First hardware synth

Anything about hardware musical instruments.
KVRAF
2174 posts since 23 Dec, 2002

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:59 am

LocalTrack19 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:56 am
Scotty wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:55 am
I have a Juno 60 here and DeepMind 12D. I can assure it is more than a starter synth.
Are you saying that it is not a starter synth, or that it is not only a starter synth but also great for experienced synth heads?
"more"
a greater or additional amount or degree of.
"she poured herself more coffee"

KVRist

Topic Starter

143 posts since 4 Jul, 2020

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:16 am

Scotty wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:59 am
LocalTrack19 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:56 am
Scotty wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:55 am
I have a Juno 60 here and DeepMind 12D. I can assure it is more than a starter synth.
Are you saying that it is not a starter synth, or that it is not only a starter synth but also great for experienced synth heads?
"more"
a greater or additional amount or degree of.
"she poured herself more coffee"
Forgive me for that, not being a native English speaker :) . Thanks for the advice

KVRAF
2174 posts since 23 Dec, 2002

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:20 am

LocalTrack19 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:16 am
Scotty wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:59 am
LocalTrack19 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:56 am
Scotty wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:55 am
I have a Juno 60 here and DeepMind 12D. I can assure it is more than a starter synth.
Are you saying that it is not a starter synth, or that it is not only a starter synth but also great for experienced synth heads?
"more"
a greater or additional amount or degree of.
"she poured herself more coffee"
Forgive me for that, not being a native English speaker :) . Thanks for the advice
You do very well for not being a native English speaker. Much better than I would do if our roles were reversed.

KVRist

Topic Starter

143 posts since 4 Jul, 2020

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:27 pm

chk071 wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:25 am
I'd throw Waldorf Blofeld in the ring. Note that it is a bit limited in terms of physical controls though, so, it requires some menu diving. There's some serious synthesis power under the hood though, and it sounds great (I had it for a couple of days).

There's also the Novation Mininova, but, frankly, I don't think it sounds that good really. It's unfortunate, because, if it sounded as good as the Supernova, for example, it would be a really great alternative, but, their tweaks to the sound engine were quite counterproductive IMO.
Is the Ultranova any good sound-wise? Or comparable to the Mininova?

KVRAF
27802 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:58 pm

It's exactly the same sound engine, so, they sound the same.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

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GRRRRRRR!
11255 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:32 pm

A lot more hands-on control with the Ultranova, though, and it has full-size keys. The Ultranova also has a built in USB audio interface and an external monitoring input, which means you can run another hardware synth through it without needing a mixer.
zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 8:17 pm
In all honesty, though, as much as I really liked Micromonsta 1, the UI wasn’t that fun to use. Clear and intuitive, but nothing I’d really say was a worth a break from plugins.
What I like about MicroMonsta is that, unlike any other synth I can think of, it is tiny enough to sit right next to your laptop or computer keyboard, which makes interacting with it much better than any other hardware synth I've ever seen. That's the deal-breaker with trying to use hardware and software together - it's not easy to flip back and forth between the two. For me it has always been sitting down to work on the computer and standing up to reach over to any of my hardware synths, even when I had a whole room as a dedicated studio space and a massive desk. But I really like working with MicroMonsta because I can do it sitting in front of my laptop and it is just as easy as any VSTi, where every other hardware synth I have is more effort than working with plugins and my mouse. Where MicroMonsta falls down for me is that it is just a V/A, like so many plugins. I think my main attraction to it was that they managed to pack so much into such a tiny box but, at the end of the day, software does all the same things just as well so I stopped using it a while ago. I should probably sell it.
chk071 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:16 am
Good call, because, that's just what it sounds like. Thin, sterile, and uninspiring. (please, don't hit me, BONES :hihi:)
You are the worst - you read something that you barely understand and extrapolate it to extremes. How long have you spent actually using an Ultra/Mini Nova? I've had mine for 9 years and played it alongside dozens of other synths - nothing else comes close. 3 x oscillators, each with the ability to clone and detune itself x 8, with 18 voice polyphony. Explain to us how all that would sound thin?

