List of M1 ARM native Vsts/AU?

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
User avatar
KVRian
1055 posts since 30 Mar, 2008 from MN, USA

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:34 am

That list is entirely unreliable. Many of the plugins there are not UB2, and in some cases haven't been updated since well before the developer Minis were made available by Apple.

User avatar
KVRAF
1921 posts since 15 Mar, 2002 from Seattle, WA - USA

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:20 pm

teilo wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:06 am
I have a thread on this in the hardware forum with an extensive list, sorted by type and company. There are way more than noted above.

Tracking Apple Silicon Native Hosts, Plugins, Effects

Since it's nearly impossible for me to find these on my own, any help identifying new releases is appreciated.
I missed even more than I thought! Thanks so much for putting that together; I wish I'd known about it earlier. I'll bookmark it and contribute any more that I find along the way.

User avatar
KVRAF
6751 posts since 13 Nov, 2015 from Norway

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:59 pm

teilo wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:31 am
Halonmusic wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:34 pm
Orange.
What product specifically are you referring to? There are a few plugins that go by that name.
Nothing. 'Apples/Oranges' - this is an Apple thread. Tried to be funny but didnt work :hihi:
EnergyXT3 - Reaper | Roland SH201 - Waldorf Rocket | SoundCloud - Bandcamp

User avatar
KVRer
5 posts since 14 Jun, 2021

Post Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:40 pm

I read that FL Studio can not run in there native M1 ARM Version VST which are also not native ARM.
But I understand that native M1 Logic X can run not Native M1 ARM ready AU´s (means Intel Version) Plugins, correct?
How does it looks like for Bitwig? Can they run both version of the plugin (ARM & Intel) in there native ARM M1 DAW?

User avatar
KVRAF
3861 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:16 am

Heartleader wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:40 pm
I read that FL Studio can not run in there native M1 ARM Version VST which are also not native ARM.
But I understand that native M1 Logic X can run not Native M1 ARM ready AU´s (means Intel Version) Plugins, correct?
How does it looks like for Bitwig? Can they run both version of the plugin (ARM & Intel) in there native ARM M1 DAW?
The ones I know about anyway:
Logic can run native Arm AU's I believe it might be possible to run x86 Intel AU's as well but not sure.

Bitwig can run both native and x86 VSTs because of it's sandboxing tech.

DP can run native and some x86 AU's because of the built in Rosetta translation that happens.

Basically it seems that DP can run some x86 plug ins in it's Native version by happy accident, whereas I think they don't really want that in Logic? So Bitwig is the best bet for smooth native and x86 plug ins.

User avatar
KVRist
210 posts since 14 Jun, 2002 from Gothenburg, Sweden

Post Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:44 am

Logic in native ARM mode does run x86 Intel AU's.

User avatar
KVRian
1055 posts since 30 Mar, 2008 from MN, USA

Post Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 am

FL Studio Native can also run Intel AUs but not VSTs.

No word yet on Studio One.

User avatar
KVRer
5 posts since 14 Jun, 2021

Post Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 am

teilo wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 am
FL Studio Native can also run Intel AUs but not VSTs.

No word yet on Studio One.
That is interesting :-) AU = Apple Format and works with Intel; VST = Cubase (open) and don't work with Intel :dog:

User avatar
KVRian
1055 posts since 30 Mar, 2008 from MN, USA

Post Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:55 am

Heartleader wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 am
teilo wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 am
FL Studio Native can also run Intel AUs but not VSTs.

No word yet on Studio One.
That is interesting :-) AU = Apple Format and works with Intel; VST = Cubase (open) and don't work with Intel :dog:
It's far more complicated than you let on.

Apple wrote an AU bridge for Logic that can be used by anyone if they specifically support it. It's not automatic, but for those that used Apple's AU implementation framework, it's a fairly small change.

The VST architecture is completely different from AUs, and there is no "one bridge to rule them all" that would even work with VSTs across DAWs. Also, VST isn't an "open" standard. It's entirely controlled by Steinberg.

A bridge is two components: a plugin host running under Rosetta2 and a "server" component running native that interfaces with the DAW. The two components pass data via shared memory, sockets, or TCP/IP. That's a lot of engineering work on its own. Apple has always provided an OS-mediated hosting system, where the AU framework does the hosting, and the plugin host interfaces with the framework. Their Rosetta2 bridge is just an extension of an interface that already existed. However, most DAWs load the VST binaries directly, which is not going to work on any DAW running native. The DAW needs to be re-architected according to the above scheme to bridge architectures. Further, not all AU hosts use Apple's OS framework. Ableton for example does not. It loads the AUs directly, so they won't be able to take advantage of Apple's bridge without some major re-engineering.

