Drum Loops

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Eclectrophonic
KVRist
152 posts since 24 Aug, 2014

Post Fri May 29, 2020 4:48 am

Hi All!

Was just wondering how people here use drum loops, do you?

I've always shied away from them. The ones I've been listening to atm are for house and the full drums (all parts:- kick, snare, hats etc.) I was edging towards giving chopping them up a go. Made me think, all drum loops should come in 4 parts:- 1) just the kick, 2) kick and snare, 3) kick, snare and closed hat pattern and 4) kick, snare and open hat pattern so you can progress them up.

Would like to get peoples thoughts?

Thanks!


User avatar
Aloysius
KVRAF
28987 posts since 11 Aug, 2008 from another dimension

Re: Drum Loops

Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:43 am

What about drums that only have three parts?
Hi-de-Hi!

Divinital
KVRer
14 posts since 22 Jul, 2019

Re: Drum Loops

Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:50 am

I can't use drum loops anymore due to the lack of ability to manipulate individual drum parts to where I want them, a lack of consistency or having to resort to other samples with different tones / drums. If there are enough loops using the same drum timbres that can make an entire song, I've basically done nothing. Plus you have to use effects to get them to sound organic since when the loop ends, so do any tails from the drum tracks, and just applying reverb can sound cheesy. This can be great in certain dance genres where you want the downbeat to almost entirely reset each bar, and bad for other genres.

The closest I get is looping individual drum samples and meshing them into my own premade sample.

I suggest Addictive Drums 2. It uses extremely high quality samples and lets you build your own loops via MIDI. It has onboard effects, compressors, saturation, etc... You can save the MIDI loops and then place them all down separately, but the VST will not have any abrupt cut outs, changes of tone, etc. because even though they're separate MIDI loops, they're all going to the VST kit that handles the samples. The MIDI loop is not specific to any drum kit either inside AD2, you can freely swap the drum machine or drum kit and the MIDI will still do the same thing.

For instance, if you have two hi-hats back to back from a typical sample clip, it'd sound kind of funny with no consistency unless you spent x amount of time tailoring it with various tricks. AD2 makes two hi-hat MIDI triggers sound completely organic as though it's coming from an actual drum kit or drum machine.

They have other MIDI kits inside AD2 for purchase as well, mallets, various percussion. I have a drum kit from the '70s I believe, and Reel Machines which consists of :

Drum Machines:

Linn Electronics LinnDrum
DMX
808
909
Simmons Digital ClapTrap
Simmons SDS-V [with Kick, Snare, Tom (x3), HiHat and Cymbal Modules]

Other Notable Recording Gear:

Stocktronics RX4000 Plate Reverb
Lyrec 2" 24-track Analog Tape Machine
Otari 1/4" 2-track Tape Machine
Ampex 1/2" 2-track Tube Tape Machines
Neve 1073 Preamps
Coles 4038 Ribbon Stereo Room Microphones
Gefell UM92 Tube Mono Room Microphone

It is well worth the cost if you don't have your own library of individual drum samples and care a lot about drums, which I do since I listen to mainly classic rock and metal, yet I make electronic music.

Eclectrophonic
KVRist
152 posts since 24 Aug, 2014

Re: Drum Loops

Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:10 am

Divinital wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:50 am
I can't use drum loops anymore due to the lack of ability to manipulate individual drum parts to where I want them, a lack of consistency or having to resort to other samples with different tones / drums. If there are enough loops using the same drum timbres that can make an entire song, I've basically done nothing. Plus you have to use effects to get them to sound organic since when the loop ends, so do any tails from the drum tracks, and just applying reverb can sound cheesy. This can be great in certain dance genres where you want the downbeat to almost entirely reset each bar, and bad for other genres.

The closest I get is looping individual drum samples and meshing them into my own premade sample.

I suggest Addictive Drums 2. It uses extremely high quality samples and lets you build your own loops via MIDI. It has onboard effects, compressors, saturation, etc... You can save the MIDI loops and then place them all down separately, but the VST will not have any abrupt cut outs, changes of tone, etc. because even though they're separate MIDI loops, they're all going to the VST kit that handles the samples. The MIDI loop is not specific to any drum kit either inside AD2, you can freely swap the drum machine or drum kit and the MIDI will still do the same thing.

For instance, if you have two hi-hats back to back from a typical sample clip, it'd sound kind of funny with no consistency unless you spent x amount of time tailoring it with various tricks. AD2 makes two hi-hat MIDI triggers sound completely organic as though it's coming from an actual drum kit or drum machine.

They have other MIDI kits inside AD2 for purchase as well, mallets, various percussion. I have a drum kit from the '70s I believe, and Reel Machines which consists of :

Drum Machines:

Linn Electronics LinnDrum
DMX
808
909
Simmons Digital ClapTrap
Simmons SDS-V [with Kick, Snare, Tom (x3), HiHat and Cymbal Modules]

Other Notable Recording Gear:

Stocktronics RX4000 Plate Reverb
Lyrec 2" 24-track Analog Tape Machine
Otari 1/4" 2-track Tape Machine
Ampex 1/2" 2-track Tube Tape Machines
Neve 1073 Preamps
Coles 4038 Ribbon Stereo Room Microphones
Gefell UM92 Tube Mono Room Microphone

It is well worth the cost if you don't have your own library of individual drum samples and care a lot about drums, which I do since I listen to mainly classic rock and metal, yet I make electronic music.
Thabks!

Think I'm gonna stick to programming my own drums.

