Nothing Here - Delete it.

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?
User avatar
Benedict
KVRAF
3222 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Post Sat Jan 11, 2020 3:24 pm

gone
Last edited by Benedict on Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Benedict Roff-Marsh has left find me at
http://www.benedictroffmarsh.com

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
59231 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:34 am

based on the pics you "killed the imagination" more than anything.
skills can be learned over time (theres no rush) creativity and imagination once lost are gone forever.
this is why we have accountants :(

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
59231 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:36 am

however, 2 pics is not enough evidence to suggest anything. at all.

User avatar
McLilith
KVRAF
2056 posts since 7 Jul, 2003 from Huntington, WV

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Sun Jan 19, 2020 1:14 pm

Based on the pics, I think you should apply your "3-day technique" to learning how to scan artwork. :hihi:
I'm involved with photography & audio. For more info, take a look at my site:
GlenVision.com

User avatar
Benedict
KVRAF
3222 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:30 pm

McLilith wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 1:14 pm
Based on the pics, I think you should apply your "3-day technique" to learning how to scan artwork. :hihi:
I'm sure that as one artist to another I could find many condescending things to say about your work. But I think we are better when we don't behave that way. Clearly that is just me in this situation.

From the responses (and similar one-eyed stupidity) here and elsewhere, it would appear that I wasted my time in doing this. My daughter was delighted that I showed her that she could do more/better than she assumed. Maybe that should be enough for my life.

No reason anyone should care I guess.
No reason I can see why most people should give such negative feedback.

My fault for assuming people would be better than they are. No more cheeks to turn right now.

:roll:
Benedict Roff-Marsh has left find me at
http://www.benedictroffmarsh.com

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
59231 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:55 pm

define "better".

if youre not open to discuss this, why post it?
its lovely you and your daughter had fun and she feels good but thats personal to you. you presented it as an article, people will want to talk about the details, without personal attachment.

User avatar
Benedict
KVRAF
3222 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:10 pm

Discussion is one thing but oddly basically every response (except one on Reason Talk) has been dismissive and generally off-base from what happened and was written. One went so far as to suggest I was bullying my child. None of that is a discussion, it is nothing but people taking the opportunity to dump on someone who did something.

Better means seeing how we can build ourselves & each other. None of this is about that. If just smacks of petty jealousy.

If someone wants to have a genuine discussion with constructive arguments fine. If not then honestly y'all are welcome to your tiny puddle of stirred-up mud.

:-(
Benedict Roff-Marsh has left find me at
http://www.benedictroffmarsh.com

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
59231 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:35 am

Benedict wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:10 pm

Better means seeing how we can build ourselves & each other. None of this is about that. If just smacks of petty jealousy.
so now, how is picture 2 better than picture 1?
if we can establish this, maybe we can then make sense of the rest.

as it stands, i personally prefer the more vibrant colourful piece, it shows a sense of wonder with the world that the second picture doesnt.
therefore to me, that is the better picture.

art, is not about realism, its about interpretation, and yes, those skills can teach us how to interpret our thoughts to the page.
but artists should be nurtured, allowed to find their own way. forced expectations kill the artist and produce producers.

the end result is not the goal.

User avatar
whyterabbyt
Beware the Quoth
27865 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:23 am

Benedict wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:30 pm
My fault for assuming people would be better than they are. No more cheeks to turn right now.
If someone wants to have a genuine discussion with constructive arguments fine. If not then honestly y'all are welcome to your tiny puddle of stirred-up mud.
And here, the artist moving to behave like a 7-year-old in 3 posts... ironic.
"The bearer of this signature is a genuine and authorised pope."

deastman
KVRAF
7346 posts since 7 Aug, 2003 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 7:22 am

That article pains me to read. I don’t see an aspiring young artist, desperate to improve her craft. I see a creative eight year old being told by her father that what she drew isn’t good enough and having all the specific flaws pointed out. Her work is only worthy if it conforms to adult expectations. Personally, I much prefer the vibrant color and imagination present in the original drawing.