Nick Batt, for example, seems to think it sounds very lush and full, if you bothered to watch his review. And Nick Batt reviews dozens of synths every year, so I think he knows a bit more than you about it. He even thinks it can compete on a number of fronts with an Access Virus for modern synth sounds (for around one-third of the price in the case of Mininova).
Would be a nice synth, actually, if it was anything like the old Nova's, but, unfortunately, it isn't.
Again, Nick Batt seems to think it is VERY much like the old Novas. Not 100% but very close and with many features that take it beyond those synths.
NOVAkILL : Dell G7 Core i7, 32GB RAM, Win10, Zoom U24 | Studio One | Thorn, bx_oberhausen, ARP Odyssey, JP6K, Hexeract, Vacuum Pro, TRK-01, Knifonium, Equator, VG Carbon, VG Iron | Uno, Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket.

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KVRAF
1945 posts since 15 Aug, 2012 from Australia

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:38 pm

zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 8:17 pm
werp wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:31 pm
zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 6:25 am
werp wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:49 am
See if you can find an Audiothingies Micromonsta (no keyboard, it’s a tiny eight voice virtual analog). It’s discontinued now so 2nd hand only.
There’s a v2 that’s still currently in production, I believe.
The second batch of the micromonsta 2 was released last night my time. It’s a dual layer synth with six voices per layer. You have the option for 12 voices on a single layer or six voices per split.

There is. I’m on the email list. It has six voices, the original has eight.
That’s odd. I’ve never heard of a v2 of a synth offering a lower voice count as a feature.

In all honesty, though, as much as I really liked Micromonsta 1, the UI wasn’t that fun to use. Clear and intuitive, but nothing I’d really say was a worth a break from plugins. In the end I used it as a wavetable source for a Pro 2, but for various reasons I moved on.

I sort of feel like if you’re happy using plugins, you should really go all out if you want a hardware synth. You may as well get a Deepmind and have a lot of knobs, but really I’d save and get a Prophet 08 or 6 module.
I'm tired of being insane. I'm going outsane for some fresh air.

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KVRAF
1945 posts since 15 Aug, 2012 from Australia

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:41 pm

hmm, my typing isn’t making it to the screen...wierd...
The Minimonsta 2 2nd batch went live my time last night. It’s a dual layer thing with 6 voices per layer, 12 voices in single mode or six voices per split...
My summit offers the same thing and then some so it’s not something I’ll pursue
I'm tired of being insane. I'm going outsane for some fresh air.

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GRRRRRRR!
11255 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:47 pm

And your Summit cost how much? MicroMonsta is ridiculously cheap for everything they pack into it and the new one is even smaller than the original. I don't need it but I am still tempted to buy the new one, just to see what they've managed with it. I could gaffa tape it to the top of my KeyStep and have a really powerful synth with a great keyboard.
NOVAkILL : Dell G7 Core i7, 32GB RAM, Win10, Zoom U24 | Studio One | Thorn, bx_oberhausen, ARP Odyssey, JP6K, Hexeract, Vacuum Pro, TRK-01, Knifonium, Equator, VG Carbon, VG Iron | Uno, Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket.

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KVRAF
1945 posts since 15 Aug, 2012 from Australia

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:25 am

BONES wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:47 pm
And your Summit cost how much? MicroMonsta is ridiculously cheap for everything they pack into it and the new one is even smaller than the original. I don't need it but I am still tempted to buy the new one, just to see what they've managed with it. I could gaffa tape it to the top of my KeyStep and have a really powerful synth with a great keyboard.
I scored the Summit for $2850 AUD on Christmas Eve, a flash sale at $800 AUD the normal street price, not retail. I had onsold a Peak earlier in the year, The Hydrasynth kinda left it standing in the shade.

The price for the Micromonsta 2 is utterly silly. I may buy one anyway...watching a one hour demo right now...It does add a different flavour I guess.
I'm tired of being insane. I'm going outsane for some fresh air.

