Polyphonic aftertouch: what is the problem?

[vitocorleone123]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

[Niowiad]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?



I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

[vitocorleone123]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?



I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

I don’t know how to play a piano so, while a 37 key would be better, it was 32 when I got it. I don’t have a need, a desire, or space for anything larger, or I’d have bought the keyboard version.

[aMUSEd]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?



I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

I don’t know how to play a piano so, while a 37 key would be better, it was 32 when I got it. I don’t have a need, a desire, or space for anything larger, or I’d have bought the keyboard version.

Get a Seaboard Block then, or Sensei Morph, both small form factor.

[BBFG#]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?
I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

I don’t know how to play a piano so, while a 37 key would be better, it was 32 when I got it. I don’t have a need, a desire, or space for anything larger, or I’d have bought the keyboard version.

Get a Seaboard Block then, or Sensei Morph, both small form factor.

Pointlessly small even.
And I'm not talking about the width of those keys, but the number of them.
Two octave keyboards are such a joke on all of us.
Personally would prefer a three octave (minimum) that had the functionality of the Rise in a Block size. And the full size Rise just seems pointlessly large for us multiple controller players. Smaller with more range seems to be a better format for adding to my standard keyboard setup. Because there are still things I can do on a standard keyboard that I can't do on a Roli.

[vitocorleone123]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE. Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?



I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

I don’t know how to play a piano so, while a 37 key would be better, it was 32 when I got it. I don’t have a need, a desire, or space for anything larger, or I’d have bought the keyboard version.

Get a Seaboard Block then, or Sensei Morph, both small form factor.

That's my goal for next year. If nothing else, the 37 key Keystep at the very least. Depends on $ at the time.

[BONES]

Earlier this year I got a Seaboard Rise and was amazed at how it transformed my music. The same synths I had already been using now seemed so much more expressive. And this was true even of patches that made no use of the full MPE parameters. Just the polyphonic aftertouch alone was enough to massively upgrade the sound. It was like moving from black and white to colour TV.

I don't think it's the MPE nature of it that makes it expressiv4e at all, it's the extra "dimensions" of touch that works for me and it works equally well on monophonic leads as it does on any polyphonic parts.

Does polyphonic aftertouch require vastly more complex engineering? Is it so much more expensive than channel aftertouch alone? How can it be, then, that controller manufacturers are able to provide it?

Your Roli cost how much? And how many do you think they sell compared to something like KeyStep, which is $130?

It seems to me that polyphonic aftertouch is perhaps the single most important facility required to provide expressive electronic music. It gives synthesizers the same potential for subtlety of intonation and scope for virtuosic mastery that a non-electronic instrument has.

No, it doesn't. Most instruments are monophonic, for a start, and there is plenty of expression available in any of them, from saxamaphone to timpani. And synths have means of expression many other instruments don't - mod wheels, pitch-bend, X-Y pads, sustain pedals, etc., all of which work just as effectively as any expressive control a virtuoso in any other instrument might have.

Decades of potential for expressive electronic music have been lost simply because manufacturers took the facility away from us. My question is: why?

Simple, not enough customers were willing to pay for it. If people rated it, they'd have paid to have it but they didn't, so it disappeared. Even Roli seem to have lost interest, moving onto their more conventional Lumi Keys, which should be out later this week. And the Haken Continuum has been around since 2002 but has gained very little traction in the marketplace, despite having a devoted following.

I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

You know there are things called "Octave Up" and "Octave Down" buttons, right?

[zerocrossing]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE.

What? I would not hold my breath on that unless there was some official word from Sequential.

Alas, I only have a Keystep. Someday I'll have to raise my game and get something small like the Keystep but with poly AT and/or MPE.

You own that $2300 beast of an analog polysynth and use it with a $100 32-key controller?



I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

I don’t know how to play a piano so, while a 37 key would be better, it was 32 when I got it. I don’t have a need, a desire, or space for anything larger, or I’d have bought the keyboard version.

Get a Seaboard Block then, or Sensei Morph, both small form factor.

That's my goal for next year. If nothing else, the 37 key Keystep at the very least. Depends on $ at the time.

I’m no Liberace, but you’d be surprised at what one can do with a nice feeling keyboard and a bit of practice.

[BONES]

Urgh! Who has time to practice?

[Niowiad]

I know the keyboard version comes with 49 keys, but I wouldn't want to settle for less than 61 on that (beautiful) thing, for an external controller.

You know there are things called "Octave Up" and "Octave Down" buttons, right?

Nope. Never heard of those

As if it was reasonable or even possible in most cases, to play anything written on a 5 octave range, using a 4 (or less) octave controller and the "octave up/down" buttons.

Feels like going back to the MPE discussion where you insisted on the uselessness of polyphonic expression, then turned out (as it was presumable) you write music with monophonic lines and occasional power chords.

You don't make use of some features/techniques, then assume they're useless for everyone else

[lfm]

....then turned out (as it was presumable) you write music with monophonic lines ...

It's called melody!
- yes, it's useless and unknown for many people.....

[Niowiad]

....then turned out (as it was presumable) you write music with monophonic lines ...

It's called melody!
- yes, it's useless and unknown for many people.....

Yes, it's called melody.
Or bassline, depending on the context of that monophonic line.
Not sure of what you're trying to imply.

Because I sure wasn't implying writing in monophonic lines and/or using monophonic instruments is bad.
Most of any orchestral piece is made up of monophonic lines.
And I find BONES's music to be well composed and well produced for the genre.

Not sure what you're trying to imply.

[lfm]

Not sure what you're trying to imply.

Was merely fascinated by describing melodic content as "monophonic lines", like someone completely disconnected from the arty part.

[BONES]

As if it was reasonable or even possible in most cases, to play anything written on a 5 octave range, using a 4 (or less) octave controller and the "octave up/down" buttons.

You might be surprised. I've managed 3 and 4 octave parts from a two octave keyboard. Like playing anything, it's just a matter of practice and your fingers will be darting to the buttons without you having to think about it. The good thing about most keyboards is they'll hold the note you are playing after you change up/down so it's easier than you might think.

Feels like going back to the MPE discussion where you insisted on the uselessness of polyphonic expression, then turned out (as it was presumable) you write music with monophonic lines and occasional power chords.

All well and good, but my opinion is not based on my own needs but on my observations of many, many demos where MPE didn't add anything. Your world may revolve around you but mine is infinitely broader.

[vitocorleone123]

My analog poly module supports poly AT and, after a firmware update at some point, should support MPE.

What? I would not hold my breath on that unless there was some official word from Sequential.

So many quotes I tried to cut some out.

YES, Pym from Sequential has said he's worked on MPE for P6 and OB-6 - that was many months ago, and it's somewhere buried on the GS forum. Or was it the Sequential forum? Hmm.

The plan, as I remember him saying, had been to release summer-ish, but Covid and fires have pushed that out to the unknown timeframe again. Both of those polys are, according to him, going to get a "final" firmware update. My guess is that he'll get back to work on those after doing some bug fixing on whatever the new thing being announced soon-ish.