My daughter has loved to draw all her life. When she was eight, we would sit and draw together, side by side. She took an interest in my techniques and wondered why my images looked so much more realistic. She asked the questions, and so I demonstrated shading, the depiction of light and shadow, and drawing the shapes that you see rather than the abstract representation in your mind. She understood, but decided she preferred to continue on with what she was doing, which tended towards a more cartoony style. I didn’t push it, and let her find her own path. Over the years, her passion for art has only continued to grow, and it has become an essential outlet for expression for her. At this point, her technical abilities far outpace my own. The important part is that I knew enough to let her progress at her own pace, finding the drive within to make art, rather than turning it into forced instruction and critique from an early age.

Similarly, I took piano lessons for ten years, starting at age six. I hated every minute of it, being forced into rote memorization and repetitive practice of songs I cared nothing about. I also spent four years playing clarinet in the school band because it was expected of me, and hated that just as much. It wasn’t until I finally stopped all formal music lessons that I discovered my passion for music and began composing my own songs- songs which actually meant something to me and weren’t being forced upon me by adults.
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/8" audio input jack.

mjudge55
KVRist
178 posts since 8 Sep, 2005 from Seattle

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:46 am

I thought the article was good and I didn’t walk away with the impression you were crushing your daughter’s soul. Whether drawing 1 or 2 is better is a matter of taste and there’s no accounting for that. For me it’s like this: a child’s random plonking on a piano is certainly more organic and creative than a child playing a scale, but the playing of the scale indicates something of broader significance than the sound itself.

User avatar
vurt
addled muppet weed
59231 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:12 am


User avatar
foosnark
KVRAF
5069 posts since 9 Jan, 2003 from Saint Louis MO

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:38 pm

I also personally preferred the first image, the colorful one. But I don't think a lot can be said by comparing only two pieces of art, especially when they are so very different. It's not really showing improvement, growth, or any sort of trend. On the other hand, I also wouldn't extrapolate that she's had her creativity squashed or anything like that.

The main thing I wonder is in what way it's relevant. You explained a few well-known techniques used in representational visual art (which don't even apply in the same way to abstract visual art) to a child who hadn't really thought about it before. In what way does this translate to doing the same for an experienced musician, or kung-fu practitioner or whatever? You don't really make the case for that at all.

fairlyclose
KVRist
271 posts since 4 Jul, 2019

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:01 pm

unhelpful
Last edited by fairlyclose on Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Benedict
KVRAF
3222 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: Moving an Artist 7 Years in 3 Days – this is What I Do & How I Do it

Post Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:21 pm

mjudge55 wrote:
Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:46 am
I thought the article was good and I didn’t walk away with the impression you were crushing your daughter’s soul. Whether drawing 1 or 2 is better is a matter of taste and there’s no accounting for that. For me it’s like this: a child’s random plonking on a piano is certainly more organic and creative than a child playing a scale, but the playing of the scale indicates something of broader significance than the sound itself.
Thanks. This shows that you have read & understood what I was saying. The second image may not be as wildly creative (random piano plonking) but it was designed to let her realize that there is greater potential for more controlled & detailed works (scales). She is still delighted with that difference.

Her desire to be a pro artist means that she needs to develop skills and pretty darned fast or she'll not compete with people who have "done the work". In 5 years she will have to be showing amazing work or she'll not get accepted to the "excellence" high school where her sister got in based on where we lived at that time. Then there will be university & employment. As a musician, son of a musician, with a brother who left school to be a ballerina, I know this is not easy and she'll need to balance wild creativity with the skilly to deliver the works she wants and the boss needs. Fact.

For those who simply want to do the Beavis & Butthead thing, can you perhaps go do that elsewhere. KVR is an infinite world so you have many places in which you can shit on each other to your heart's content. Here is just personally insulting and you'll note that I don't come shit on your work for a heh heh so don't do it to me.

:-)
Benedict Roff-Marsh has left find me at
http://www.benedictroffmarsh.com

Return to “Production Techniques”