KVRist

Topic Starter

143 posts since 4 Jul, 2020

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:00 am

BONES wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:32 pm
A lot more hands-on control with the Ultranova, though, and it has full-size keys. The Ultranova also has a built in USB audio interface and an external monitoring input, which means you can run another hardware synth through it without needing a mixer.
zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 8:17 pm
In all honesty, though, as much as I really liked Micromonsta 1, the UI wasn’t that fun to use. Clear and intuitive, but nothing I’d really say was a worth a break from plugins.
What I like about MicroMonsta is that, unlike any other synth I can think of, it is tiny enough to sit right next to your laptop or computer keyboard, which makes interacting with it much better than any other hardware synth I've ever seen. That's the deal-breaker with trying to use hardware and software together - it's not easy to flip back and forth between the two. For me it has always been sitting down to work on the computer and standing up to reach over to any of my hardware synths, even when I had a whole room as a dedicated studio space and a massive desk. But I really like working with MicroMonsta because I can do it sitting in front of my laptop and it is just as easy as any VSTi, where every other hardware synth I have is more effort than working with plugins and my mouse. Where MicroMonsta falls down for me is that it is just a V/A, like so many plugins. I think my main attraction to it was that they managed to pack so much into such a tiny box but, at the end of the day, software does all the same things just as well so I stopped using it a while ago. I should probably sell it.
chk071 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:16 am
Good call, because, that's just what it sounds like. Thin, sterile, and uninspiring. (please, don't hit me, BONES :hihi:)
You are the worst - you read something that you barely understand and extrapolate it to extremes. How long have you spent actually using an Ultra/Mini Nova? I've had mine for 9 years and played it alongside dozens of other synths - nothing else comes close. 3 x oscillators, each with the ability to clone and detune itself x 8, with 18 voice polyphony. Explain to us how all that would sound thin?

Nick Batt, for example, seems to think it sounds very lush and full, if you bothered to watch his review. And Nick Batt reviews dozens of synths every year, so I think he knows a bit more than you about it. He even thinks it can compete on a number of fronts with an Access Virus for modern synth sounds (for around one-third of the price in the case of Mininova).
Would be a nice synth, actually, if it was anything like the old Nova's, but, unfortunately, it isn't.
Again, Nick Batt seems to think it is VERY much like the old Novas. Not 100% but very close and with many features that take it beyond those synths.
Bigger keys are an advantage, although I have quite small hands. No need for an audio interface, as I am very happy with my SSL 2+. Compared to the MicroKorg, is the Korg R3 any better? They are sold secondhand for quite a good price in my country

KVRAF
27802 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:55 am

BONES wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:32 pm
chk071 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:16 am
Good call, because, that's just what it sounds like. Thin, sterile, and uninspiring. (please, don't hit me, BONES :hihi:)
You are the worst - you read something that you barely understand and extrapolate it to extremes. How long have you spent actually using an Ultra/Mini Nova? I've had mine for 9 years and played it alongside dozens of other synths - nothing else comes close. 3 x oscillators, each with the ability to clone and detune itself x 8, with 18 voice polyphony. Explain to us how all that would sound thin?

Nick Batt, for example, seems to think it sounds very lush and full, if you bothered to watch his review. And Nick Batt reviews dozens of synths every year, so I think he knows a bit more than you about it. He even thinks it can compete on a number of fronts with an Access Virus for modern synth sounds (for around one-third of the price in the case of Mininova).
Would be a nice synth, actually, if it was anything like the old Nova's, but, unfortunately, it isn't.
Again, Nick Batt seems to think it is VERY much like the old Novas. Not 100% but very close and with many features that take it beyond those synths.
Don't get me wrong, I like Nick Batt, and I appreciate what he does, but, he's not right about everything... He's also quite... favourable towards Novation products (you know, UK brand, and he often had some reps in his vids). I don't think I ever really saw him bash a synth either. After all, it's a two-sided thing - he benefits from the industry, the industry benefits from reviews, and media attention.