FYI – Bitwig already used a system similar to what I describe above for all VST hosting, so it was trivial for them to support Intel plugins when running native. All they really had to do was launch a plugin host process via Rosetta2, and it just worked. But no one else does that, so it requires more work.

KVRAF
4979 posts since 17 Dec, 2009

Post Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:33 pm

teilo wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 am
FL Studio Native can also run Intel AUs but not VSTs.

No word yet on Studio One.
no it can't. If you run Presonus in M1 mode, only AUs show up - VSTs don''t.
If you run it in Rosetta, VSTs also show up.

And yes, AUs run via the same AUHostingCompatibilityService as Logic uses.
Image

User avatar
KVRAF
3861 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:47 pm

teilo wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:55 am
Heartleader wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 10:46 am
teilo wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 9:42 am
FL Studio Native can also run Intel AUs but not VSTs.

No word yet on Studio One.
That is interesting :-) AU = Apple Format and works with Intel; VST = Cubase (open) and don't work with Intel :dog:
It's far more complicated than you let on.

Apple wrote an AU bridge for Logic that can be used by anyone if they specifically support it. It's not automatic, but for those that used Apple's AU implementation framework, it's a fairly small change.

The VST architecture is completely different from AUs, and there is no "one bridge to rule them all" that would even work with VSTs across DAWs. Also, VST isn't an "open" standard. It's entirely controlled by Steinberg.

A bridge is two components: a plugin host running under Rosetta2 and a "server" component running native that interfaces with the DAW. The two components pass data via shared memory, sockets, or TCP/IP. That's a lot of engineering work on its own. Apple has always provided an OS-mediated hosting system, where the AU framework does the hosting, and the plugin host interfaces with the framework. Their Rosetta2 bridge is just an extension of an interface that already existed. However, most DAWs load the VST binaries directly, which is not going to work on any DAW running native. The DAW needs to be re-architected according to the above scheme to bridge architectures. Further, not all AU hosts use Apple's OS framework. Ableton for example does not. It loads the AUs directly, so they won't be able to take advantage of Apple's bridge without some major re-engineering.

FYI – Bitwig already used a system similar to what I describe above for all VST hosting, so it was trivial for them to support Intel plugins when running native. All they really had to do was launch a plugin host process via Rosetta2, and it just worked. But no one else does that, so it requires more work.
Aren't their hiccups with x86 AU via Rosetta 2 bridge hosting in M1 at this point? I hear it's somewhat random to the end user which x86 AU plug ins will load. Reports from NI are that x86 Konakt and Massive X are running in native host via the bridge but Absynth for instance is not? At least this is the story I'm hearing and why I worded it the way I did about hosting...

Side note, I appreciate the work here, I don't plan on using many Rosetta 2 plug ins when I get an Apple Silicon mac in the coming months.

User avatar
KVRAF
20416 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:37 pm

machinesworking wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:47 pm
Side note, I appreciate the work here, I don't plan on using many Rosetta 2 plug ins when I get an Apple Silicon mac in the coming months.
My plan is to make a clean break and use native plugins only.

User avatar
KVRAF
3861 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:16 pm

pdxindy wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:37 pm
machinesworking wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:47 pm
Side note, I appreciate the work here, I don't plan on using many Rosetta 2 plug ins when I get an Apple Silicon mac in the coming months.
My plan is to make a clean break and use native plugins only.
VEP 7, and Amplitube 5 will probably be the only Rosetta plug ins here. VEP is cheating though.

Clean breaks are hard when you have a dozen large orchestral libraries you just started setting up templates for it's hard to make a totally clean break. I'm actually sort of surprised Vienna Instruments aren't already Apple Silicon native? It would be a great selling point.

User avatar
KVRAF
20416 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:53 pm

machinesworking wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:16 pm
pdxindy wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:37 pm
machinesworking wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:47 pm
Side note, I appreciate the work here, I don't plan on using many Rosetta 2 plug ins when I get an Apple Silicon mac in the coming months.
My plan is to make a clean break and use native plugins only.
VEP 7, and Amplitube 5 will probably be the only Rosetta plug ins here. VEP is cheating though.

Clean breaks are hard when you have a dozen large orchestral libraries you just started setting up templates for it's hard to make a totally clean break. I'm actually sort of surprised Vienna Instruments aren't already Apple Silicon native? It would be a great selling point.
Ahhh... yeah, I don't use any sample libraries

KVRAF
4979 posts since 17 Dec, 2009

Post Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:58 am

i'm nearly there. out of my daily drivers Oeksound and Microtonic are pretty much the only non-native plugs.
Others i either retired or replaced with native equivalents
Image

Return to “Instruments”