Is it bad to rely on 32-bit plugins?

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
User avatar
KVRAF
2342 posts since 31 Jan, 2003 from Ghent, Belgium

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:06 am

FigBug wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:31 am
Which I interpreted the OP to be asking, will 32 bit plugins continue to work with modern DAWs. To which I stand by my answer of No, at some point (I can't predict when), support for 32 bit plugins will be dropped, or they will just get broken by an OS update.

While not updating the machine is an option, it gets harder and harder as time goes on. Parts break, and when they get replaced, Windows needs to be reactivated, which is no longer offered for older versions. I don't think it's possible to activate XP any longer, other than by finding a leaked volume license key.
You're free to interpret anything in any way you like, but I don't read any future plans in the original post.
Any version of Windows 10 works fine without activating. The difference between an activated and non-activated W10 is irrelevant for audio workstation purposes.

Also, even if Microsoft drops all 32 bit support, the jbridge plugin will still work - it's a 64 bit plugin after all.

KVRAF
2259 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:30 pm

Microsoft isn't Apple, they care about legacy compatibility, it's one of their selling points, you can install and run Windows 10 on pretty old machines, they are in business of selling that OS and will not compromise that, so no need to worry about this issue at all.

Even if they get heavy into ARM with their own devices, they aren't going to stop supporting Intel/AMD machines with Windows or Intel/AMD are going anywhere soon.

KVRist
499 posts since 17 Nov, 2015 from Yuma

Post Sat May 01, 2021 12:22 pm

why should it be so?
lots of pretty good 32bit plugins out there.
i am about to rework all my old renoise tracks, all 32bit plugins, from my first few steps into daws etc. i abandoned a ton of plugins since then.
that brings some advantages with it. first i rewrite old stuff with new sounds, discovering new ways, second i hear how shitty the first tries sounded then :D, at third i ahve to emulate all abandoned synths sounds with other synths, whihc makes it easy to decide which old 32bit plugins are worth being reinstalled, and which remain uninstalled by easily being recreated by the new ones.

so far there are only a few 32bit i reinstalled, maybe half a dozen or so (compared to ten times more abandoned ones ;D). like some saltline synths, tubeohm synths, big tick rhino cm version, ivor2, anubis, cobalt etc...

on the other hand, if you never did even one loop with 32bit, why bother about using it at all. unless you are really curious about their sounds.

KVRAF
3256 posts since 2 Jul, 2005

Post Sat May 01, 2021 1:23 pm

I would bounce anything using 32 bit plugins unless you are fully 32 bit. They stop working out of nowhere sometimes.
Don't F**K with Mr. Zero.

KVRist
94 posts since 2 Mar, 2018

Post Sun May 02, 2021 6:57 am

Dasheesh wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2021 3:55 am
eventually your hand will be forced by the tech companies no matter what you want. as has been stated over and over... it's not really yours, and you don't own anything virtual, you are just borrowing it for a short time (sometimes a longer time), and it can be taken from you at the tech companies or developers discretion. the only way to keep it at this point is to keep a second machine offline and out of reach of the internet dedicated to specific 32 bit plugs untouched in any other way.
? I give up, what are you talking about? I own many plugins, both 32 and 64 bit, they are mine, I am not "borrowing" them and they can't be taken from me.

Back to the OP: worrying about whether a plugin is 32 or 64 bit is for the most part a total waste of time. Plugins are almost always backward compatible for a lonnng time (Windows anyway), so they will work even on newer systems. I guess waaay in the future there could be hardware or software issues, but I think that would be a rare situation. Basically if you like something, who cares if it's 32 or 64?

User avatar
KVRAF
2342 posts since 31 Jan, 2003 from Ghent, Belgium

Post Sun May 02, 2021 7:13 am

mixyguy2 wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 6:57 am
Plugins are almost always backward compatible, so they will always work even on newer systems. If you like it, who cares if it's 32 or 64?
You're describing forward compatibility, not backward. (It depends on which part provides the compatibility, the DAW or the plugin. In the case of plugins, it's always the DAW.)

"who cares if it's 32 or 64"
Without a bit bridge, 32 bit plugins won't run on relatively newer versions of quite a few DAWs.
e.g. 32 bit plugins won't run on Cubase 9 (or 9.5, I'm not sure) and higher versions. So you'd need to purchase jbridge (or alternatives... I don't know if they exist).

The only 32 bit plugin that I still use is SQ8L. All the ones that I've purchased have gotten 64 bit updates.+
Ah_Dziz wrote:
Sat May 01, 2021 1:23 pm
I would bounce anything using 32 bit plugins unless you are fully 32 bit. They stop working out of nowhere sometimes.
When you lose a tooth, the tooth fairy takes away a 32 bit plugin.

KVRist
205 posts since 13 Oct, 2006

Post Sun May 02, 2021 7:59 am

The only older plugin I'm sorry to see go is Camel Audio Alchemy. Camel Audio left us with a 64 bit build, so I don't need to bridge it. However there are other issues. Ableton Live 11 switched to a more up-to-date graphics library on the Mac, and a whole bunch of plugins stopped working. The good news, for most people, was that their plugins just needed to be rebuilt with the newer graphics library, and most were running in a short time. The bad news is that there is no Camel Audio to rebuild it. I looked into bridging software that might handle the graphics issues for me, but none of them I found supported Catalina (or Big Sur when that day comes).

