Strategy and project file size

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KVRist

Topic Starter

158 posts since 13 Sep, 2014 from Moscow, Russia

Post Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:56 am

thysm00 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:47 am
Well, as i said earlier, there is no way around it.
But i have a question, 22Mb is not that big, even 2 instances is not huge either, how do you get to 2-3gb? How many instances do you have? To get to 3gb, you need 136instances...
Every time I save a project, Reaper also save the project's backup. During session I call saving about 20-30 times. So overall amount of saving data is 2-3 GB for project with 2 instances of Strategy(~50MB) (project size without Strategy is 3-5 megabytes in worst case).
Also, there's undo\redo points that saves state of plugins.

KVRer
2 posts since 20 Jan, 2020

Post Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:39 am

thysm00 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:47 am
Well, as i said earlier, there is no way around it.
How can you say that when you guys sell another sampled guitar instrument (Telematic) with a file size footprint that is 150 times smaller (153K vs 22MB)?? The main difference between the products as far as I can tell is one is sampled from a Stratocaster and the other is sampled from a Telecaster. What accounts for the huge difference in the size of the plugin state?

KVRist
52 posts since 12 Dec, 2007 from Oslo, Norway

Post Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:21 am

I posted recently in another thread.

This can be solved technically by having the preset stored somewhere on the disk that is not in the plugin state and then saving the pointer to this preset inside the plugin state. Without having looked at this code in specific, but having worked as a professional developer since the nineties, I can say with relative certainty that this is not impossible. It is probably not even difficult.

There is a reason no other sample library wreaks such havoc on a project file. It is not at all hard to do.

KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:30 am

First, this could technically work if the preset hasn't changed. But what if it has? Saving the file anywhere on the computer will take time as well.
Second, we do not make the engine, UVI does, and we have absolutely no control over what and how it's saved. We have asked them for an improvement on this front, but for now, nothing has been done.
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KVRist
52 posts since 12 Dec, 2007 from Oslo, Norway

Post Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:20 am

If it has changed, it is no longer a preset.

Also, if it has changed you can do something called diffing where you check to see how it has changed, and then save the changeset. This has been a solved problem for decades.

KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:35 am

That's actually what the op is asking for and exactly when the problem happens, when you load a session and make changes to the instrument, the plugin state changes and what you save is in fact a preset, because that's what the sequencer needs to reload.

But anyway, i agree about the diff it seems like a good solution, but there are probably other problems that i'm not familiar with and that you probably don't have the answer to either. I know for a fact that Kontakt for example does not do diff, the changed this a few years ago,(it was just a zipped xml before) but they also don't protect their libraries very well (which we can't afford) making the zipping of the preset more efficient.

But again, and for some reason, you seem to insist here, we can't do anything about it as UVI controls that and we don't.

This is something that bothers us as well, and if UVI ever comes up with a fix, we'll make it available to our users immediately. But for now, we prefer getting this annoyance and making big libraries that sound realistic.
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KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Thu Mar 25, 2021 1:42 am

It turns out UVI was working on this already and they found a solution.
I was able to test a beta on a Logic session today. With 2 instances of Strategy, the sessions was about 75Mb and it's now down to 2Mb.

This will be part of a future version of UVI Workstation, maybe not the very next one as it's scheduled around next week, but the one after that should contain it. I will post a message here and we'll probably announce it as well, because it's a really good news for us.
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KVRist

Topic Starter

158 posts since 13 Sep, 2014 from Moscow, Russia

Post Sat Mar 27, 2021 6:19 am

thysm00 wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 1:42 am
It turns out UVI was working on this already and they found a solution.
I was able to test a beta on a Logic session today. With 2 instances of Strategy, the sessions was about 75Mb and it's now down to 2Mb.
It's great news.
Thank you!

KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:26 am

Good new everyone!
UVI Workstation was updated yesterday with the fix for the large session files.
So just update it and save your session again and the project size should drastically decrease.
Just make sure that you also get rid of the "session backups" as these don't get saved again and will keep their old size.

Let me know here if that does not fix it for you, but it should.
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KVRist

Topic Starter

158 posts since 13 Sep, 2014 from Moscow, Russia

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:41 am

thysm00 wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:26 am
Good new everyone!
UVI Workstation was updated yesterday with the fix for the large session files.
So just update it and save your session again and the project size should drastically decrease.
Just make sure that you also get rid of the "session backups" as these don't get saved again and will keep their old size.

Let me know here if that does not fix it for you, but it should.
Nothing changed. :(
I created a new Reaper project with single instance of Strategy and it still takes 24 Mb.

By the way, the changelog doesn't say anything about changing the preset storage.

KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:27 am

You are correct... I'll check that with UVI, but i have the same problem here, still a big file size with this update.
Sorry guys... I'll keep you updated.
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KVRian
892 posts since 5 May, 2008 from France

Post Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:22 am

Ok, they updated it it this morning and i just checked it (on mac at least) and it works as it should :)
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KVRist

Topic Starter

158 posts since 13 Sep, 2014 from Moscow, Russia

Post Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:28 pm

thysm00 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:22 am
Ok, they updated it it this morning and i just checked it (on mac at least) and it works as it should :)
I confirm this. Now the preset is less than 300 kB.

KVRian
1192 posts since 13 May, 2004 from Germany

Post Sat Apr 10, 2021 4:53 am

Yep. This version reduced a cubase file with some guitars from 26.000 KB to 4.000 KB and it saves quicker.

Great

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