If you like the Mini-/Ultranova, hey... no point in discussing. I'm just saying that the old Nova's sound quite a bit better than it. Not sure what they did to the synth engine, but, it seems to me as if they did what everyone else does these days: Make it brighter, implement some better anti-aliasing filters, defuse the envelope behavior, and take the character out of the filters. Waldorf kind of did the same with their more recent synths. You can like it... or not.

Search Youtube for some vids on the Nova, Supernova, or Supernova 2 synths. They sound warmer, have more "thump" and punch to them, and they also have a more pleasant filter resonance behavior, as far as I can tell.

This is a nice one, for example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qegkrb2-6bc
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

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GRRRRRRR!
11255 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:03 pm

werp wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:25 am
I scored the Summit for $2850 AUD on Christmas Eve, a flash sale at $800 AUD the normal street price, not retail.
Where from? I mostly buy from StoreDJ these days, although occasionally I get tings from Sounds Easy, too.
The price for the Micromonsta 2 is utterly silly. I may buy one anyway...watching a one hour demo right now...It does add a different flavour I guess.
It certainly is and it probably does. It's so cheap you can pretty much buy it on spec.
LocalTrack19 wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:00 am
Bigger keys are an advantage, although I have quite small hands.
I surprised myself at how easily I adapted to mini keys. I don't think my hands are particularly small but I find them easier than full-size keys for playing octaves and no worse for anything else. I don't even have a problem playing mini keys with one hand and full size keys with the other. My brain seemed to adapt almost instantly but I've not thought of myself as a keyboard player for a long time.
chk071 wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:55 am
I don't think I ever really saw him bash a synth either. After all, it's a two-sided thing - he benefits from the industry, the industry benefits from reviews, and media attention.
The thing with reviewers, whether they be reviewing books, movies or synths, is that over time you get to know them and you learn to read between the lines. No, he doesn't publish negative reviews but you can often tell that he isn't a fan of something from the way he talks about it. That's the value of someone like Nick, he's done so many reviews that you can interpret what he says and make a judgement as to how it applies to you.
If you like the Mini-/Ultranova, hey... no point in discussing. I'm just saying that the old Nova's sound quite a bit better than it. Not sure what they did to the synth engine, but, it seems to me as if they did what everyone else does these days: Make it brighter, implement some better anti-aliasing filters, defuse the envelope behavior, and take the character out of the filters.
Here again, you are just rabbiting something you read, you have no first-hand knowledge of any of it, do you?
Search Youtube for some vids on the Nova, Supernova, or Supernova 2 synths. They sound warmer, have more "thump" and punch to them, and they also have a more pleasant filter resonance behavior, as far as I can tell.
No they don't, they sound 99% the same. Why on Earth would Novation do anything to make a new Nova synth sound worse than the old one? It's nonsense perpetuated by idiots who fear any kind of change.
This is a nice one, for example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qegkrb2-6bc
Nothing there would sell me on that synth. If anything, it sounds more like a K-Station, which is fine, but it's not in the same league as Ultranova. Honestly, I don't know how you could listen to something as generic as that jam and get anything useful from it. This one, at least, sounds a bit like Ultranova and, like your video, you can hear that the sound is anything but warm - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wL8xOXnPXUU
NOVAkILL : Dell G7 Core i7, 32GB RAM, Win10, Zoom U24 | Studio One | Thorn, bx_oberhausen, ARP Odyssey, JP6K, Hexeract, Vacuum Pro, TRK-01, Knifonium, Equator, VG Carbon, VG Iron | Uno, Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket.

AnX
KVRAF
9127 posts since 17 Nov, 2015

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:16 pm

BONES wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:32 pm
I've had mine for 9 years and played it alongside dozens of other synths
how many songs has it been used on?

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GRRRRRRR!
11255 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:54 pm

Every live set (bar one) we've played since I bought it so, at a guess, 20 to 25 songs.
NOVAkILL : Dell G7 Core i7, 32GB RAM, Win10, Zoom U24 | Studio One | Thorn, bx_oberhausen, ARP Odyssey, JP6K, Hexeract, Vacuum Pro, TRK-01, Knifonium, Equator, VG Carbon, VG Iron | Uno, Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket.

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