped that much.
That's not how pitch bend works. Keys don't know what other keys are around them, they just send MIDI note numbers to trigger a certain pitch. Pitch bend sends different information that also affects pitch but is independent of the note number.
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Hey Bones, I think you're mistaken about the strike and press being the same as this initial pressure and aftertouch. The initial pressure is a continuous control not a instantaneous velocity. However you are correct about Pashkuli making no sense, but please don't try to argue with him. This is a continuation from a thread here where several of us tried to reason with him to to avail: viewtopic.php?f=102&t=445951&start=1035
It was full blown absurdity. I asked him to not bring that crap here and he did not listen to me. Please don't help him ruin another thread.

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I think that the very fine modulation of velocity and pressure is all due to the EaganMatrix sound engine. This has a very intricate system for balancing initial touch, the note-on, and continuous pressure. I don't know how many people have seen or used this engine, since it is only available for the Haken Continuum (thus far) but it is extremely deep in this regard. It's the 'Formula' system in EaganMatrix that makes it all possible. Very complex. So, coupled with a very expressive playing surface that has velocity and continuous pressure sensing, it can give those results as seen in the video.
http://www.electric-himalaya.com
VSTi and hardware synth sound design
3D/5D sound design since 2012

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Yeah, just like a Seaboard, which is why I am wondering why so many people are gushing over this thing.
Echoes in the Attic wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:09 amThe initial pressure is a continuous control not a instantaneous velocity.
The word "initial" would tend to suggest it is an instantaneous value, not a continuous stream. Of course, velocity is a single value but it is still sent via a MIDI continuous controller value (cc).
NOVAkILL : Asus RoG Flow Z13, Core i9, 16GB RAM, Win11 | EVO 16 | Studio One | bx_oberhausen, GR-8, JP6K, Union, Hexeract, Olga, TRK-01, SEM, BA-1, Thorn, Prestige, Spire, Legend-HZ, ANA-2, VG Iron 2 | Uno Pro, Rocket.

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I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?

One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.

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pdxindy wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 am I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?

One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
It appears like it doesn't need a computer. I see that it has Audio out jacks, looks like stereo. In one of the videos they note that it can work as a standalone synthesizer. So it can be used either as standalone or a controller. Or it would be awesome if you could use the synth engine simultaneously as controller mode so you can stack the synth engine with other external patches.

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Why wouldn't you be able to do that? They'd actually need to put something in there to stop it happening by default, I'd imagine.
pdxindy wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 amOne of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
I find that a bit weird. My computer is the foundation, heart and soul of my set-up. I would never not want to use it. It is certainly the first thing I grab if I want to do some music on the go or on holidays or something. The other things are just peripherals, all the exciting stuff happens in my PC.
NOVAkILL : Asus RoG Flow Z13, Core i9, 16GB RAM, Win11 | EVO 16 | Studio One | bx_oberhausen, GR-8, JP6K, Union, Hexeract, Olga, TRK-01, SEM, BA-1, Thorn, Prestige, Spire, Legend-HZ, ANA-2, VG Iron 2 | Uno Pro, Rocket.

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pdxindy wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 am I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?

One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
I think, it will be like the continuum: the Eagan matrix can works without computer,
midi cc assign to barrels, macros and the EM editor need a computer for sound design or edit the matrix. Without computer, the sound engine works like an hardware synth.
Same for the midi channels configuration, portamento.....into the Eaganmatrix.
The question: could we access to functions shortcuts via the keyboard without a computer, like the continuum ?
We can already see into the videos some knob on the left side of the keyboard: presets change...

About velocity, the mpe+ use a fixed velocity, all is done via the pressure.

About wiggle: I think it's for vibrato:) or more ?
( my altair 231, minimoog Russian version have a functional wiggle, it's a really great feeling when you play it :))
Best
YY

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