Ahh! I thought the same! For some reason, I thought it has SLIDE (Y axis). We have been mesmerised by the sheer beauty of the thing!Echoes in the Attic wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:06 pm
Oh I didn't even think about the fact that Y axis expression isn't there. For some reason I thought it would be, like Touch Keys.
New ExpressiveE instrument: Osmose
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- KVRAF
- 5619 posts since 23 Mar, 2006 from pendeLondonmonium
- KVRAF
- 23069 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia
I think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!
- Banned
- 559 posts since 9 Sep, 2019
In another video the Pitch Bend also reaches just around a """semitone""", which is present (as a feature) in any touch surface linear grid (Roli, Sensel, Continuum, smartphone screen, grid of any sort). Maybe they can extend the range via software... but again the control melodically would be interesting to see if it will be available.
- KVRAF
- 25252 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
Yeah... that shake is cool... a fair trade for the Y axis.EvilDragon wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:18 pm I think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!
The Osmose has lots of possibilities different from my Linnstrument. Likewise the Linnstrument can do stuff Osmose cannot. I love the poly pitch slides on the Linnstrument. They will make a good compliment to each other.
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- KVRAF
- 5619 posts since 23 Mar, 2006 from pendeLondonmonium
That's exactly what I have been thinking. Osmose perfectly compliments other, less 'traditional' (ie: keyboard-less) MPE instruments. I can see it working beautifully alongs side the Linnstrument, or the Soundplane, the RISE, or Continuum. For a total smorgasbord of MPE extravaganza!
- Banned
- 559 posts since 9 Sep, 2019
Ok, further more observational thoughts.
Seems like the underlying layout follows standard piano keyboard. In the following video the Pitch Bends shown on the respective "white" keys reach the next adjacent "white" in a "second" interval all the way through. (starts at 1:24 min.)
I am wondering if it can trigger/control a "min. second = semitone" interval at that place?
Same to the previous video example where "black" key (they are always next to "white") thus only reached a "semitone" Pitch bend interval. When it comes out will go and try one, but something tells me not to get hyped that much.
https://youtu.be/hJtBCyY0Isc?t=84
Seems like the underlying layout follows standard piano keyboard. In the following video the Pitch Bends shown on the respective "white" keys reach the next adjacent "white" in a "second" interval all the way through. (starts at 1:24 min.)
I am wondering if it can trigger/control a "min. second = semitone" interval at that place?
Same to the previous video example where "black" key (they are always next to "white") thus only reached a "semitone" Pitch bend interval. When it comes out will go and try one, but something tells me not to get hyped that much.
https://youtu.be/hJtBCyY0Isc?t=84
Last edited by Pashkuli on Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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el-bo (formerly ebow) el-bo (formerly ebow) https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=208007
- KVRAF
- 16368 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away
Quite relieved. Thought my Seaboard was going to start feeling like old news
- GRRRRRRR!
- 15825 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle
How is that not Pitch Bend? It's a very similar action to using a Pitch Bend Wheel which makes it perfectly natural for a synth player.
Again, what are you talking about? Of course you alter the note's frequency and of course it's Pitch Bend. You can do it on a Seaboard either by sliding left-right or you can program it to do pitch bend up/down the keys. It doesn't step form one note to the next, the frequency ramps up/down smoothly.
No it doesn't. Those keys look like they have been whittled by hand and painted with a brush. Hopefully it's just a prototype because it looks very rough.
Less so than a Roli Seaboard.Looks like it's very expressive as well.
Urs, what makes it better than a Roli? It seems to be more limited from what I've seen and even though it looks like a more conventional keyboard, you certainly couldn't play it like a piano so I can't see anyone swapping their Seaboard for one of these.
Roli already does this with STRIKE and PRESS (velocity and aftertouch). That's all that's going on here as far as I can see. If you look at how he is playing at 3:30 in the Engadget video, you can see he is not pressing the keys down at all (PRESS) but he is hitting them solidly (STRIKE). And, for me, that's what makes it less than stellar - it may look familiar but you will have to develop a very similar technique to that required to master the Seaboard to take full advantage of it.Echoes in the Attic wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:05 pmI think the Seaboard could actually do something similar by just having the initial range separate from the deeper range.
What "shake gesture"? If you mean wiggling your finger to get vibrato, they all do that.EvilDragon wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:18 pmI think the shake gesture more than makes up for it. No other MPE controller does THAT. It blew my mind!
I'd be far more likely to buy a second Seaboard than one of these. In fact, for the price I could buy three more Seaboards.
That's not how pitch bend works. Keys don't know what other keys are around them, they just send MIDI note numbers to trigger a certain pitch. Pitch bend sends different information that also affects pitch but is independent of the note number.Pashkuli wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:23 amOk, further more observational thoughts.
Seems like the underlying layout follows standard piano keyboard. In the following video the Pitch Bends shown on the respective "white" keys reach the next adjacent "white" in a "second" interval all the way through.
