was true then and now.Why were some of my songs a different key/mode than i intended
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- addled muppet weed
- 111242 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
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- KVRAF
- 11000 posts since 15 Apr, 2019 from Nowhere
vurt wrote: Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:38 pmso what software do you recommend?Forgotten wrote: Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:23 pmAgreed. Time and time again we see people make incorrect statements about keys and chord names, only to find out that they used software to determine the answer.jancivil wrote: Mon Apr 13, 2020 2:30 pm Key detection software produces mistakes, it has no ear nor anything to guide it in terms of context. It’s a crutch and a very unreliable one.
One does not use a crutch in learning to walk in the first place.
It’s definitely unreliable beyond working on very basic material, so I would definitely recommend learning how to make these determinations yourself.
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- addled muppet weed
- 111242 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
got a link?
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- addled muppet weed
- 111242 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
thanks. youve been most helpful.
i shall remove you from "the list"
i shall remove you from "the list"
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- KVRian
- 880 posts since 26 Oct, 2011
Short answer: because you tonicized the whole time something else. This happens very easily when you use anything that isn't based on the Ionian mode (major). There are also modes that are nigh impossible to use in a harmonic framework; for instance, tonicization in Locrian is very, very unlikely to pan out the way you want. For various reasons related to tonicization and our culturally conditioned ears that have heard minor/major music for most of our lives, the tonality collapses very easily into the minor/major framework. Likewise, especially when writing in purely aeolian ("natural minor"), you're easily tonicizing the relative major rather than the minor.
Another easy way to accidentally tonicize "the wrong thing" in a loopy progression is by liberal use of borrowed chord. bII (in minor) alongside with the subdominant, for instance: i - bII - iv is going to definitively be a progression based on the iv; v-VI-i rather.
Also, since there was a mention of key detection software: stop using them. They can't do what you want them to do and they're more likely tell you what key your song definitively is not in rather than what it is in. If you want to find out what key whatever it is that you're doing, you should learn how to identify keys.
Another easy way to accidentally tonicize "the wrong thing" in a loopy progression is by liberal use of borrowed chord. bII (in minor) alongside with the subdominant, for instance: i - bII - iv is going to definitively be a progression based on the iv; v-VI-i rather.
Also, since there was a mention of key detection software: stop using them. They can't do what you want them to do and they're more likely tell you what key your song definitively is not in rather than what it is in. If you want to find out what key whatever it is that you're doing, you should learn how to identify keys.
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- KVRAF
- 11000 posts since 15 Apr, 2019 from Nowhere
I think we're all agreed that key detection software is a bad idea - it simply isn't capable of determining the context of music correctly, so can give a lot of false and confusing results.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 2990 posts since 31 Jan, 2020
Thanks everybody for your contributions.
My ear or my intuition tells me that this song correctly is Dm all the way through, no key changes, no diversions into relative modes, etc. Am i right?
https://soundcloud.com/user-492255322/s ... pCd88FvQjx
My ear or my intuition tells me that this song correctly is Dm all the way through, no key changes, no diversions into relative modes, etc. Am i right?
https://soundcloud.com/user-492255322/s ... pCd88FvQjx
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 2990 posts since 31 Jan, 2020
That's great, thanks!
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 2990 posts since 31 Jan, 2020
but on this
https://soundcloud.com/user-492255322/s ... jKOPzGXh7d
at about 0.55 i change key. Am i right?
https://soundcloud.com/user-492255322/s ... jKOPzGXh7d
at about 0.55 i change key. Am i right?
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- Banned
- 1792 posts since 8 Sep, 2019 from Calenberg
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 2990 posts since 31 Jan, 2020
Thankyou very much!jancivil wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 4:50 pm not really. there is a moment there where you can’t retain the same focus on D like a tonic, but I didn’t detect anything foreign.
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- KVRAF
- 26033 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
The first track is B, A, D, E. The software made a guess, I can’t know what led it to Em, but there isn’t enough information for any key.Spring Goose wrote: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:11 pm Can anybody help me?
I was making a song in the scale/key A major. I understand that the song I make could be a F#m or one of the relative modes.
I've got 3 parts, which Mixed In Key (key detection) tells me are Em,...
[...]
I think the answer has something to do with "tonic"etc. Am I right?
So even granted its mistakes tend to be down to exactly what I said initially (it doesn’t know, it lacks an ear at all), it’s incompetent if it gave you a guess that relies on information that just isn’t there.
So, before you could walk on your own, you picked up a crutch that isn’t going to support you.
The ‘tonic’ is B. The term ‘key’ doesn’t apply; you have but 4 notes.
I could fill in a next-to-certain 5th note [F#] in order to call it a pentatonic scale; B minor pentatonic scale in that case. B D E F# A.
Knowing your own ‘tonic’ is fundamental. I would never discourage you from trying, it’s no shame to fail or to not know, but this is a most basic element in musical endeavor.
You seem to be getting a bit better, but I can only guess why.
All in all, I hope you’re getting that you can prepare yourself better and be more self-reliant.