User avatar
consordini
KVRist
381 posts since 6 May, 2020

Re: Drum Loops

Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:45 am

Personally, I don't encounter problems with drum loops, as I rarely actually "use" them. What I found over the years is that I don't personally feel happy enough with just the loop, as its limitations leave at least something I don't really like that much about it, so I end up with better results by just creating my own. BUT, what I found great about older drum loops especially, from packs from the 90s or just snippets from tracks from the 80s or even older, is that they're are great for percussion and texture. I often end up taking a drum loop and filtering out any low or even mid frequencies and just letting the hi-hats or other percussion play, adding a nice natural swing and some vintage-like texture.

But for what you have seem to have set out to do, I think Addictive Drums 2 or even Spark 2 are great choices. I have more experience with Spark 2 and it has performed great. It can be as simple as choosing a pack you like and programing some quite drums to fully shaping every single aspect of the sound you get.
Take care :wink:

User avatar
Gamma-UT
KVRAF
5634 posts since 8 Jun, 2009 from UK

Re: Drum Loops

Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 6:12 am

Eclectrophonic wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 4:48 am
Made me think, all drum loops should come in 4 parts:- 1) just the kick, 2) kick and snare, 3) kick, snare and closed hat pattern and 4) kick, snare and open hat pattern so you can progress them up.
These do exist but I don't know why you would want that rather than to have individual stems for kick, snare, highs and then mix them in the DAW.

With any loop, slicing is your friend.

Rajiv
KVRist
102 posts since 1 Sep, 2006

Re: Drum Loops

Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:29 am

You might want to check out Accusonus Rhythmiq and Regroover. Regroover allows you to split drum loops into stems from which you can capture individual samples, augment with your own samples and then build your own patterns. It's detection algorithm isn't bad, but it's a little finicky to get to a usable end product. I don't use it as much as I thought I would because there are so many good one shot samples out there, and I don't really have the patience to get the extraction right.

Rhythmiq is similar in concept -- it splits your drum loop into three stems and then has tools for adding variation to each stem individually or the entire loop. You can map these controls to knobs on your MIDI controller and go to town. I think this is spectacular, and I use it often. I'll import a loop, hit the record button, and twist knobs for a few minutes, then I sort the results into new patterns and fills. You can easily build all the drum parts for a full song this way in a short amount of time from a single loop. The downside is that it's detection algorithm that splits loops into stems, like Regroover, doesn't always work well with every loop. And when it doesn't do a good split (which, frankly, is about 75% of the loops), the results are unusable. Unlike Regroover, there is not a way to tinker with the algorithm to get it right. Although I suppose you could use Regroover to get to the stems, then import each stem into Rhythmiq.

They are expensive, but do go on sale. I prefer not to program drums, so Rhythmiq is up my alley and has breathed new life into the drum loops I've acquired over the years.

User avatar
thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
27680 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: Drum Loops

Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:40 am

Eclectrophonic wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 4:48 am
Hi All!

Was just wondering how people here use drum loops, do you?

I've always shied away from them. The ones I've been listening to atm are for house and the full drums (all parts:- kick, snare, hats etc.) I was edging towards giving chopping them up a go. Made me think, all drum loops should come in 4 parts:- 1) just the kick, 2) kick and snare, 3) kick, snare and closed hat pattern and 4) kick, snare and open hat pattern so you can progress them up.

Would like to get peoples thoughts?

Thanks!
A lot of drum loops do come with separate sections as well as the main loop ... as you suggested and also as top loops (without kick). Depends how they were made/recorded as to whether it's possible to provide these individual parts.

I mainly program or record my own drum loops, but I'm a sucker for free demo packs, etc so I also have a few commercial loops on my SSD. I tend to mangle them quite a lot before they get used (if at all). :ud:

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vurt
addled muppet weed
67304 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Re: Drum Loops

Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:49 am

if nothing else, they can be great for nicking groove templates from.

User avatar
Calenberger
KVRAF
1647 posts since 8 Sep, 2019 from Calenberg

Re: Drum Loops

Post Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:52 am

If you use Logic Pro, there's the Drummer which is flexible and organic.
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, kanntu meine musi hoeren da:
https://sonoryth.bandcamp.com/
Signature Sound

clipnotic
KVRist
369 posts since 19 Sep, 2007 from Germany

Re: Drum Loops

Post Sat Jun 20, 2020 7:49 am

I only buy beats with all stems, because with slicing you can't seperate for example a clap which sits on a kick. And without stems you can't build up a beat or simply mute the hats or percussion. If you just have the full beat without stems, you can only use a filter or effects to get "variation". Meanwhile the most real good sample providers are offering beats with stems.
VST developers need more motivation and best motivation is hardcore criticism! :D
My english is terrible, feel free to correct me! :wink:

ohgrad
KVRer
8 posts since 14 May, 2020

Re: Drum Loops

Post Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:11 pm

eq, chop, manipulate make it your own.

studiosounds1
KVRer
6 posts since 21 Mar, 2016

Re: Drum Loops

Post Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 am

I rarely use drum loops as the main and only pattern. I mainly produce Hip-Hop and R&B, so most days the drum loops I do use are a second layer over my main drums to add a bit of a groove/humanization to the track. Pitching the loop all the way down and processing it with some FX can also give you an interesting 2nd layer as well. I do like using percussion loops though without a ton of manipulation, just depending on the track.

MogwaiBoy
KVRAF
3554 posts since 26 Nov, 2015 from Way Downunder

Re: Drum Loops

Post Tue Jun 30, 2020 9:13 pm

I try not to use the fully canned stuff - feels like cheating and I worry other artists have the same loop in their song / feels inauthentic. This is ofcourse unless it's just a background supportive layer, then it's fine.

However... chopping them up is fair game, and using drum replacement tools to inject your own samples into them is fun.

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