Which is more useful, single or multi core performance.

Configure and optimize you computer for Audio.
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KVRAF
10992 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:35 am

I’m really struggling to figure out which processor I should get in my new PC.
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

KVRAF
12833 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Post Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:49 am

Both are important. If you are choosing from top of the line processors I think that it doesn't matter as much as you might think. Single core performance will impact the top end performance of products that really push that, e.g., Reaktor. Multicore performance will impact your music production overall. The thing is, they are not independent and so pushing Reaktor to the brink will have some impact on on your music production overall.

One thing to keep in mind when ordering pre-built computers is that their cooling solutions are seldom designed to allow the processor to achieve its full potential. Your CPU will often throttle because of heat before you get to the stated maximums for your CPU. Watch some gaming vids to see some detail on this, those guys are fanatical about performance and cooling, single core vs multicore, and CPU/GPU tradeoffs.

Current advice on intel, AFAIK, is i9-10900k, the 11 series desktop parts are a disaster at the top end. If I were building a desktop today I would buy an AMD 5900 series part. The problem is finding one, even in a pre-built. If you want to stay intel and are looking for a price performance bargain, the i5-11400 is supposed to be a decent choice.

KVRAF
6523 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle

Post Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:57 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:35 am
I’m really struggling to figure out which processor I should get in my new PC.
Budget? Pre-built/custom-built, or DIY?
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil

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KVRAF

Topic Starter

10992 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:10 am

Shabdahbriah wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:57 am
zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:35 am
I’m really struggling to figure out which processor I should get in my new PC.
Budget?
$2-3K USD (including everything)
Pre-built/custom-built, or DIY?
I’m not sure. I’ve always been a bit timid about building my own computer. Not the actual building part, but I worry about choosing the right components. I’d do it if someone said, “buy x, y and z, then put it together.” I’d probably be better off just buying the best off-the-shelf thing in my budget. Not really sure.
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

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KVRAF

Topic Starter

10992 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am

ghettosynth wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:49 am
Current advice on intel, AFAIK, is i9-10900k, the 11 series desktop parts are a disaster at the top end.
In what way? Bad performance?
If I were building a desktop today I would buy an AMD 5900 series part. The problem is finding one, even in a pre-built. If you want to stay intel and are looking for a price performance bargain, the i5-11400 is supposed to be a decent choice.
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

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KVRian
552 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:39 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
AMD is the TOP dog now, the only compatibility problem you can have is with UAD stuff...
I do not know what works or not, but you may check at UAD forum/support and
https://gearspace.com/board/music-compu ... ad-12.html
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:10 am
I’m not sure. I’ve always been a bit timid about building my own computer. Not the actual building part, but I worry about choosing the right components. I’d do it if someone said, “buy x, y and z, then put it together.” I’d probably be better off just buying the best off-the-shelf thing in my budget. Not really sure.
I did that in viewtopic.php?p=8081813#p8081813

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KVRAF

Topic Starter

10992 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:48 am

Pictus wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:39 am
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
AMD is the TOP dog now, the only compatibility problem you can have is with UAD stuff...
I do not know what works or not, but you may check at UAD forum/support and
https://gearspace.com/board/music-compu ... ad-12.html
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:10 am
I’m not sure. I’ve always been a bit timid about building my own computer. Not the actual building part, but I worry about choosing the right components. I’d do it if someone said, “buy x, y and z, then put it together.” I’d probably be better off just buying the best off-the-shelf thing in my budget. Not really sure.
I did that in viewtopic.php?p=8081813#p8081813
Hm, that seems to be about UAD PCIe cards. I’m using a FireWire PCIe card and an older UAD FireWire interface.
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

KVRAF
12833 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:55 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am
ghettosynth wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:49 am
Current advice on intel, AFAIK, is i9-10900k, the 11 series desktop parts are a disaster at the top end.
In what way? Bad performance?
Yes, the 11900K has worse performance than the 10900K and, IIRC, is more expensive.
If I were building a desktop today I would buy an AMD 5900 series part. The problem is finding one, even in a pre-built. If you want to stay intel and are looking for a price performance bargain, the i5-11400 is supposed to be a decent choice.
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
[/quote]

Probably. AMD supports the AVX instructions. There are some compatibility issues but that's not one of them. Most of the issues that I'm ware of raise their head when you're doing virtualization. I'm not an expert on that by any means so I'll let others chime in, but, unless you're running virtual machines and doing hardware passthrough, and/or some other narrow development/virtualization tasks that are not music related, you are unlikely to run into any issues.

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KVRian
552 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:31 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:48 am
Hm, that seems to be about UAD PCIe cards. I’m using a FireWire PCIe card and an older UAD FireWire interface.
If it is the case check https://pcpartpicker.com/list/PMntF8
Just add a CPU(Ryzen 9 5900X ?) and your stuff, but if want to reduce the price
change to a 2TB SSD model https://pcpartpicker.com/product/vMFKHx ... 000gm3a002
and 64GB(2x32) RAM.