I am wondering if it can trigger/control a "min. second = semitone" interval at that place?
Same to the previous video example where "black" key (they are always next to "white") thus only reached a "semitone" Pitch bend interval. When it comes out will go and try one, but something tells me not to get hyped that much.
NOVAkILL : Asus RoG Flow Z13, Core i9, 16GB RAM, Win11 | EVO 16 | Studio One | bx_oberhausen, GR-8, JP6K, Union, Hexeract, Olga, TRK-01, SEM, BA-1, Thorn, Prestige, Spire, Legend-HZ, ANA-2, VG Iron 2 | Uno Pro, Rocket.
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Echoes in the Attic Echoes in the Attic https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=180417
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 11016 posts since 12 May, 2008
Hey Bones, I think you're mistaken about the strike and press being the same as this initial pressure and aftertouch. The initial pressure is a continuous control not a instantaneous velocity. However you are correct about Pashkuli making no sense, but please don't try to argue with him. This is a continuation from a thread here where several of us tried to reason with him to to avail: viewtopic.php?f=102&t=445951&start=1035
It was full blown absurdity. I asked him to not bring that crap here and he did not listen to me. Please don't help him ruin another thread.
It was full blown absurdity. I asked him to not bring that crap here and he did not listen to me. Please don't help him ruin another thread.
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- KVRAF
- 5619 posts since 23 Mar, 2006 from pendeLondonmonium
I think that the very fine modulation of velocity and pressure is all due to the EaganMatrix sound engine. This has a very intricate system for balancing initial touch, the note-on, and continuous pressure. I don't know how many people have seen or used this engine, since it is only available for the Haken Continuum (thus far) but it is extremely deep in this regard. It's the 'Formula' system in EaganMatrix that makes it all possible. Very complex. So, coupled with a very expressive playing surface that has velocity and continuous pressure sensing, it can give those results as seen in the video.
- GRRRRRRR!
- 15825 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle
Yeah, just like a Seaboard, which is why I am wondering why so many people are gushing over this thing.
The word "initial" would tend to suggest it is an instantaneous value, not a continuous stream. Of course, velocity is a single value but it is still sent via a MIDI continuous controller value (cc).Echoes in the Attic wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:09 amThe initial pressure is a continuous control not a instantaneous velocity.
NOVAkILL : Asus RoG Flow Z13, Core i9, 16GB RAM, Win11 | EVO 16 | Studio One | bx_oberhausen, GR-8, JP6K, Union, Hexeract, Olga, TRK-01, SEM, BA-1, Thorn, Prestige, Spire, Legend-HZ, ANA-2, VG Iron 2 | Uno Pro, Rocket.
- KVRAF
- 25252 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?
One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
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- KVRer
- 27 posts since 7 Oct, 2019
It appears like it doesn't need a computer. I see that it has Audio out jacks, looks like stereo. In one of the videos they note that it can work as a standalone synthesizer. So it can be used either as standalone or a controller. Or it would be awesome if you could use the synth engine simultaneously as controller mode so you can stack the synth engine with other external patches.pdxindy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 am I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?
One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
- GRRRRRRR!
- 15825 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle
Why wouldn't you be able to do that? They'd actually need to put something in there to stop it happening by default, I'd imagine.
I find that a bit weird. My computer is the foundation, heart and soul of my set-up. I would never not want to use it. It is certainly the first thing I grab if I want to do some music on the go or on holidays or something. The other things are just peripherals, all the exciting stuff happens in my PC.pdxindy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 amOne of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
NOVAkILL : Asus RoG Flow Z13, Core i9, 16GB RAM, Win11 | EVO 16 | Studio One | bx_oberhausen, GR-8, JP6K, Union, Hexeract, Olga, TRK-01, SEM, BA-1, Thorn, Prestige, Spire, Legend-HZ, ANA-2, VG Iron 2 | Uno Pro, Rocket.
- KVRian
- 821 posts since 11 Aug, 2018 from UE
I think, it will be like the continuum: the Eagan matrix can works without computer,pdxindy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:40 am I’m curious about configuration... does it need a computer?
One of the brilliant things about the Linnstrument is that you can plug it straight into a synth and all configuration can be done easily right on the Linnstrument surface. Want to set it to single channel? Limit the number of midi channels? All immediate and easy tasks with no computer needed and it doesn’t even have a screen or any knobs.
midi cc assign to barrels, macros and the EM editor need a computer for sound design or edit the matrix. Without computer, the sound engine works like an hardware synth.
Same for the midi channels configuration, portamento.....into the Eaganmatrix.
The question: could we access to functions shortcuts via the keyboard without a computer, like the continuum ?
We can already see into the videos some knob on the left side of the keyboard: presets change...
About velocity, the mpe+ use a fixed velocity, all is done via the pressure.
About wiggle: I think it's for vibrato:) or more ?
( my altair 231, minimoog Russian version have a functional wiggle, it's a really great feeling when you play it )
Best
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