Pianoteq 7 Electric Pianos vs Keyscape... Which one do you like the most?

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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KVRer
6 posts since 4 Sep, 2021

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:25 am

95% of the things I've read on the internet about Modartt's Pianoteq Acoustic Pianos have been totally positive. However, when it comes to electric pianos like the Rhodes, I haven't found much demos or information about it compared to Keyscape electric pianos that are quite popular and of which there are quite a few demos and reviews on Youtube. Could someone tell me about their experience using Pianoteq electric pianos? Are they good? Keyscape looks and sounds very good but at the same time the size of their library samples intimidates me compared to the Pianoteq VST which doesn't use samples and that makes the VST less heavy.

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KVRAF
7016 posts since 7 Sep, 2006 from Roseville, CA

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:40 am

I haven't used PianoTeq so I can't comment, but I bought Keyscape a few months ago and the EPs have blown me away. My other go-to for EPs is Lounge Lizard, which, like PianoTeq, doesn't have the huge library like Keyscape. There's certainly something to be said for the fast loading and RAM savings of Lounge Lizard, but I'm really loving the sound and interface of Keyscape.

One major consideration for Keyscape is whether or not you already own Omnisphere 2. If you do, adding Keyscape is a huge plus because it integrates into Omni2 and opens up many additional options for sound design/exploration.

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KVRAF
3256 posts since 28 Jan, 2011 from MEXICO

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:43 am

I like pianoteq electric pianos, but I haven't tried keyspace but the difference in price and hard drive space would make it a very tough sell for me.

For electric pianos I also like AAS Lounge lizard which is also physical modeled.
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n9n
KVRer
16 posts since 22 Sep, 2021

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 10:30 am

First: I used to own a Rhodes mkI and used it for a long time as my primary instrument. I have no experience with Wurlis or MK2s and tend to not like those sounds at all. Everyone seems to want the "barking" e-piano sound of the mk2 and the wurli getting really whacked. I don't like that. Enough said.

I love Pianoteq for acoustic pianos. It is brilliant. It's Rhodes model doesn't work for me. I've spent time trying to get it to work and I can't. To much bark, to much tine click for me.... and if you tone down these aspects of the sound you're left with sine waves, it feels like...

Keyscape is excellent. Nothing bad to say about it at all. I used it's unprocessed suitcase as my primary keyboard sound for a couple of years. I don't love the presets as I don't particularly love omnisphere fx -- too much plastic amp and cab sim for my taste. It has a wide, wide variety of EPs, too. If you have the dough you won't be sad about what you get.

Surprisingly (to me, at least) the Arturia Stage 73 in my absolute favorite. I like the unprocessed classic A/mkI sound very much, and use it DI into channel strips or Softube Amp Room. It is gorgeous and it feels very real to me with my weighted controller: I lose myself in the setup and it feels like I'm playing my old rhodes.

KVRAF
6463 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:18 pm

Pianoteq

It fills the bill in either a mix or solo. For playability and system efficiency, modelers are the better instrument IMO.
Last edited by BBFG# on Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

KVRist
122 posts since 24 Feb, 2004

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:47 pm

It's been many years since I've had anything to compare against, but I own Velvet 2 from AirMusic. It has a broad variety of processed and unprocessed sounds. The samples are not so recent and may not stand up to a deeply sampled library, but it's easy to use and covers all the Rhodes sounds I've ever heard of. It even has an acoustic mode (microphones) for the Pianette. AirMusic stuff is always on sale. Guido's Mr. Ray code still sounds pretty good to me and I use that as my default sound source. I plan to get the Pianoteq electrics because tweaking all the parameters could be fun.

KVRist
122 posts since 24 Feb, 2004

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:49 pm

I own and don't use Lounge Lizard. I should give it another try. For some reason the AAS products never actually satisfy me, although it seems like they should. I should spend more time with ObjecDelay because it seems you get to play more with the modeling there.

n9n
KVRer
16 posts since 22 Sep, 2021

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:05 pm

Upon reflection: All of these are going to work better and performances on them will sound better with a weighted controller. That is the thing that makes the most difference in my experience with EP and acoustic piano VSTs.

KVRAF
8877 posts since 16 Aug, 2006

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:21 pm

Keyscape is excellent and you get a whole lot. IMO the best libraries out there for Wurlitzer and Rhodes are VReeds and VTines by Acoustic Samples. Both are excellent and offer a ton of tweakability. And they load fast due to the combination of physical modeling and sampling. I've got a Rhodes Mk 1 and a Wurlitzer 200 here, and the Acoustic Samples products sound very authentic to me.

Sorry I can't comment on Pianoteq for Rhodes. But Keyscape is great, and so are those Acoustic Samples library.