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KVRAF

Topic Starter

10992 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:39 am

Pictus wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:39 am
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
AMD is the TOP dog now, the only compatibility problem you can have is with UAD stuff...
I do not know what works or not, but you may check at UAD forum/support and
https://gearspace.com/board/music-compu ... ad-12.html
Thanks for that. I do see someone with my Apollo there that’s not having a good experience using a PCIe FireWire card with the AMD, so I think I’ll pass because that’s pretty important to me.
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:10 am
I’m not sure. I’ve always been a bit timid about building my own computer. Not the actual building part, but I worry about choosing the right components. I’d do it if someone said, “buy x, y and z, then put it together.” I’d probably be better off just buying the best off-the-shelf thing in my budget. Not really sure.
I did that in viewtopic.php?p=8081813#p8081813
Ah, thanks for that!
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

KVRAF
12833 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:34 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:39 am
Pictus wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:39 am
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:13 am
I had heard that AMD was good, but I worry about compatibility. Like, I know Massive X requires a specific chip feature. Am I wrong to worry about this?
AMD is the TOP dog now, the only compatibility problem you can have is with UAD stuff...
I do not know what works or not, but you may check at UAD forum/support and
https://gearspace.com/board/music-compu ... ad-12.html
Thanks for that. I do see someone with my Apollo there that’s not having a good experience using a PCIe FireWire card with the AMD, so I think I’ll pass because that’s pretty important to me.
zerocrossing wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:10 am
I’m not sure. I’ve always been a bit timid about building my own computer. Not the actual building part, but I worry about choosing the right components. I’d do it if someone said, “buy x, y and z, then put it together.” I’d probably be better off just buying the best off-the-shelf thing in my budget. Not really sure.
I did that in viewtopic.php?p=8081813#p8081813
Ah, thanks for that!
That's a great thread. There's some stuff in there on the 11900k. It's too bad that there are some weird issues with Pcie/Firewire because AMD is the way to go right now. In any case, the guy with the big hair does gaming tech talk. I can't remember his name or his channel name, but, other than he's a bit longwinded, he's good to follow to keep up on performance in CPUs/GPUs.

KVRAF
4399 posts since 21 Sep, 2005

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 11:22 am

I've got an old box I'm quite fond of. It's got a 4690K chip in there which can be taken up to 4.6GHz sometimes on air with a serious overclock. I've not tried o/c'ing it yet. It took me enough fuss to just put on the Hyper 212 Coolermaster - https://www.coolermaster.com/catalog/co ... o/#gallery

It's a beast (the cooler, and maybe the chip as well).

I used some old Arctic Silver I had that had not been put in the fridge. Seemed ok to me. Took me three or more swipes to get it right. In the end you just don't worry. Jesus, what a fuckin' mess.

Anyway, all good. Temps of 20C or cooler. This is known for being a very good performer on single core hence its popularity as a gaming chip, where more than quad core performance is not called for, and you certainly don't need more than 8GB of RAM.

I don't think I'll try to seriously o/c this chip. I'll just take her up a few notches in the bios and see what's what. I had a lot of fun before taking chips to the limit but I'm too old for that now, and life is too short. If I can get 4.4GHz I'll quit while I'm ahead. If I can't, then well, I'll still quite while I'm ahead.

This chip is quite old now, but still a good performer, and it can still reach prices of a coupla hundred bucks when you find one new and boxed.

I got to say, that 30 bucks Coolermaster really does the business. I've tried frying the little bugger and it never gets over about 30/40C. I've not done any Prime or any of the other serious stress testers, but so far, I'm hoping I can hit 4.6GHz. It's a 3.6GHz chip, and that's why these are known for being serious little overclockers.

I can't make it have more cores. Or more hyper-threading. But I can take it to the limit of its Silicon. Which I intend to do. It would be rude not to.

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KVRian
552 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil

Post Thu Apr 15, 2021 12:48 pm

codec_spurt wrote:
Thu Apr 15, 2021 11:22 am
I've got an old box I'm quite fond of. It's got a 4690K chip in there which can be taken up to 4.6GHz sometimes on air with a serious overclock. I've not tried o/c'ing it yet. It took me enough fuss to just put on the Hyper 212 Coolermaster - https://www.coolermaster.com/catalog/co ... o/#gallery

It's a beast (the cooler, and maybe the chip as well).
The 4690K is a 4 core CPU, for a CPU with 8 core or more the hyper 212 evo
is not up to the task, needs a more capable cooler
https://youtu.be/JtWr15on6OU
A less expensive option can be the Thermalright Frost Spirit 140
https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005001476494179.html
https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/therm ... st-5901891
I used some old Arctic Silver I had that had not been put in the fridge. Seemed ok to me. Took me three or more swipes to get it right. In the end you just don't worry. Jesus, what a fuckin' mess.
The good old silver!
But today we got better thermal paste that is also not conductive.
https://youtu.be/t0pNHTiNOrs

KVRist
345 posts since 25 Aug, 2019

Post Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:34 am

zerocrossing wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:35 am
I’m really struggling to figure out which processor I should get in my new PC.
A single track uses one core for serial processing while it's running in parallel with other tracks each one using one of the cores. When your CPU "run out of cores" the OS will use a core for two tracks etc.
So you need a CPU with good one core performance, but number of cores is much more important. Also, some heavy plugins can use multithreading in a single instance.

KVRAF
21979 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from not here

Post Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:39 am

I think if the goal is something on the order of VCV Rack, it hammers on one core so clock speed is crucial and cores means nothing. The way I work uses cores and distributes, even is part of the setup, 'threads (not the same as cores of course, but related) per instance' in VEP. Don't know if a higher clock speed would benefit or not, that was a pricing choice and there wasn't that much difference for the mo' money.

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