I can still run Alchemy in Live 10, but I really like all of the new features in Live 11. Alchemy and $100's and $100's spent on expansion libraries on one side of the balance beam and Live 11 and all of it's new features on the other side
2020 iMac 27" 10 Core, OS 10.15.6, iConnectAudio2+, iConnectMidi4+, Novation SL MKIII, Push 2, Ableton Live

User avatar
KVRAF
2342 posts since 31 Jan, 2003 from Ghent, Belgium

Post Sun May 02, 2021 8:21 am

krankyone wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 7:59 am
The only older plugin I'm sorry to see go is Camel Audio Alchemy. Camel Audio left us with a 64 bit build, so I don't need to bridge it. However there are other issues. Ableton Live 11 switched to a more up-to-date graphics library on the Mac, and a whole bunch of plugins stopped working. The good news, for most people, was that their plugins just needed to be rebuilt with the newer graphics library, and most were running in a short time. The bad news is that there is no Camel Audio to rebuild it. I looked into bridging software that might handle the graphics issues for me, but none of them I found supported Catalina (or Big Sur when that day comes).

I can still run Alchemy in Live 10, but I really like all of the new features in Live 11. Alchemy and $100's and $100's spent on expansion libraries on one side of the balance beam and Live 11 and all of it's new features on the other side
Does Logic Alchemy run in Ableton or is it locked to Logic? (I know, not exactly a cheap option)

I don't think Windows is superior to MacOS, or the other way around, except when it's about backward compatibility. Apple just doesn't care for people wanting to run older software.

Sidenote: I think I read something about issues running the old Alchemy in Cubase 11, but it could be solved already - I don't know.

I still use Cubase 9.5... My music production laptop is from 2012. At some point you need to freeze your software (for performance sake) if you're not upgrading the computer hardware.

KVRist
94 posts since 2 Mar, 2018

Post Wed May 12, 2021 11:29 am

T-CM11 wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 7:13 am
"who cares if it's 32 or 64"
Without a bit bridge, 32 bit plugins won't run on relatively newer versions of quite a few DAWs.
Wow really? That's kinda lame. Glad it's not true in my case. Hail Mixcraft! :)

User avatar
KVRian
918 posts since 25 Sep, 2014 from Specific Northwest

Post Wed May 12, 2021 12:13 pm

The writing is pretty much on the wall for 32-bit. Like 8- and 16-bit before it, it will be relegated to the great bit bucket in the sky. I see Windows plug makers are dropping support for it more and more, mostly because the market is going 64-bit.

If you have a set up you like, freeze it. Make a full backup on a regular basis, make sure you have a backup machine you can copy over to, provided there's no weird copy protection schemes tied to your hardware.

I have Macs and keep an older MacBook with Mavericks on it as it was the last OS to fully support Carbon (32-bit graphics) properly so I can still run my handful of plugins that are and will always be 32-bit only. There are a few that are irreplaceable! However, I've mostly moved on without them... :cry:

KVRAF
21941 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from not here

Post Wed May 12, 2021 5:02 pm

mixyguy2 wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 6:57 am
Dasheesh wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2021 3:55 am
eventually your hand will be forced by the tech companies no matter what you want. as has been stated over and over... it's not really yours, and you don't own anything virtual, you are just borrowing it for a short time (sometimes a longer time), and it can be taken from you at the tech companies or developers discretion. the only way to keep it at this point is to keep a second machine offline and out of reach of the internet dedicated to specific 32 bit plugs untouched in any other way.
? I give up, what are you talking about? I own many plugins, both 32 and 64 bit, they are mine, I am not "borrowing" them and they can't be taken from me.
If you actuall owned the plugins, you could rework them, reverse engineer, distribute them any way you like, but you've certainly signed a contract stating you never will, because what you own is a license to use it.

KVRist
94 posts since 2 Mar, 2018

Post Fri May 14, 2021 8:37 pm

...which is still owning them. I don't need the ability to tear something apart and rebuild it to own it and what Dasheesh said is clearly inaccurate. The plugins I own cannot be taken from me at any time.

User avatar
KVRian
918 posts since 25 Sep, 2014 from Specific Northwest

Post Fri May 14, 2021 9:29 pm

mixyguy2 wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 8:37 pm
The plugins I own cannot be taken from me at any time.
Actually, depending on the copy protection, they could be if any have to call home on a regular basis. You would still "own" them, they just would no longer work. Again, if you have to reinstall any of them and the mothership is no longer there, they will no longer work.

One of the joys of modern software.

User avatar
KVRAF
7650 posts since 11 Jun, 2006

Post Fri May 14, 2021 11:46 pm

my 32bit EnergyXT2 daw along with all my 32bit plugins and 32bit WINXP
are all frozen in time. they are capable of the sounds i like in their primative 32 bit realm
for the music i make, no need to update and risk breaking my efficient system
for electronic music production that has been getting the job done trouble free for many,many years.
HW SYNTHS [KORG T2EX - AKAI AX80 - YAMAHA SY77 - ENSONIQ VFX]
HW MODULES [OBi M1000 - ROLAND MKS-50 - ROLAND JV880 - KURZ 1000PX]
SW [CHARLATAN - OBXD - OXE - ELEKTRO - MICROTERA - M1 - SURGE - RMiV]
DAW [ENERGY XT2/1U RACK WINXP / MAUDIO 1010LT PCI]

AKJ
KVRAF
1894 posts since 2 Mar, 2004

Post Sat May 15, 2021 6:03 am

it is evil because you withhold your money from developers who desperately are in need of it ;-)

Otherweise, if it works it works thus I am quite evil at times.

Return to “Instruments”