Regarding a weighted controller: please remember, the Rhodes action was garbage. I'm thinking about driving over to Vintage Vibe (which is thankfully only 30 minutes away) to get the Miracle Mod performed on my Rhodes at some point, but I'm not a fast of a player anyway so it's not a priority. My keys skills are mediocre at best. The Wurlitzer has much better action, but it's not as heavy as a weighted controller either. The key is to just get a controller with a good velocity response on both the white and black keys, doesn't necessarily need to be a weighted keyboard IMO (it's all personal preference anyway) but too many keybeds today just awful velocity responses on the black keys. I had an old Roland A-30 MIDI Controller and it wasn't piano weighted but had a lovely feel and response. Meanwhile the keyboard on my System-8, which I use as a controller today, is a huge step down from that old cheap Roland controller.

n9n
KVRer
16 posts since 22 Sep, 2021

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:22 pm

I just fussed around with Pianoteq's Rhodes for a while. I'll tell you what: it sounds a lot better than I thought when I spend the time to tune it up... but those presets are (imo) Not Good. I'm not sure what the obsession is with tine noise between all these products. Does anyone like that to be really audible?

KVRian
529 posts since 22 Dec, 2010

Post Wed Sep 22, 2021 10:41 pm

Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:21 pm
Keyscape is excellent and you get a whole lot. IMO the best libraries out there for Wurlitzer and Rhodes are VReeds and VTines by Acoustic Samples. Both are excellent and offer a ton of tweakability. And they load fast due to the combination of physical modeling and sampling. I've got a Rhodes Mk 1 and a Wurlitzer 200 here, and the Acoustic Samples products sound very authentic to me.

Sorry I can't comment on Pianoteq for Rhodes. But Keyscape is great, and so are those Acoustic Samples library.

Regarding a weighted controller: please remember, the Rhodes action was garbage. I'm thinking about driving over to Vintage Vibe (which is thankfully only 30 minutes away) to get the Miracle Mod performed on my Rhodes at some point, but I'm not a fast of a player anyway so it's not a priority. My keys skills are mediocre at best. The Wurlitzer has much better action, but it's not as heavy as a weighted controller either. The key is to just get a controller with a good velocity response on both the white and black keys, doesn't necessarily need to be a weighted keyboard IMO (it's all personal preference anyway) but too many keybeds today just awful velocity responses on the black keys. I had an old Roland A-30 MIDI Controller and it wasn't piano weighted but had a lovely feel and response. Meanwhile the keyboard on my System-8, which I use as a controller today, is a huge step down from that old cheap Roland controller.
This. I forgot to say thanks for reccommending VTines a couple of months ago in the other thread. It is really great, and a big step up compared to Pianoteq's EP.
https://www.acousticsamples.net/vtines

Banned
396 posts since 13 Jul, 2021

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 8:20 pm

Depends what your needs are. I own Keyscape but have demoed Pianoteq. The tweak ability with the latter is significant over the former. The former though is more versatile than the latter. If you are in the Spectrasonics ecosystem like myself then Keyscape makes more sense. If not or perhaps you are on Linux then Pianoteq makes more sense. I have a love hate relationship with Keyscape and honestly out of the three Spectrasonics products I own I don’t think it’s as substantial then again it is the youngest product. I need more acoustic piano and more tweak ability.

n9n
KVRer
16 posts since 22 Sep, 2021

Post Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:42 pm

Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:21 pm
Keyscape is excellent and you get a whole lot. IMO the best libraries out there for Wurlitzer and Rhodes are VReeds and VTines by Acoustic Samples. Both are excellent and offer a ton of tweakability. And they load fast due to the combination of physical modeling and sampling. I've got a Rhodes Mk 1 and a Wurlitzer 200 here, and the Acoustic Samples products sound very authentic to me.

Sorry I can't comment on Pianoteq for Rhodes. But Keyscape is great, and so are those Acoustic Samples library.

Regarding a weighted controller: please remember, the Rhodes action was garbage. I'm thinking about driving over to Vintage Vibe (which is thankfully only 30 minutes away) to get the Miracle Mod performed on my Rhodes at some point, but I'm not a fast of a player anyway so it's not a priority. My keys skills are mediocre at best. The Wurlitzer has much better action, but it's not as heavy as a weighted controller either. The key is to just get a controller with a good velocity response on both the white and black keys, doesn't necessarily need to be a weighted keyboard IMO (it's all personal preference anyway) but too many keybeds today just awful velocity responses on the black keys. I had an old Roland A-30 MIDI Controller and it wasn't piano weighted but had a lovely feel and response. Meanwhile the keyboard on my System-8, which I use as a controller today, is a huge step down from that old cheap Roland controller.

Damn, Funky— VTines is amazing. Much thanks for the pointer! This is my new favorite thing!

KVRAF
8877 posts since 16 Aug, 2006

Post Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:43 pm

n9n wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:42 pm
Damn, Funky— VTines is amazing. Much thanks for the pointer! This is my new favorite thing!
Large elements of KVR can be very dismissive of anything iLok, which is why I believe it doesn't get talked about more. Glad I could help turn someone on to it!

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KVRian
964 posts since 2 Sep, 2019

Post Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:56 pm

One thing I've found is layering 2 different models together can get a really good result that sounds better and has more depth than either do on their own. I've done this with good results using Pianoteq and Arturia together for both the electric piano and the clavinet. The two instruments just blend into one. It's similar to using two mics to get a fuller sound. And you can do it using the standalone versions, not just in a DAW.
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