A request to plugin developers:- please allow users to choose where they install plugins when using the installer

[clipnotic]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

[Michael L]

When this is the case then you could still be given the choice of where to put your plugin file.

You can still move it after it's installed. As FigBug said, developers need to K.I.S.S.

[hesnotthemessiah]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

I am not really sure what you are mean here clipnotic Do you mean that most DAWS allow you create a list of locations on your computer for it to search through for plugins, so it should be no problem for me to tell my DAW where my plugin folders are that I create? That's not what I am referring to. I have no problem with my DAW finding my plugins.

[hesnotthemessiah]

When this is the case then you could still be given the choice of where to put your plugin file.

You can still move it after it's installed. As FigBug said, developers need to K.I.S.S.

Yes, I realise that developers want to keep the potential for user error to a minimum This was the only area that I thought would be a hindrance to developers allowing users to install plugins wherever they wanted. I really don't like moving plugins once they are installed as this can cause problems.

[hesnotthemessiah]

To preempt Steinberg's VST3 push, I have been installing the VST3 versions of plugins when updating or installing new plugins over the last couple of weeks. Never really bothered with VST3 before. This lead me to becoming frustrated that, from my own experience, about a quarter of developers don't seem to allow users to put their VST3 plugins in subfolders within the VST3 folder. This is what lead me to starting this thread. I felt that, by allowing users to choose where to install all of their plugins (where the plugin format specifications allow it), they could then create their own subfolders. I know that most developers have installers that allow you to choose the locations for your VST2 plugins (although some do not), so perhaps I should have just restricted my request to "please allow users to choose where they install VST3 plugins when using the installer". Plus I should have made it clearer that I am really talking about allowing users to create subfolders for plugins within their plugin folder and letting users choose to install plugins to these subfolders.

[clipnotic]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

I am not really sure what you are mean here clipnotic Do you mean that most DAWS allow you create a list of locations on your computer for it to search through for plugins, so it should be no problem for me to tell my DAW where my plugin folders are that I create? That's not what I am referring to. I have no problem with my DAW finding my plugins.

Okay, then I don't understand your problem! The VST3 plugins are all installed automatically in one location, great!

[Teksonik]

Here's a real world example....I just upgraded my aging internet computer to a system that has a 128 GB SSD for the OS and a 500 GB hard drive for Data. I only paid $160 for the system and I don't need more storage than that.

I don't use the system for music production but I do use it for testing betas or demos, working on skin edits or checking out freeware to see if it's something worth moving to the studio computer.

That doesn't leave much room for plugins and data on the SSD so I've been forcing plugins to install on the HDD (in a custom folder called 64 Bit Plugins).

I've only installed three plugins so far but all of them have allowed me to install the .dll on the HDD and all but one have allowed me to install the support files (presets, skins etc) to the HDD. So far none of them have VST3 versions.

So yes the ability to choose your custom location is a very valuable feature.

In my opinion organizing how the plugins display in your DAW is always best left to the DAWs plugin manager and it's never a good idea to manually move a .dll after it's been installed especially for some forms of copy protection.

[hesnotthemessiah]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

I am not really sure what you are mean here clipnotic Do you mean that most DAWS allow you create a list of locations on your computer for it to search through for plugins, so it should be no problem for me to tell my DAW where my plugin folders are that I create? That's not what I am referring to. I have no problem with my DAW finding my plugins.

Okay, then I don't understand your problem! The VST3 plugins are all installed automatically in one location, great!

But that is the problem. By developers having installers that automatically install plugins in one location you cannot install them to subfolders within that location. Not a problem for most people but a simple one for developers to solve for those who do find it a problem. Although there is the issue, as mentioned previously, that allowing users to install where they want can then cause other problems.

[Teksonik]

From the link WR gave earlier on the subject of VST3 plugins:

"The VST3 format has a dedicated installation path all VST3 plug-ins must comply with.

[Michael L]

I really don't like moving plugins once they are installed as this can cause problems

That is true. Some developers let you edit the locations of the support files, and some do not. Developers have different priorities for where they want to invest their time, just like users. Best to demo first.

[clipnotic]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

I am not really sure what you are mean here clipnotic Do you mean that most DAWS allow you create a list of locations on your computer for it to search through for plugins, so it should be no problem for me to tell my DAW where my plugin folders are that I create? That's not what I am referring to. I have no problem with my DAW finding my plugins.

Okay, then I don't understand your problem! The VST3 plugins are all installed automatically in one location, great!

But that is the problem. By developers having installers that automatically install plugins in one location you cannot install them to subfolders within that location. Not a problem for most people but a simple one for developers to solve for those who do find it a problem. Although there is the issue, as mentioned previously, that allowing users to install where they want can then cause other problems.

Okay, the solution could be, that every plugin generates its own folder in that "fixed" location!?

[discoDSP]

Power users, if they really care, can open the folder and move the DLL.

I agree with this. We provide custom locations in our Windows installers for the just in case scenario. It's a bit difficult to offer something like the OP request because there are plugin formats with canonical locations required meanwhile require fixed paths. It's also not the same for all operating systems. macOS and Linux are a bit more strict on this regard.

Content on the other hand, which is huge, I understand. There should be options for that, even though it causes no end of issues.

Content can be moved using symlinks too.

[hesnotthemessiah]

From the link WR gave earlier on the subject of VST3 plugins:

"The VST3 format has a dedicated installation path all VST3 plug-ins must comply with.

Yes that is true. But I store my VST3 files, when the installer allows me too, in developer named subfolders within Steinberg's specified VST3 plugin location. The VST3 specifications allow that.

[hesnotthemessiah]

Meanwhile the most DAWs should working with several VST paths simultaneously, so a "fixed" path should be no problem ..

I am not really sure what you are mean here clipnotic Do you mean that most DAWS allow you create a list of locations on your computer for it to search through for plugins, so it should be no problem for me to tell my DAW where my plugin folders are that I create? That's not what I am referring to. I have no problem with my DAW finding my plugins.

Okay, then I don't understand your problem! The VST3 plugins are all installed automatically in one location, great!

But that is the problem. By developers having installers that automatically install plugins in one location you cannot install them to subfolders within that location. Not a problem for most people but a simple one for developers to solve for those who do find it a problem. Although there is the issue, as mentioned previously, that allowing users to install where they want can then cause other problems.

Okay, the solution could be, that every plugin generates its own folder in that "fixed" location!?

For many reasons we have all got different needs when it comes to installing plugins. If every plugin generates its own folder in that "fixed" location then you are not allowing the user to choose where to install the plugin which will not cover these different needs. I like to put my plugins in developer named folders. Others prefer to use plugin type categories (modulation, mastering, EQ etc.). Others (possibly most people) just want to stick them all in one folder.

[Kypresso]

For many reasons we have all got different needs when it comes to installing plugins. If every plugin generates its own folder in that "fixed" location then you are not allowing the user to choose where to install the plugin which will not cover these different needs. I like to put my plugins in developer named folders. Others prefer to use plugin type categories (modulation, mastering, EQ etc.). Others (possibly most people) just want to stick them all in one folder.

The one thing i dont understand is why you want to have them in seperate folders within the vst3 folder.

Once you install your plugin you dont interact with the vst3 folder at all.

Any layout you impose internally on the vst3 folder will not, as far as i know, be shown in any daw. They all use their own system to show you your vst3 plugins, you seem to be getting bothered by something that doesn't matter.